Advanced Audio Technologies (HRTF, Dolby Atmos, etc) *echo*

[mrcorbo]

Object based audio won't do anything for stereo/5.1 mixes. If a sound utility is doing something to a stereo YouTube movie, it's something instead of object audio mixdown, which it shouldn't be doing. That's akin to having an amp advertised as being an EQ, but also adding reverb - you want the reverb to be a separate component or feature so you can control it. There are plenty of audio 3D space enhancers out there, so there's no real need for any to be integrated into Dolby Atmos.

From your linked description, Atmos doesn't claim to enhance stereo audio and doesn't list YouTube as a source for Atmos enabled audio.

Dolby Atmos receivers typically (if not universally) can do upmixing via "Dolby Surround" of non-object based tracks to derive height information. As a superset of Dolby Pro Logic IIz, Dolby Surround can upmix even stereo sources to output in full Atmos. I have no idea, however, if this is implemented in Dolby's software-based decoders/mixers.

There's a pretty good write-up here. It also contains impressions from an a/b comparison between a stereo downmix upmixed back to surround by Dolby Surround vs the original multichannel mix and some test files if you want to do your own evaluation.

 

[mrcorbo]

I have no idea, however, if this is implemented in Dolby's software-based decoders/mixers.

I tried to find something more definitive on this, but based on the Dolby Access FAQ, I'm leaning towards stereo sources not being able to be upmixed since they specifically refer to 5.1 and 7.1 sources. It may omit the stereo->surround part of the upmixer and just enable the surround->Atmos functionality.

 

[Arnold Beckenbauer]

Dolby Atmos receivers typically (if not universally) can do upmixing via "Dolby Surround" of non-object based tracks to derive height information. As a superset of Dolby Pro Logic IIz, Dolby Surround can upmix even stereo sources to output in full Atmos. I have no idea, however, if this is implemented in Dolby's software-based decoders/mixers.

There's a pretty good write-up here. It also contains impressions from an a/b comparison between a stereo downmix upmixed back to surround by Dolby Surround vs the original multichannel mix and some test files if you want to do your own evaluation.

What is then DTS Virtual:X?

 

[mrcorbo]

What is then DTS Virtual:X?

A DTS technology that simulates a full surround setup (including height channels) with fewer speakers. The best use case for it seems to be in soundbars. They also have Headphone:X for, you guessed it, headphones.

 

[Deleted member 13524]

I wish people would universally acknowledge that soundbars completely suck for surround sound.
Unless they're put in the perfect center of one side of a perfectly square room without furniture. Then they can just mostly suck.

A pair of cheaper but decent speakers with decently sized drivers would be so much better for 99.99% of the cases soundbars are used.

 

[mrcorbo]

I wish people would universally acknowledge that soundbars completely suck for surround sound.
Unless they're put in the perfect center of one side of a perfectly square room without furniture. Then they can just mostly suck.

A pair of cheaper but decent speakers with decently sized drivers would be so much better for 99.99% of the cases soundbars are used.

It seems like the majority of people don't care. If it's loud and the dialogue comes through OK, most would say it sounds "good".

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I think for a lot of us, psychologically we're obviously sat watching a window into a world, so it makes sense that the audio would come from that direction. Everything happening outside of the TV is not related to the TV (noises from outside the TV are fro the environment). Ergo, there's no great incentive to go to the faff of creating a great surround system as 'good audio from the window' is a very appropriate standard.

For gaming, it's different, and that's where positional audio is ideal, but of course headphones provide a cheaper, probably more effective, and less bulky solution to that.

 

[mrcorbo]

I think for a lot of us, psychologically we're obviously sat watching a window into a world, so it makes sense that the audio would come from that direction. Everything happening outside of the TV is not related to the TV (noises from outside the TV are fro the environment). Ergo, there's no great incentive to go to the faff of creating a great surround system as 'good audio from the window' is a very appropriate standard.

For gaming, it's different, and that's where positional audio is ideal, but of course headphones provide a cheaper, probably more effective, and less bulky solution to that.

I think the being able to perceive what's happening in the environment beyond what's in your field of view adds to the sense of place. Further, I'd argue that if the media was created with a surround sound soundtrack then, to fully experience the work, you need to be able to reproduce that content as completely as possible. I'm not against modifying the presentation of content to your own preferences, but failing to reproduce content present in the media leads to, IMO, an inherently lesser experience.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I can agree it's lesser, potentially (I've found surround sound distracting sometimes, especially when it's not clearly from the movie and you wonder what in the house is making that noise!), but whether it's lesser or not, it's substantially more cost and faff to set up a good surround system then a simple sound-bar. Spatialised audio for a TV is important to make the sound realistic from within that window, rather than sound like a discrete audio track playing on a transistor radio, which is why sound-bars are popular versus using internal TV speakers. They occupy the perfect mid-point between quality of experience and cost/bother.

So yeah, the majority of people don't care for surround sound, just like they don't care for high-def audio when the convenience and library size of streamed audio is good enough despite its compressed quality.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

So yeah, the majority of people don't care for surround sound, just like they don't care for high-def audio when the convenience and library size of streamed audio is good enough despite its compressed quality.

Well, they don't care enough to set up a proper surround system, but they care enough (if they have the money) to buy a "surround sound" bar. And then yes, you have a great deal of consumers who just don't care period.

My fiancé is one of them. It took a lot of talking to get her to allow me to put 2 rear surround speakers for a 5.1 surround. God forbid if I were to try to suggest a 7.1 or Atmos setup.

Regards,
SB

 

[BRiT]

Well, they don't care enough to set up a proper surround system, but they care enough (if they have the money) to buy a "surround sound" bar. And then yes, you have a great deal of consumers who just don't care period.

My fiancé is one of them. It took a lot of talking to get her to allow me to put 2 rear surround speakers for a 5.1 surround. God forbid if I were to try to suggest a 7.1 or Atmos setup.

When you buy your new house, hire someone to install the Atmos setup before you move in.

 

[Deleted member 13524]

God forbid if I were to try to suggest a 7.1 or Atmos setup.

5.1.2 with 2 speakers in the ceiling might be a lot easier to convince than 7.1.
Especially if you have a fake ceiling and the only visible thing are the speaker grills.

 

[Cyan]

Dolby Atmos for headphones has gotten an update today, but there is no information as to what has changed. I tested it and it sounds as good as before.

In addition, I got a second pair of cheap stereo headphones after going to the supermarket and buying a Nesquik bundle which includes the headphones. The sound is not bad for the price and most importantly, they are very comfortable -something I can't say about all the headphones I have tested which end up scraping against the skin of my ears and become uncomfortable-. The biggest flaw is that it doesn't have a L-R sticker, so I need to test them before listening to music or whatever.

These are the aforementioned headphones:

 

[orangpelupa]

Btw how do you convert Dolby surround or atmos to hrtf stereo other than on the fly using windows sonic and Dolby headphones ?

 

[Xbat]

Considering that Sony's platinum headset supports 3d audio and the importance of it for VR. Will next gen have special tech built in and will it work on any stereo headset?

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I hope so! We were all excited at that possibility this gen. We're starting to get proper 3D audio now, so it should be something they're aiming for. Next-gen headphone audio could be uber immersive. Needs head tracking of the headset but MEMS is so cheap these days, that should be possible enough to be able to turn your head a little to better place sounds.

 

[orangpelupa]

I hope so! We were all excited at that possibility this gen. We're starting to get proper 3D audio now, so it should be something they're aiming for. Next-gen headphone audio could be uber immersive. Needs head tracking of the headset but MEMS is so cheap these days, that should be possible enough to be able to turn your head a little to better place sounds.

the drift may be the only wall from implementing that.

 

[Deleted member 13524]

Considering that Sony's platinum headset supports 3d audio and the importance of it for VR. Will next gen have special tech built in and will it work on any stereo headset?

I'm hoping for ear-shape scan to become standard. Lack of a decent soundstage effect is the biggest problem with any kind of headphone nowadays, and according to people who tried it, this seems to be a game changer.

 

[Cyan]

I'm hoping for ear-shape scan to become standard. Lack of a decent soundstage effect is the biggest problem with any kind of headphone nowadays, and according to people who tried it, this seems to be a game changer.

sounds very cool -no pun intended-. Nice to know Creative is very alive and kicking. I wonder though, if a technology like this could conflict with Dolby Atmos for headphones.

Today I tried to test Dolby Atmos using my mother as the test subject and it passed the test with flying colours. Btw, there is a difference between using Dolby Atmos with headphones and disabling it.

I am still torn about getting a new pair of decent headphones, but decent can mean 80€..

 

[mrcorbo]

I just pre-ordered the LG v40 which has DTS-X Headphone included. I've been impressed with the effect in the past, so I'm curious to see the implementation in a smartphone. How does it work with apps, etc?