Current level of innovation in games

[Tagrineth]

Still waiting for the first FPS where the body is visible!

Tribes 2.

 

[Grall]

Never played that one.

Don't think there was a very strong connection between player and his on-screen alter ego in that title, as I remember, it was mostly geared towards online gameplay... London-Boy has a good point there I think. Many games lack this.

It's silly when games put so much effort into modelling the weapon and arm holding it, and then not putting a body there holding it up. This includes games like Half-Life, Wolfenstein 3D and Metroid Prime.

*G*

 

[Tagrineth]

By the way, I think one big problem 'innovation' has today is that most of the things you could do with a game have been done to varying levels of success.

 

[Bohdy]

This thread is about innovation not graphics. The two are not the same.

I may be new, but I am aware of that. I was referring to gameplay footage I have seen.

How is the *game* innovative? I am genuinely interested.

 

[P4-Fan]

What about computer player AI? I'd say we are seeing progressively more sophisticated strategy and tactics.

 

[jvd]

This thread is about innovation not graphics. The two are not the same.

I may be new, but I am aware of that. I was referring to gameplay footage I have seen.

How is the *game* innovative? I am genuinely interested.

Read my post fully dude.

I have yet to play ninja gaiden so i can't comment on what innovations there are in the game play but I'm sure sonic knows whats in the game otherwise he wouldn't have mentioned it .

Now you said

Funny, I was just thinking how generic Ninja Gaiden looked..

Please enlighten me to your perceptions of it, as there is probably more to it that I missed from my (addmitedly brief) look at it.

You said looks generic . Which to me implys graphics. If that is not what you mean I am sorry but your whole post makes it sound like graphics. You have how generic it looked , your addmitedly brief look at it which to me means you only looked at the graphics or played the intro lvl for a few mins.

 

[jvd]

By the way, I think one big problem 'innovation' has today is that most of the things you could do with a game have been done to varying levels of success.

I don't agree. There are still the few movies that come out that are innovated. So in video games which have been around half the time that movies have been around still have alot of innovation left. The problem is one idea sells well and then thats all that is made. Gta3 is a shallow game. Yet it sold well. Now we will be dealing with clones of the game. Like when tomb radier came out. Same thing again. Of course we could have the problem thats happening in movies that we have here. A movie that takes from movies before it and the people thinking its innovated .

 

[zurich]

You have how generic it looked , your addmitedly brief look at it which to me means you only looked at the graphics or played the intro lvl for a few mins.

There's a demo for Ninja Gaiden?

 

[jvd]

You have how generic it looked , your addmitedly brief look at it which to me means you only looked at the graphics or played the intro lvl for a few mins.

There's a demo for Ninja Gaiden?

I believe it was playable at e3 . I could be wrong though. But I was trying to give him the benifit of me not knowing for sure. Otherwise his comment was just based on graphics.

 

[notAFanB]

You have how generic it looked , your addmitedly brief look at it which to me means you only looked at the graphics or played the intro lvl for a few mins.

There's a demo for Ninja Gaiden?

I believe it was playable at e3 . I could be wrong though. But I was trying to give him the benifit of me not knowing for sure. Otherwise his comment was just based on graphics.

I'm sure he meant play mechanics which he michgt have exaploated form previouse titles and shots.

 

[Bohdy]

I'm sure he meant play mechanics which he michgt have exaploated form previouse titles and shots.

Well gameplay footage to be specific, but at least someone knows what I mean!

Benefit of the doubt (please). I know this is a graphics site, but "look" can mean other things... :?

 

[jvd]

I'm sure he meant play mechanics which he michgt have exaploated form previouse titles and shots.

Well gameplay footage to be specific, but at least someone knows what I mean!

Benefit of the doubt (please). I know this is a graphics site, but "look" can mean other things... :?

well dude i really don't nkow how u can make a judgement on if a game is inovated by only watching a video. Inovation could be in the control set up or heck you may have only seen a training lvl or the first lvl in the game and don't have a clue what comes later. Thats why i try not to judge games buy videos . I wait till i play a lvl or two of the game.

 

[Bohdy]

I find that I can make a farly good (at least preliminary) judgement of a game based on gameplay video.
Of course, you are right, you do have to play it to get make a final judgement though.

That is why I was asking Sonic what he found innovative about it. I was looking to correct my judgement if there was cause.

Clear enough? No more misunderstandings?

 

[Tagrineth]

I don't agree. There are still the few movies that come out that are innovated. So in video games which have been around half the time that movies have been around still have alot of innovation left. The problem is one idea sells well and then thats all that is made. Gta3 is a shallow game. Yet it sold well. Now we will be dealing with clones of the game. Like when tomb radier came out. Same thing again. Of course we could have the problem thats happening in movies that we have here. A movie that takes from movies before it and the people thinking its innovated .

The catch with movies is that their innovation comes in the form of story, for the most part. Stories can have infinite permutations (look in a local Books-A-Million or Barnes & Noble or similar store - try counting the books. I dare you all.)... whereas play mechanics do not. There can be more and more gimmicks, sure, but eventually we'll run out of general mechanics, barring incredibly surreal worlds.

 

[jvd]

I find that I can make a farly good (at least preliminary) judgement of a game based on gameplay video.
Of course, you are right, you do have to play it to get make a final judgement though.

That is why I was asking Sonic what he found innovative about it. I was looking to correct my judgement if there was cause.

Clear enough? No more misunderstandings?

Clear enough now. Oh no tag replied to me haha

 

[jvd]

I don't agree. There are still the few movies that come out that are innovated. So in video games which have been around half the time that movies have been around still have alot of innovation left. The problem is one idea sells well and then thats all that is made. Gta3 is a shallow game. Yet it sold well. Now we will be dealing with clones of the game. Like when tomb radier came out. Same thing again. Of course we could have the problem thats happening in movies that we have here. A movie that takes from movies before it and the people thinking its innovated .

The catch with movies is that their innovation comes in the form of story, for the most part. Stories can have infinite permutations (look in a local Books-A-Million or Barnes & Noble or similar store - try counting the books. I dare you all.)... whereas play mechanics do not. There can be more and more gimmicks, sure, but eventually we'll run out of general mechanics, barring incredibly surreal worlds.

But with the games it will move to the story. Just like now movies are being pushed with special effects and a bad movie (2fast) can make a ton of money even with a bad story. ITs whats happening in games. A flashy game can make good money and spawn clones of it with just good graphics. Soon both movies and games will move back to story as it was in the begining. Then something else will come about to drive both movies and games .

 

[Simon F]

Still waiting for the first FPS where the body is visible!

No good. Sad adolescent guys would pick a female character and then spend the entire time staring down their own cleavage.

 

[Yogi]

They are not current but very good games which are very unique in their own genre which i think defines innovation.

Arcade:
Street Fighter 2

NES:
Captain Tsubasa
Mario Bros.

SNES:
Yu Yu Hakusho

Genesis:
Herzog Zwei

PC:
Doom(I think so or was it Castle Wolfenstien)

 

[jvd]

Still waiting for the first FPS where the body is visible!

No good. Sad adolescent guys would pick a female character and then spend the entire time staring down their own cleavage.

Is this based on personal experiance simon

 

[JacksBleedingEyes]

I'm gonna go drag up Metroid Prime here again. It is the FIRST FPS (to my knowledge) that really makes the player feel like they're inside the head of the character, and not just a floating gun-camera with ammo and health counters in the corners of the visual field.

That HUD is a real masterpiece of game design! I have to admit that sure, there are other games with a HUD, but none of them have one that is slightly decoupled from the movement of the head like in Metroid Prime. None of them has the reflection of the player's face in it, or the static that appears when certain enemies jam the suit's electronics etc. Those little details make all the difference.

Now, if only we could see Samus's body when we look down... Still waiting for the first FPS where the body is visible! That's the final step in FPS evolution I think, apart from like full-immersion bodysuits and such, hehe.

*G*

try trespasser u f*cking noob

and in case u didnt know what trespasser is

Its an FPS, came out in 1999
funded by speilberg and one of the dudes that developed the XBox.
and it failed miserably
and the main character was a chick
your health was displayed on a tatoo on her left breast