Deus Ex 3 (PC)

[eastmen]

I forgot about the MMO storage space issue and the constant patching aspect for some reason. I'm pretty sure that trying to stream one of those games off an optical disk would be a serious challenge to overcome. Optical disks are obsolete, consoles just haven't figured that out yet. PC games almost entirely stopped trying to stream off optical disks before this decade started lol.

I think the next consoles will probably have >500GB HDDs so that problem will be gone. And you can probably bet on 4GB of RAM in a unified pool or some such. Maybe 2GB if they are feeling particularly cheap.

Next gen perhaps will work for the current mmorpgs ( 2005-20011) But look at SW The old republic . Its going to be fully voiced. The game is going ot be massive. I cna't see it being smaller than 30 gigs on your hardrive. Move foward and the games will just get bigger esp with 2TB hardrives being sub $150 these days. I think AOC is already over 20 gigs

Then if they go an eq2 route not only will you have almost yearly expansions but then you will have DLC expansions also.

I'm not sure how that would work on any console.


Even SW TOR is being held back by dx 9 hardware which is now what 7 years old. once the games move to dx 10/11 or even strait to 11 there will be another drastic increase in game size and the worlds. consoles are static and while 2012 consoles may be great for 2009 mmorpgs can you say the same for a mmorpg that comes out in 2014 ?

Aion's the exception (and it targets the high-end consoles can't reach), but we don't know what sort of longevity it will have. The 500-pound gorilla in this arena is very primitive-looking and tries to make up for it with art design. I'm not saying FFXI is a great-looking game, but that if they want to target consoles, they will target consoles. Limited memory isn't going to be the issue, the issue is that MMOs thrive on all those computers B3Ders wouldn't use as a doorstop.

Like I said , wow is also 5 years old now. Back in the day it still took decent computers to run it (anand has benches of the x 800xt pe top dog at the time)

Limited memory is a huge problem. Why do you think Age of conan and champions online limited the players in a zone and shard. Its not because their servers can only handle 50 or 100 players

 

[obonicus]

Like I said , wow is also 5 years old now. Back in the day it still took decent computers to run it (anand has benches of the x 800xt pe top dog at the time)

Even when it was released WoW wasn't a resource hog compared to games of the time. It always looked a little primitive. Blizzard doesn't make games that target high-end computers, they're not stupid. The market of the non-afficionado is gigantic. B3D is clearly not part of it, though.

 

[green.pixel]

I think this says it all about WoW's visuals.

It's about exploring what must surely be the greatest gameworld ever created, an impossibly rich, vibrant, varied universe stuffed with beauty, soul, high drama and low humour. It's about drinking in the spectacle and the detail - although technically undemanding, WOW is still one of the best-looking games on PC and far more visually exciting than most other MMOs (thanks to the Blizzard's world-beating art staff, who could imbue four polygons with more personality than the entirety of some lesser online worlds).

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/world-of-warcraft-re-review?page=3

consoles are static and while 2012 consoles may be great for 2009 mmorpgs can you say the same for a mmorpg that comes out in 2014 ?

Like obonicus said, MMO developers don't target high-end rigs.

 

[swaaye]

How depressing. Of course, to each his own.

I've been thinking about how TOR looks like the old KOTOR games. I just played through KOTOR2 last week actually. The problem with a new game looking a lot like those games is that I saw the graphics in the old games as a result of technological limitations combined with a desire to depict a realistic universe. I wasn't thinking "comic book" and I didn't see the look as an intentional "style" really.

If we ever get a new Jedi Knight game it had better not be comic book art.

 

[Frank]

Don't worry, if DX3 fails to deliver, there's always Alpha Protocol. And if they're both great, we have two games that are worthy Deus Ex successors next year!

 

[green.pixel]

How depressing.

Sorry, what exactly?

 

[swaaye]

Sorry, what exactly?

WoW's imagery doesn't exactly bring me to my knees, awestruck and emotionally overwhelmed to the point of extreme catatonic drooling, unlike what it sounds like it does for that writer. The message I wanted to peacefully convey was that the cartoony movement isn't for me.

I actually think that Guild Wars is prettier (for a MMO-ish game).

Don't worry, if DX3 fails to deliver, there's always Alpha Protocol. And if they're both great, we have two games that are worthy Deus Ex successors next year!

Hope so.

 

[green.pixel]

WoW's imagery doesn't exactly bring me to my knees, awestruck and emotionally overwhelmed to the point of extreme catatonic drooling, unlike what it sounds like it does for that writer.

Yes, he does sound over-the-top excited , but the art direction surely doesn't dissapoint. Of course, it's normal that there are people who don't fancy some game's design .

Just curios though, do you like WC3's visual style?

 

[eastmen]

I think this says it all about WoW's visuals.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/world-of-warcraft-re-review?page=3

yet fast cards were still needed to play it. You could reduce down to dx 8 mode and the lowest of settings but to get the most out of the game you needed a fast athlon fx 54 with a x850xt which in march of 2004 was a very expensive system

Like obonicus said, MMO developers don't target high-end rigs.

I just think that developers are better at creating engines that can scale well.

I also think that since dx 9 was around so long and wasn't replaced until vista came out iwth dx 10 its hard for them to move foward. If dx 10 came a year or two earlier in xp and vista things would be much diffrent or if a console was dx 10.

I do't think your going to see true next gen mmorpgs until they move foward with the hardware side and now with dx 11 they can do it .

 

[obonicus]

There might be DX 11 MMOs, but no one's going to make one DX11 exclusively for the foreseeable future. I mean, Aion's a good-looking MMO as far as they go, and it's running on CryEngine 1.

And whether people could get the 'most' out of WoW is exactly the point. Most people don't, but they play the games nonetheless, at quality levels that'd give a lot of folks here aneurysms.

 

[green.pixel]

yet fast cards were still needed to play it. You could reduce down to dx 8 mode and the lowest of settings but to get the most out of the game you needed a fast athlon fx 54 with a x850xt which in march of 2004 was a very expensive system

March 2004? X850XT wasn't out at that time . PCIe model came out in december 2004, and AGP in march 2005.
http://www.beyond3d.com/resources/board/192
http://www.beyond3d.com/resources/board/246
I suppose you meant X800XT and FX-55, but that's just details.


And the FX line? Not even a hardcorest of the gaming & hardware geek crowd who knows something about HW would pay 1k$ for a CPU ; they would just buy a fast "regular" model and overclock the hell out if it. In the days when WoW launched in the US (nov. 2004), A64 just started hitting mainstream with Manchester and NF4 platform. Also, AGP platforms were still popular due to Preshot thingy , and offered great bang for the $, so there wasn't the need for the majority of people to upgrade.

But yes, like with almost every other game, if you wanted to trully max it out, you had to have a very good PC. You also have to consider that WoW is a competitive game, where smooth fps matters more than bling. When you hit masive raids, fps wil definitely suffer if you don't have fast enough machine, and then you have to dial back some settings.
But that didn't stop millions of players from subscribing and I'm sure that big % of them didn't have A64 and 6800/X850 rigs . And that's the whole point - graphics don't matter much to people playing MMOs. If ti did, all MMO developers would go bankupt, because players would demand Crysis level visuals.

I just think that developers are better at creating engines that can scale well.

You mean developers in general or just MMO?

I do't think your going to see true next gen mmorpgs until they move foward with the hardware side and now with dx 11 they can do it .

It won't matter much if MMO players don't go down the same road with their hardware upgrades.

 

[Mobius1aic]

I think this says it all about WoW's visuals.



http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/world-of-warcraft-re-review?page=3



Like obonicus said, MMO developers don't target high-end rigs.

^This post

I played WoW for two months back in 2006. While I greatly enjoyed it, I didn't get hooked like so many others do. Much of my motivating factor for playing was the exploration element, and to do that I had to of course burden myself with combat and gaining experience in order to handle higher and higher leveled monsters. The art style and exploration drew me in but battles and quest management got boring and annoying. I was just unwilling to bore myself with endless monotonous battle and $15 bucks a month just to explore :smile: So yes, I agree with the fact that WoW is nicely designed on the artistic front, and I remember my first semester of college in Fall 2005 seeing students playing WoW on what looked to be rather cheap notebooks in the student center lounge. It's kind of amazing how a game can be ran across such a wide range of systems. For me STALKER is the most interesting in this regard. Even STALKER Call of Pripiyat still has the same basic requirements as Shadow of Chernobyl.

 

[green.pixel]

I played WoW for two months back in 2006. While I greatly enjoyed it, I didn't get hooked like so many others do. Much of my motivating factor for playing was the exploration element, and to do that I had to of course burden myself with combat and gaining experience in order to handle higher and higher leveled monsters.

Almost the same with me . I had to break due to lack of time.

I wished that there is a some kind of mod/special version of the game in which you could just walk/run and explore to enjoy the enviroments without the need to level up to enter new zones.

 

[Mobius1aic]

Almost the same with me . I had to break due to lack of time.

I wished that there is a some kind of mod/special version of the game in which you could just walk/run and explore to enjoy the enviroments without the need to level up to enter new zones.

The combat was initially satisfying and fun, but once I realized I just like exploring, it truly became a burden. I just didn't get the addiction of improving my stats as I went, especially when it could take so long just to do so.

 

[eastmen]

March 2004? X850XT wasn't out at that time . PCIe model came out in december 2004, and AGP in march 2005.
http://www.beyond3d.com/resources/board/192
http://www.beyond3d.com/resources/board/246
I suppose you meant X800XT and FX-55, but that's just details.

March 2005 i meant


http://anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2381

And the FX line? Not even a hardcorest of the gaming & hardware geek crowd who knows something about HW would pay 1k$ for a CPU ; they would just buy a fast "regular" model and overclock the hell out if it. In the days when WoW launched in the US (nov. 2004), A64 just started hitting mainstream with Manchester and NF4 platform. Also, AGP platforms were still popular due to Preshot thingy , and offered great bang for the $, so there wasn't the need for the majority of people to upgrade.

Of course but that is the level of hardware you'd need to get the frames anand was getting. he didn't overclock his stuff for testing

But yes, like with almost every other game, if you wanted to trully max it out, you had to have a very good PC. You also have to consider that WoW is a competitive game, where smooth fps matters more than bling. When you hit masive raids, fps wil definitely suffer if you don't have fast enough machine, and then you have to dial back some settings.

of course . But this is true of all mmorpgs dating back to the realm and is true of course for all other types of games in regards to hardware. If you have weaker hardware some parts of the game may require tweaked settings.

But that didn't stop millions of players from subscribing and I'm sure that big % of them didn't have A64 and 6800/X850 rigs . And that's the whole point - graphics don't matter much to people playing MMOs. If ti did, all MMO developers would go bankupt, because players would demand Crysis level visuals.

Graphics matter to a certian amount of people. Do you think wow would be doing as well as it is if it was left with just the dx 8 path ? Do you think wow would still be popular if they didn't keep increasing the graphics (however slightly ) with each expnasion ?

You mean developers in general or just MMO?

I'm talking mainly mmo , it really has diffrent challanges

It won't matter much if MMO players don't go down the same road with their hardware upgrades.

Mmo players do go through upgrades , its just a longer cycle than hardcore gamers . Do you really think those playing wow with old laptops when it came out are still using the same hardware ?

 

[obonicus]

You're missing the point. If playing WoW on max required a $3000 rig, then practically one played it on max. People still played it with computers that were not awesome for the time. I remember my cousin playing it in 2005 or 2006 on some crummy macbook with 512 RAM. Yeah, he couldn't really do anything in Ironforge or Orgrimmar, but he could still grind the single-player content, which is what most people do.

 

[green.pixel]

Do you think wow would be doing as well as it is if it was left with just the dx 8 path ? Do you think wow would still be popular if they didn't keep increasing the graphics (however slightly ) with each expnasion ?

I think it would be doing quite well.
Even on lowish settings, it still look decent.

Mmo players do go through upgrades , its just a longer cycle than hardcore gamers.

Yes, I agree.

Do you really think those playing wow with old laptops when it came out are still using the same hardware ?

No, but they probably upgraded to something low-mid end, that's still much faster than what they had before. Majority of them sure didn't take the high-end path.

 

[eastmen]

I think it would be doing quite well.
Even on lowish settings, it still look decent.

Even on low in dx 8 mode ? I got it running for my friend in this mode with his netbook. Game looks right out of 1999 . Really bad looking. The only reason he plays it at that setting is so he can grind while on vacation or traveling for work

Yes, I agree.

Why thanks

No, but they probably upgraded to something low-mid end, that's still much faster than what they had before. Majority of them sure didn't take the high-end path.

Of course. But lets say at vista launch in 2007. The hardware of the time was much better than Nov 2004 hardware. Even if your buying low-mid end. Its still leagues better than what was avalible in the same class in 2004.

People follow similar upgrade time frames. If they buy every 4 years and bought at wow launch , they would now in year 5 of wow be in year 1 of their second laptop since wow. In year 8 of wow which is 2012 they will be in their third laptop. 2012 dx 11 hardware will be at every segment of the market with someo f it being dx 12 hardware (if it comes out in 2012ish). quad core cpus will be standard even in low end laptops (netbooks still dual core) and I'm sure we would have moved to 8 gigs as standard with new laptops (3-4 gigs is pretty much standard now).

How well will next gen console hardware fair with that ? Well considering its most likely sold at a loss your looking at something more powerfull. But the pc doesn't stop evolving and while we have to wait 5-6 years for another cosnole after that (2017-2018) that wow player will have upgraded in 2016.

But you have wow players on so many diffrent upgrade scheduals and they can change at anytime . new job ? treat yourself to a laptop . 2 year old laptop dies and isn't under warrenty ? new laptop

So a mmorpg can increase its system requirements for new content at any point. If they tie it to a console they are stuck with those graphics and any limitaitons they might impose (creating zones and what not)

 

[Silent_Buddha]

Do you really think those playing wow with old laptops when it came out are still using the same hardware ?

Some do. I know a few that only play WoW and some popcap type stuff. And been using the exact same computer as when WoW came out. Not even bothering to upgrade memory or HD.

Heck I knew one girl in Warhammer Online that was playing it on a notebook that came out in 2006. But it was chunky as hell. Still she enjoyed it, so who am I to rain on her fun?

Likewise, things like 7600 series and 8600 series video cards are pretty common even when playing the latest and greatest MMOs.

Eve Online only this year made it a requirement to have a Dx9 class video card. Prior to that they supported Dx8 class video cards. And with that move they lost some members that had been playing the game since launch.

Regards,
SB

 

[eastmen]

2006 hardware seems about right for a 2008 game (that was 2008 for war right ?) . Thats a two year spread. The question is if she will still have that laptop in 2010 which will be 4 years from her date of purchase.

Minimum specs allways increase with recommended specs increasing in each game as it progresses.