Blu-Ray Vs. DVD
- Thread starter Buktu
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Wow jvd... you're really determined to not concede that the PS3 has any advantage in terms of it having a BR drive versus a DVD drive aren't you? Honestly, I fully expect within just a couple of years that there will be games out that take advantage of the extra space a BR drive will provide (your argument that you can have multiple DVD's isn't valid because not having to switch DVD's IS a benefit!!). Moreover, I wouldn't be surprised if in the year 2008 more than twice the amount of people that currently have HDTV's will have bought a new HDTV (whether because they wanted to take advantage of BR, or they just felt it was time). In fact, PS3's could help sell HDTV's (or the other way around). As for your statement that HD-DVD will have more movies out, why will they? What reason is there that they will automatically have more movies out? What proof do you have? I wish that you could admit that the BR player is a benefit to the average consumer (whether or not you appreciate those benefits is not my concern).
Something else to keep in mind when considering load times is the time required to switch between layers. If this is done frequently during the course of a game, it will incur significant delays. Note the delay while watching dual-layer movies and also in dual-layer games like Champions of Norrath.
MechanizedDeath
Regular
1. I already said the rates start at infinity and drop from there. Anything divided by 0 approaches infinity. My point stands.jvd said:
2. You said PS3 would be the first BR player. I showed you that was wrong.
3. You don't know that, but I'll concede I don't either. When's the first HD-DVD player slated for release? I thought I read that BR players were coming out this calendar year. I thought Panasonic and Sony said they'd have players out this Fall in Japan, and possibly this holiday season for the US.
4. If BlueRay fails, then who cares? BR won't fail before the PS3 launches or gets a time to establish a userbase.
The reason it's a good bullet-point is b/c it will impact the marketing angle positively rain or shine. It'll be years before the HD format war is settled, and if there's really gonna be a war (no unification), then I think it's safe to say that BOTH formats will lose miserably, and DVD will keep right on chugging. It's a win-win for Sony any way you cut it. I don't see what could be bad about putting in a BRD drive. But I'm sure you could tell me, jvd. :? PEAE.mckmas8808
Legend
Also to add insult to injury jvd, In America Congress will past a law this year that will put a cutoff date on when analog TV will not be in existence. People speculate that the cutoff date will be either in 2007 or 2008. So that will only push more people to buy HDTVs. And after that happens the price of HDTVs will come down drasically.
Yet that is not what i claimed so reread
and it will be since the standard isn't finalized yet .
Everything i've heard is that hd-dvd comes out this year before the holidays and bluray is sometime next year . At least that is what i understood from that massive bluray / hd-dvd thread that lasted like 20 something pages
What a mean thing to say .
If bluray fails it could cause the failure of the ps3 platform . People aren't to excited about buying into a platform that is associated with a failed optical drive .
If hd-dvd becomes the victor then you will have a "cutting" edge product that is no longe cutting edge and anyone that bought into it . Alot of those people will care .
No not really as if it fails as the next gen optical unit its a negative bullet-point and the hype sony was generating will blow up in its face
Loosing money off a failed product is a win win for sony ? having a failed bluray will also means billions that were invested are now lost .
That is not a win - win unless you come from some backwards universe
Sure i can . I've already posted my views on ms's choice of dvd and sonys choice of bluray . You can go search for it and read it .
If you want to be sarcastic then go ahead and be sarcastic .
mckmas8808 said:
If they pass a law this year . Besides that they can pass the law at anytime and there is no reason why the price of hdtvs will come down after that . If anything because of demand it can stall the price reductions in the hardware as if they are going to sell hand over fist the amount of units and will sell them regardless of the price
DemoCoder said:
except there is no proof that the tv companys will pass these savings on to us and if there is enough demand for them because of some crazy thing like what the other poster suggests then they can sell the tvs at any price (As long as they don't go higher than they are today ) and keep selling because of the demand
jvd said:
Before HDTVs what kept TV companies from "sell(ing) the tvs at any price"?
The answer: competition amongst themselves. Sony wanted to sell their analog sets, so did Toshiba, Zenith, RCA, etc. etc. So each company was competing against each other.
The same exact mechanism will be in place if the selling of analog sets became illegal tomorrow.
But your point about passing along the savings to consumers IS 100% legitimate imo. Remember this when you argue about HD-DVD being cheaper.; "there is no proof that the HD-DVD companys will pass these savings on to us "
The same is true for computers, yet what have we witnessed for the last 2 decades? What you are missing is that CRT devices don't scale, but CMOS devices do, and DLP is CMOS technology and projection screens are cheap. Semiconductor based displays will continue to experience price drops.
When the underlying process is doubling in productivity every 18months, and hundreds of competitors all over the world enter the market, you will have the price savings being passed onto the consumer. Econ 101. Unless you propose a world wide TV oligarchy to stop it. But if you look at the last 5 years, the data proves you wrong. Q.ED.
When the underlying process is doubling in productivity every 18months, and hundreds of competitors all over the world enter the market, you will have the price savings being passed onto the consumer. Econ 101. Unless you propose a world wide TV oligarchy to stop it. But if you look at the last 5 years, the data proves you wrong. Q.ED.
Heh . There are many things that have stoped reducing in price even though the manufacturers have been reaping the benfits of lower production costs nor does the drop in prices have to keep its current rate of decreasing .
Not only that but it will still be years before the hdtv base becomes bigger than ntsc
Not only that but it will still be years before the hdtv base becomes bigger than ntsc
MechanizedDeath
Regular
PS3 won't be the first BR player. Again, unless unification talks stall the format into next year, then Panasonic and Sony have both mentioned they want to release players in Japan this year. Not fiscal year, CALENDAR year. I don't know if you're talking about the US market, jvd.
Second, BR being successful means nothing to the PS3. Why? B/c it won't be possible to deem it a failure until at least the end of next year. I mean, even by your claim, if the PS3 is the first BR player, then how would we know if the format has failed? It won't fail before it hits the market, right? And there's plenty of support in movies and hardware that ensure it'll last at least a couple years before it gets its doors blown off by HD-DVD *snicker*. But the thing is, BR will always have a higher userbase than HD-DVD.
Again, by your own claims, HDTV won't take off quickly, so what makes you think HD-DVD players could dream of selling in the same volume as a PS3? PS3 should move what, 10M units next year being conservative? A new video format that's compliant with another emerging format (HDTV) doesn't suggest it's gonna be a market that explodes. What PS3 does for BR is act more as a trojan horse. Installing a userbase before a format really takes off so that if/when HDTVs takes off, there are customers to sell to.
The only problem I can see for Sony is if unification stalls until PS3 production begins, in which case the systems ends up with a defunct format. But at that rate, I can see Sony just forging ahead with BR on their own. I am sure they understand that the PS line being a huge part of their CE division has to launch with their next-gen video format. So they must have a deadline established after which they will cutoff all unification talks and bunker down for the impending war. With Matsushita on their side, I think it's fair to say they have the upper hand. Studios aren't stupid. They have only tentatively pledged allegiance to either BR or HD-DVD. They will all convert to the winning format should it prove sufficiently successful. Then again, I see both format losing in a war, so I don't think it'll matter a lick if unification talks fail. My hope is Toshiba can come to their senses before it's too late. PEACE.
Second, BR being successful means nothing to the PS3. Why? B/c it won't be possible to deem it a failure until at least the end of next year. I mean, even by your claim, if the PS3 is the first BR player, then how would we know if the format has failed? It won't fail before it hits the market, right? And there's plenty of support in movies and hardware that ensure it'll last at least a couple years before it gets its doors blown off by HD-DVD *snicker*. But the thing is, BR will always have a higher userbase than HD-DVD.
Again, by your own claims, HDTV won't take off quickly, so what makes you think HD-DVD players could dream of selling in the same volume as a PS3? PS3 should move what, 10M units next year being conservative? A new video format that's compliant with another emerging format (HDTV) doesn't suggest it's gonna be a market that explodes. What PS3 does for BR is act more as a trojan horse. Installing a userbase before a format really takes off so that if/when HDTVs takes off, there are customers to sell to.
The only problem I can see for Sony is if unification stalls until PS3 production begins, in which case the systems ends up with a defunct format. But at that rate, I can see Sony just forging ahead with BR on their own. I am sure they understand that the PS line being a huge part of their CE division has to launch with their next-gen video format. So they must have a deadline established after which they will cutoff all unification talks and bunker down for the impending war. With Matsushita on their side, I think it's fair to say they have the upper hand. Studios aren't stupid. They have only tentatively pledged allegiance to either BR or HD-DVD. They will all convert to the winning format should it prove sufficiently successful. Then again, I see both format losing in a war, so I don't think it'll matter a lick if unification talks fail. My hope is Toshiba can come to their senses before it's too late. PEACE.
MechanizedDeath
Regular
jvd said:
No, there really is a federal push to adopt HDTV. The network broadcasters already have a deadline established AFAIK. Part of this mandated (or proposed mandate) is that manufacturers price sets within reasonable range so every tv viewer can make the transition for a manageable cost. No one wants to lose tv access just b/c they're too poor to keep up with changing standards.
Someone correct me on this if I'm wrong. This was being discussed over 5 years ago. If it hasn't been set already, I'm sure it will be soon. Though I don't know what the legal ramifications would be. I can imagine a pretty big case being made for some trade-in program or something to that effect. BTW, expect the low-end tvs to be 720i or 720p, whatever the low-end of HDTV standard is supposed to be. It's not like they're gonna be selling 1080i sets that cheap.
I don't know if HDTV-ready tvs qualify, but there could be a reason for their rapid proliferation over the recent years. PEACE.mckmas8808
Legend
jvd are you really thinking about what you are saying. Read what you write.
How can this happen? Blu-ray has everything going for it over HD-DVD.
1. A new killer hardware piece. AKA PS3 or trojan horse. Everybody knows that the PS3 will highly outsell every HD-DVD unit combined.
2. Its going to be the new standard in computers. HP, Dell, and Apple have already signed on. NO HD-DVD computers though. *gasp*
3. Bigger storge space. Self explainable.
4. Scalable. It can increase to 200 GBs. The HD-DVD has a much lower lifespan as far as this is concerned.
5. Blu-ray is already out in Japan, while HD-DVD is not out anywhere.
How can this happen? Blu-ray has everything going for it over HD-DVD.
1. A new killer hardware piece. AKA PS3 or trojan horse. Everybody knows that the PS3 will highly outsell every HD-DVD unit combined.
2. Its going to be the new standard in computers. HP, Dell, and Apple have already signed on. NO HD-DVD computers though. *gasp*
3. Bigger storge space. Self explainable.
4. Scalable. It can increase to 200 GBs. The HD-DVD has a much lower lifespan as far as this is concerned.
5. Blu-ray is already out in Japan, while HD-DVD is not out anywhere.
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