AMD Mantle API [updating]

Do you actually know what the word gimmick means?

 

I am not exactly sure which forum the ”I heard you liked the fanboy word so I put more fanboy in my post so that you can read all about fanboys as you read all about fanboys” attitude is coming from, but it needs to stay there, and not join us on B3D. Keep it away, no matter how strongly you feel about the people that like the IHV other than your favourite. I will also avoid the rather obvious ”pot calling the kettle black” observation.

 

One would expect that, until (if) it reaches critical mass, dev resources needed for this will not be exuberant, as AMD devrel will do a fair bit of legwork, and AMD will also sweeten the financial proposition of adopting Mantle. Not much different from things like PhysX or NVIDIA engineers porting stuff to CUDA themselves to persuade partners to adopt it, and rather reasonable if one wants to get people to adopt a non-portable, proprietary thingamebob.

 

I see a lot of discussions without real numbers. With those everything can be much clearer, that is telling us if Mantle is worth or not.

Repi, I know they were claiming 9x performances in drawing calls, but how this gets translated in a practical scenario? ie high end pc with frostbite3 in bf4

 

december 2013.
before that I dont expect any numbers out not even at the november conference.

 

Just to be clear, I'm not repi

I think it may not boost avg FPS in a very meaningful way (assuming a fast CPU), since they have to keep the number of draw calls low for the majority of PC gamers with non-GCN parts, but it should prevent dips in CPU limited scenes where there's a ton of stuff going on. That would be very cool.

 

Incorrect

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1795291&postcount=252

 

This conference cant come fast enough... for get more clearer informations.

 

wont see numbers and compare different systems.
Unless they do some PR stunt for the december release which is unlikely.

 

"Divert resources" implies that resources would have been available for PC development in the first place. How about "add resources"?

 

Where is this fantasy wonderland where companies actually add resources to do anything?

 

Maybe not once development has started.
But initial funding already depends on expected returns.

 

Just saw the nvidia hosted interview with Carmack, Sweeney and Andersson yesterday and was amused when guest asked Andersson about mantle. Now I'm hoping the same guy asks about G-sync on AMD's thing, haha.

 

no i'm italian, it's the translation via google translator of "trovata commerciale", i don't speak perfect english so please suggest me the correct word in english, thank you.

 

Correct. It were Batman fans which have been "screwed over" by Rocksteady, who have been "screwed over" by their middle-ware provider, for not providing native & generic MSAA support.

If you think there was some Nvidia conspiracy going on, you might ask yourself who is really the sinner in this case, Nvidia or Rocksteady. Who defines and implements the engine's features?

What if MSAA would be a Nvidia only feature?

Proprietary APIs are completely okay, if a common baseline API exist. Having two different network protocols for different areas or devices as the only option is inconvenient - but having 500 million different network protocols each with it's own strengths and awesomenesses as switchable alternative to the baseline say TCP protocol is AAA-okay.

People are paying for distinctive services all the time. And if you would indeed be following market sense, then Mantle versions should cost $1 more. That Mantle versions will come out without added cost is actually a free distinctive service, which is only to rejoice about.

No, they can't. If a consumer has no contract with a game producer, then he can't. He can't dictate CryTek to make RPGs, he can't dictate Crystal Dynamics to make a side-scroller, he can't dictate DICE to make iPhone games. He can't dictate them to make the games accessible to the blind, which would actually pretty cool, I would love to hear high quality aural games.

Particular developers don't even go to the market and ask people what kind of game they would like and then do that. They just make the game they are either familiar with making, or they want to make for "personal" reasons.
In fact, lots of games come from individuals thinking about it for some time, and manage to find a sponsor to produce it, when the sponsor thinks it's marketable.
Monster companies like EA might look to the market and think it's time for another RPG, and then put one of their studio to do it. Which in effect might end up boring because of it.

No it's not.
You don't agree that when you buy a 8bit monitor, connect it to a 14bit graphics card, and then getting told that the monitor producer who offers a 14bit patch for the monitor firmware is supposedly harming consumers (of 8bit monitors of other brands, or even the entire industry)!

Please. If you get only 50% of X because of Y, then of course you say Y is subpar or inefficient, and don't criticize the fact that someone is able to fix X by using Z instead!

No, they don't. They can be completely ignorant of the fact that Mantle exists and hell is not going to break loose.

 

They don't have to. Not for the Mantle version of BF4, at least.
They could just implement an "Epic Battle" mode that shows an enormous amount of NPCs/vehicles/debris and plays smoothly using Mantle + dirt-cheap APU or requires a $1000 overclocked CPU in a $300 motherboard to get the same results in the non-Mantle system.

 

Targeting Mantle is not that much of an overhead because it:

1. Can reuse console code 'in whole or part (AMD)"
2. Already has a large GPU user base that can benefit from Mantle - the 7xxx cards.
3. Addresses both the GPU and CPU - all bulldozer based CPUs and APUs will benefit from Mantle.
4. GCN is a long term architecture. Mantle optimizations done today will work on AMD processors far into the future.
5. Mantle is designed from the start to be multi platform - Linux and Android can be easily accommodated.

With their x86 PC Mantle experience, DICE should be able to efficiently incorporate a Linux render path into Frostbite. Same should be true for any targeted platform. Or any engine developer incorporating Mantle.

EA made a point of saying they insisted Mantle be cross platform. AMD said Mantle was developed in consultation with several other developers (Nvidia might have rounded up the only two developers/engines that aren't currently on board with Mantle, Carmack and Sweeney. If there had been a third it is likely they would have been there instead of Johan Andersson).

With most of the major developers (and engines) on board and cross platform future proofing Mantle is looking very strong.

 

gimmick =
A device employed to cheat, deceive, or trick
or
something designed to attract extra attention, interest, or publicity
the first one is the most common definition

since intel cpu's workings are well documented (i believe) amd could make it so it benefits intel cpu's

 

Ok then what I meant, more in the second sense. Thank you very much, very kind

 

I would have said the second definition was the common one...