AMD Mantle API [updating]

Discussion in 'Rendering Technology and APIs' started by MarkoIt, Sep 26, 2013.

  1. no-X

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    This number, which was taken from PCPER article, seems to be wrong. This is taken fron the official press release: „40.9% (1080p) and 40.1% (1600p) performance improvement under Ultra settings and 4xAA on the AMD A10-7700K with an AMD RadeonT R9 290X.“

    So it's not 17.3 % (probably a typo?), but 40,1 % for 1600p @Ultra. It seems, that Guru 3D and other websites have correct numbers.
     
  2. Alexko

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    I'm also curious to see what happens with 45W (or lower) APUs, since their CPUs often have to throttle quite a bit in games.
     
  3. Picao84

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    Ok, thank you for pointing it out.
     
  4. DavidGraham

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    Obviously, from the way these press releases are presented, the benefits are not spread across the board .. they had to highlight and separate GPU and CPU limited scenarios .. and then put on some average uplift (13%) with 4 different CPUs @1080p !

    One curious thing, most benchmarks are run with no MSAA. I remember seeing direct benefits of Mantle with regards to MSAA performance, so what gives?
     
  5. Dave Glue

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    Ah I see the problem, you don't understand how words work.
    My agenda. Please tell me, what exactly is my "agenda" here?

    Again, you really should know what words mean before using them. You're lost.
     
  6. Tamlin

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    Got the answer. :grin:

    https://www.facebook.com/AMDGaming/posts/592679814137843?stream_ref=10
     
  7. Picao84

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    That's it. All this presentation was not well thought about. Hell, even Mantle itself was presented in different ways right from the beginning. Goalposts changed a lot from its introduction. The way I picture all this is like having different persons from AMD/DICE saying slightly different things. It lacks a common voice and message. It's full of noise and static. That is not how a decent company Marketing should work.

    I have the impression that actually most of them are presented with 4xAA?
     
  8. Tamlin

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    Why are you so negative?
     
  9. Picao84

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    I do not call this being "negative", but "demanding". Especially after all the hype, the initial outcome is anything but clear. For the sake of impact, they should have waited till Mantle was more polished. They brought this on themselves by promising a patch by December when they should have exercised more caution. In the end, turns out that it was not ready for prime time, not even today. Like I said, from a company as big and important as AMD, you should expect better judgement. Given their financial situation and the numbers they invested already in Mantle, this is not a good sign.
     
  10. Kaotik

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  11. Dave Baumann

    Dave Baumann Gamerscore Wh...
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    Who is is "they"?
     
  12. Picao84

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    AMD and DICE.
     
  13. Kaotik

    Kaotik Drunk Member
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    AMD?
     
  14. Tamlin

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    doublepost...
     
  15. Tamlin

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    You do come across as very negative to everything regarding Mantle. Could be that something gets lost in light that we are reading it on a forum, which doesn't always shows the grey tones, but still.

    Mantle is free. Its released now in beta and brings performance improvements already for the majority of GCN users if to take Repi's benchmarks as example. If you don't approve of those benchmarks, rest assured that Mantle will be benchmarked across the internet the following days, now that its been released.

    Mantle is a new API thats been build from ground up. It does contain more then just CPU improvements, considering the amount of control it gives to the developers.

    AMD shouldn't have waited until it became more polished. I'm very happy that they released it now in its beta form and would prefer to see it evolve during the year then to wait. It will become more polished, but we now get a chance to see it in action.

    Be happy that it has been released. You cannot demand anything anyway, so instead look at this as an enthusiast and see what potential it have instead. :grin:
     
  16. Dave Baumann

    Dave Baumann Gamerscore Wh...
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    The schedule is DICE's schedule, the delivery dates have been put forth from DICE as has the patch / implementation schedule. We have a choice to either support it or not support it; obviously we are supporting it every step of the way. BF4's implementation has always been with a beta phase of Mantle rather than a full release phase, hence the reason why there isn't a full developer kit / SDK available yet. Both the API and (I'm sure) the first implementations will continue to improve.

    That said, the gains are already there - we are seeing 10% or better gains in pathologic GPU bound cases one an inital Beta release API the first release of port of a game that was not originally designed for Mantle, in CPU bound cases the scaling is even larger; this is with everything in its infancy. As we see maturity we'll see developers going from ticking off their big ticket CPU limitation items and using Mantle features more that can bring more scaling in GPU bound cases as well.
     
  17. Picao84

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    What about how things are being presented. Are you honestly perfectly happy with that? For a technical point of view it might make sense to presented like that, but from a layman/marketing perspective I am not sure.

    ToTTenTranz summarised it perfectly:

    Mantle, being the huge game changer AMD expect it to be, was thrown out the door like an ordinary driver update. Hell, I even remember nVIDIA making a fuss about a "bing bang" driver update that was nothing special some years ago. Mantle surely deserved a more polished presentation? Including reviewers numbers right of the bat.
     
  18. CarstenS

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    I'm pretty sure, that's the way it was planned.
     
  19. Picao84

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    So where are they?
     
  20. Tamlin

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    I asked Andrew Lauritzen a bit about this in regards to his thread about frame latency, but was on the Canary Island at the moment and couldn't follow it up. Here's his thread:
    http://forum.beyond3d.com/showthread.php?t=62775

    Despite the two huge spikes I see in those pictures, I wonder what impact Mantle have on game smoothness, seeing how smooth the frame delivery seems otherwise under Mantle compared to the DX picture.

    Under 7970+8350, the difference is even bigger. Notice how the GPU is a straight line under Mantle, compared to DX:

    DX:
    [​IMG]
    Mantle:
    [​IMG]
     
    #960 Tamlin, Jan 30, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 30, 2014

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