Current Generation Hardware Speculation with a Technical Spin [post GDC 2020] [XBSX, PS5]

[Deleted member 13524]

In the April 2019 Wired interview Cerny does mention PS5 will support 8K output but he does not mention framerates, 120hz or even HDMI.

And maybe in some games 8K does make sense.
For example, let's assume the PS5 can run Superhot VR with an internal resolution of 8K with 120FPS. That could actually make sense.

 

[London Geezer]

And maybe in some games 8K does make sense.
For example, let's assume the PS5 can run Superhot VR with an internal resolution of 8K with 120FPS. That could actually make sense.

That's a whole lotta pixels per second. Wait let me try to calculate that... 4 GIGAPIXELS PER SECOND.

 

[Scott_Arm]

Like any other gen, devs will be free to make their games target whatever resolution or frame time they want. That said, 30 fps is a pile of shit.

 

[Deleted member 13524]

That's a whole lotta pixels per second. Wait let me try to calculate that... 4 GIGAPIXELS PER SECOND.

It's okay, 4 GPixels/s could theoretically be done by the PS3, X360 or Wii U.
Assuming the GPU could render Superhot in one pass. Which it most probably couldn't.

Regardless, the PS5 should have a pixel fillrate of 135-140 GPixels/s so I think it'll be fine in that department.

Like any other gen, devs will be free to make their games target whatever resolution or frame time they want. That said, 30 fps is a pile of shit.

Are you saying Horizon: Zero Dawn, God of War 2018 and Uncharted 4 shouldn't have existed this gen?

 

[Inuhanyou]

Like any other gen, devs will be free to make their games target whatever resolution or frame time they want. That said, 30 fps is a pile of shit.

Wrong wrong wrong. I want solid fps not artbitrary targets. I also want devs to push hardware according to what they want to prioritize, again not arbitrary targets. A nioh esque game targeting high fps is gonna be insane...and the devs targeting 60 fps this gen but dont quite make it like santa monica or dice are gonna also be happy. But those devs who target 30 are gonna have some headroom to push fidelity and scale/scope of games forward

 

[Rootax]

That's a whole lotta pixels per second. Wait let me try to calculate that... 4 GIGAPIXELS PER SECOND.

Multiple GigaPixel GP-1 (old timer will remember...) gpu confirmed as secret sauce for PS5 then I guess ! Tiling is back !

 

[chris1515]

Wrong wrong wrong. I want solid fps not artbitrary targets. I also want devs to push hardware according to what they want to prioritize, again not arbitrary targets. A nioh esque game targeting high fps is gonna be insane...and the devs targeting 60 fps this gen but dont quite make it like santa monica or dice are gonna also be happy. But those devs who target 30 are gonna have some headroom to push fidelity and scale/scope of games forward

https://wccftech.com/ubisoft-confirms-assassins-creed-valhalla-running-at-4k30-on-xbox-series-x/

I think big open world will be 4k(or 4k reconstructed) 30 fps this is AC Valhalla on Xbox Series X.

 

[Scott_Arm]

Wrong wrong wrong. I want solid fps not artbitrary targets. I also want devs to push hardware according to what they want to prioritize, again not arbitrary targets. A nioh esque game targeting high fps is gonna be insane...and the devs targeting 60 fps this gen but dont quite make it like santa monica or dice are gonna also be happy. But those devs who target 30 are gonna have some headroom to push fidelity and scale/scope of games forward

30fps gives headroom for a lot of things at the expense of input lag, MPRT/Motion Blur (image quality), judder. I would be very happy if I never played a 30fps game again, no matter what the trade-offs are. I'll be upgrading my pc.

 

[PSman1700]

30fps gives headroom for a lot of things at the expense of input lag, MPRT/Motion Blur (image quality), judder. I would be very happy if I never played a 30fps game again, no matter what the trade-offs are. I'll be upgrading my pc.

The majority doesn't want 30fps anymore, it's enough, so i'm sure we will see more 60fps games then for current generation of consoles. With the hardware we get, it is basically 2020 mid end pc hardware, a boost in graphic fidelity over current gen on top of higher framerates should be possible.
Crazy enough, the 6th generation of consoles where mostly 60fps i remember right, the PS2 was mostly doing 60fps for it's exclusives, and these games didn't look bad compared to the generation prior that. MGS2 had killer graphics, so did other exclusives pushing graphics, atleast the majority of them (lets not talk SotC then ). Even late-gen games with amazing graphics (transformers) pushed 60fps envelope. Dunno what happened, but somewhere after that, atleast for current generation, basically everything is 30fps (with all the blur and whatnot) when talking exclusives that push graphics, even the ratched remaster, where it's original was 60.
Yes there has always been that game that pushes to the extremes in graphics, with low framerates, that will always happen, and that's good, but the majority of the games could be a playable 60 again. It doesn't have to be 4k, something 1800p and upscaled to 4k and it wouldn't be so much worse then native. It's really too bad that DLSS2 isn't there, 60fps would be doable then.

Edit: so far, aren't all next gen exclusives claiming to be 4k60? See quantum error for ps5, and the xbox games.

 

[dobwal]

I think we r going to end up with different settings for most big name games. Performance at 60fps, quality at 30fps and if your TV supports it, a middle ground with VRR (basically a non standard framerate).

However, I don't know how the gen will play out as standard frame rates may decline over the gen. 60fps will be rather easy early on as cross gen and dependency on older engines will still be a prominent part of development. However, as older platforms die off and newer engines come online we may see an increase of 30fps based games or framerates less than 60 with VRR on.

 

[Scott_Arm]

...
Are you saying Horizon: Zero Dawn, God of War 2018 and Uncharted 4 shouldn't have existed this gen?

Personally, I'd accept any compromises they'd have to make for them to be 60fps games. Obviously that's subjective, but I basically avoid anything that's 30fps. 30fps makes for great screenshots and poor gameplay. It looks bad in motion, and it's not the best option for responsive controls. Typically I'd lower graphics to get consistent 120fps where possible on the PC, even if it means low options. 60fps is kind of the minimum I'll go if I want to play things on more ultra-type settings. Obviously I'm not going to say a game shouldn't exist if it's 30fps, but at that point it's prioritizing cutscenes and slow scenic segments over fast or responsive gameplay.

 

[Scott_Arm]

I think we r going to end up with different settings for most big name games. Performance at 60fps, quality at 30fps and if your TV supports it, a middle ground with VRR (basically a non standard framerate).

However, I don't know how the gen will play out as standard frame rates may decline over the gen. 60fps will be rather easy early on as cross gen and dependency on older engines will still be a prominent part of development. However, as older platforms die off and newer engines come online we may see an increase of 30fps based games or framerates less than 60 with VRR on.

I hope so. I'll take 1080p60 over 1440p30-4k30 as long as the AA solution is clean. TAA and in-game motion blur are another issue.

 

[PSman1700]

Obviously I'm not going to say a game shouldn't exist if it's 30fps, but at that point it's prioritizing cutscenes and slow scenic segments over fast or responsive gameplay.

It was good they existed this generation atleast, since the pc versions can be higher fps for those that want to (with no lowered settings):

 

[Inuhanyou]

In a closed box system with rt and people already crying about games not seeming next gen enough your settint yourself up for disappointment expecting 60fps as standard on console just saying.

Its been the same convo every gen for the last 20 years and the result is always the same.

If you want to set your own fps and res buy a pc as is customary

 

[Riddlewire]

I completely blame the television manufacturers for all of this. They need to keep selling new TVs, so they keep increasing resolution endlessly.

640 x 480 ought to be enough for anybody.

 

[Scott_Arm]

In a closed box system with rt and people already crying about games not seeming next gen enough your settint yourself up for disappointment expecting 60fps as standard on console just saying.

Its been the same convo every gen for the last 20 years and the result is always the same.

If you want to set your own fps and res buy a pc as is customary

I’ve never said 60 FPS should be a standard. I just think 30 FPS sucks. And I do have a pc for that reason and several others.

 

[Inuhanyou]

I’ve never said 60 FPS should be a standard. I just think 30 FPS sucks. And I do have a pc for that reason and several others.

And you are objectively wrong subjectively your welcome to that view though.

Be aware that im not saying there are not certain genres were 30fps does suck like fighters sim racers and others...im mostly saying that 30fps games as we know them are fine when actually optimized properly for the games they are put into.

Im not going to play nioh in the 30fps mode cause its implentation is garbage with stutter everywhere and team ninja games are optimized for 60fps from outset. But in a game like horizon or ff7r where 30fps comes with low or minimal penalties to gameplay experience its fine for what that sacrifice to fluidity enables devs to do.

Making a game like shadow of the colossus would not have worked at 60fps. Id trade that fluidity for such a novel game experience anyday

 

[borntosoul]

Then begs the question....what sells more games @ 60fps or 30fps and more detail.
I personally believe it will be somewhere in between the two. Consoles have mostly always been pushing graphics over high FPS, with very few exceptions- can’t see that changing much.

 

[Scott_Arm]

And you are objectively wrong subjectively your welcome to that view though

How am I objectively wrong about input lag, MPRT and judder? I'm objectively right.

 

[Deleted member 13524]

Personally, I'd accept any compromises they'd have to make for them to be 60fps games.

With half the time to render each frame, they'd be very different games.

Obviously that's subjective, but I basically avoid anything that's 30fps. 30fps makes for great screenshots and poor gameplay. It looks bad in motion, and it's not the best option for responsive controls.

You avoided Horizon: Zero Dawn, Uncharted 4, God of War and Spiderman?
Damn that just sad..

Lately, I've been playing many Xbox Game Pass PC titles (Outerworlds, Halo Master Chief Collection, Dishonored 2, Gears 4 and 5, etc.) all at 70-75FPS (freesync 34" monitor).
I'd trade these games I've been playing at 75FPS for any of the PS4 games I mentioned above, any day. They're just a superior experience in immersion and most of all, fun, for me.