3D Gaming*

[Arwin]

EDIT: Ugh... for cinema use !

That doesn't matter though - they'll obviously appear for TVs eventually as well.

 

[patsu]

The active shutter glasses has more components inside, compared to the ones used in the cinema.

 

[Arwin]

I know, but I'm not changing my answer!

 

[ShadowRunner]

Id expect active shutter glasses to improve close to that level at some point. There will be a lot more money spent on development of these glasses if 3D gains traction.

 

[patsu]

Sony President/COO Stan Glasgow To Give Keynote At SID DisplaySearch Conference:
http://www.sonyinsider.com/2010/05/...give-keynote-at-sid-displaysearch-conference/

Sony Electronics’ President and Chief Operating Officer Stan Glasgow will deliver the keynote address during the SID DisplaySearch Business Conference, which will be held during Display Week 2010 (May 23-28) in Seattle. Glasgow will describe Sony’s vision of the future, with 3D emerging as the next great platform for home entertainment.

Heh, so Google IO to announce Android TV, and DisplaySearch to announce 3DTV ?
[size=-2]Are they the same thing ?[/size]

 

[patsu]

http://www.engadget.com/2010/05/12/sharp-busts-out-worlds-first-3d-hd-camera-for-mobile-devices/

Sharp Corporation has developed a 3D camera module for mobile devices capable of capturing high-definition (720p*2) 3D video images, an industry first. Sharp will start shipping samples in July. Mass production of these modules will begin within 2010.

3D images are composed of two views taken using two cameras that simultaneously capture separate images for the right and left eyes. Consequently, a 3D camera requires peripheral circuitry to apply image processing to the two images, for example, to adjust color or to correct positioning between the images from the two cameras. Manufacturers have thus been pursuing designs that reduce the size and weight of 3D cameras and seeking ways to shorten their development period.

 

[patsu]

http://www.electronichouse.com/article/francis_ford_coppola_3d_is_tiresome/D1/

While admitting digital technology is well suited for 3D filmmaking and that the new technology has improved, Coppola believes 3D today is “no different from the 1950s” because of the need for glasses.

“I feel that until you can watch 3D without glasses, it’s the same thing we know,” he says. “I personally do not want to watch a movie with glasses. It’s tiresome.”

Coppola says he even removed his 3D glasses to watch portions of “Avatar,” even though it meant he was watching out of focus. He says his opinion of 3D is in sync with recent comments by Roger Ebert. He has experience in 3D himself, having made “Captain Eo” in 3D back in 1986 starring Michael Jackson.

“I don’t see why a movie is better in 3D,” he says, while at the same time making sure not to demean any efforts by James Cameron by calling “Avatar” a “fantastic” film. “I would rather make a movie in regular 2D and move to larger format for some big scenes much like Abel Gance did with ‘Napoleon.’”

This kinda sums up why growing up is hard.

 

[patsu]

... but being the new kid on the block has its advantages:
http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/s..._the_First_to_Broadcast_3-D_Over_the_Air/4699

Four major networks will begin 3-D broadcasts within the next few weeks.

On May 19th, South Korea will start testing over-the-air 3-D broadcasts. It all kicks off with the 2010 Colorful Daegu Pre-Championships Meeting, which, from the look of it, appears to be a track meet. It may not be the most exciting event to broadcast, but it's live, OTA 3-D.

The South Korean broadcasting company seems to be leading the charge is SBS. They're starting with three hours of 3-D programming a day on May 19th and expanding for the summer, when they'll be showing 25 matches from the FIFA World Cup.

...

 

[Rangers]

Yeah I am not sure myseld if 3D is going to catch on in a broader sense at all. It's weird that way.

I can maybe see some ideal future where it's built in to TV's for the same price, and optional. IE, watch a few special effects blockbusters in 3D, watch everything else in 2D. If they get to a point where the cost including glasses is basically the same as non 3D TV, so all it is is an occasional option, then I can see it maybe.

 

[ShadowRunner]

Yeah I am not sure myseld if 3D is going to catch on in a broader sense at all. It's weird that way.

I can maybe see some ideal future where it's built in to TV's for the same price, and optional. IE, watch a few special effects blockbusters in 3D, watch everything else in 2D. If they get to a point where the cost including glasses is basically the same as non 3D TV, so all it is is an occasional option, then I can see it maybe.

Well i think they are half way there already. On the TV side the technology isnt going to cost anything extra, every tv in a few years will be 3D capable as standard as it costs the manufacturer next to nothing. Once the cost of the glasses decreases, which it will by a huge amount, the cost of packing in a couple of sets of glasses will be easily hidden in the overall TV price.

At some point there wont be a different between 3D an non 3D sets, simply because non 3D sets wont exist.

Just look at HDTVs the majority of people dont even play HD content yet when they buy a new tv they buy a hdtv regardless. People dont need to be rushing out and buying 3d tvs, sales will trickle through naturally when people need a new tv as they always have done.

 

[zed]

Yes as noted above AFAIKS its not the blockbuster's (avatar etc) where 3d is of most interest but sports!!

 

[patsu]

Nintendo's Financial Results Briefing (May 7, 2010):
http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/library/events/100507qa/index.html

My question is about 3D and 3DS. First, I have a very simple question, which is “Can 3D games actually contribute to gaming population expansion as Mr. Iwata stated?” Because I have the strong impression that 3D games are more for heavy users, I’d like to know your opinion on this. I’d also like to know the impact upon development costs as I think that they will increase in general if games become 3D from 2D. Further, as the memory may become bigger, the IC chips price and software price may rise, so please also advise us on the impact. Finally, many think that 3D games might have some effect on the children. What does Mr. Iwata think of this? What kind of countermeasures does the company have?


First, about your impression that 3D games are more for heavy users, I do not understand why you feel that way. When Nintendo offers a new video game experience, we are basing it on our gaming population expansion strategy and have been creating software that can be enjoyed by a very wide age demographic encompassing 5 to 95 years old. So, the company will be offering a software lineup, which will be strategically created to entertain many people regardless of age, gender and past game experiences. Accordingly, we do not think that 3D games will mainly be for the heavy users. I feel that what I am trying to say now must be very hard to understand unless we can show you something tangible that will make you say, “I see, 3D used in this fashion is accessible to anyone.” So, we’d like you to hold your judgment until we show you something concrete in the future.

About the possibility of 3D games increasing development costs, when a game is developed with the real 3D space as its game field, it is done so by simply displaying two pictures, one for the left eye and another for the right eye. Accordingly, it is not very difficult for games originally with a 3D world to be converted to a 3D game. It may cost more if you try to make a 3D game out of a game that was not created with the real 3D world as its game field. However, I do not think this is the fundamental element. Making games in 3D alone does not make the games more fun. More important is to offer the interactive experiences in the 3D vision. I believe that people will find some entertainment value to them only when we can offer the unique and fun experience with that combination. Because this is a field not yet explored, we will need to go through trial and error. It is not confined to 3D graphics, but whenever we challenge ourselves to create a brand new entertainment experience, any developer goes through trial and error, which may increase development costs. However, this is an issue that can be solved by how you manage the development process. If you involve many people in the trial and error process, the development cost can inflate. On the other hand, if you manage to organize a compact size development team in order to repeat the initial experiments, and if you significantly enlarge the size of the team only after the initial small team has shown promising results, I do not think that the total development costs will be very different from today’s level. Today is not the time for us to discuss anything about software pricing nor memory sizes. The prices of third party software titles must be determined by the third parties in the first place. We will need a bit more time before we can discuss more concrete things.

Finally, about your question on the effects on children, it is said that one out of tens of people, not confined to children and including adults, does not enjoy 3D graphics. Accordingly, even though Nintendo 3DS(temp) features 3D graphics, we are thinking about incorporating some tweak so that the 3D graphics function will not be mandatory and the players will have the ability to disable that specific effect to play games. By doing so, we can hopefully deal with concerns for children’s eyes or for those who have difficulties with 3D graphics in general.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Which makes 3D something of an aesthetic gimmick, as no game can be designed around it without impacted those who cannot see it. Also it'll make for an unfair playing field in things like shooters. Consider a motion shooter with direct point-and-shoot. Those with 3D should be at considerable advantage in making out and aiming at targets. Then again, online gaming is riddled with imbalanced matchings, so I guess that's nothing to different to what we have now.

 

[ShadowRunner]

Which makes 3D something of an aesthetic gimmick, as no game can be designed around it without impacted those who cannot see it. Also it'll make for an unfair playing field in things like shooters. Consider a motion shooter with direct point-and-shoot. Those with 3D should be at considerable advantage in making out and aiming at targets. Then again, online gaming is riddled with imbalanced matchings, so I guess that's nothing to different to what we have now.

S3D is just an aesthetic difference, we are not going to see any game ideas that cannot be also done in traditional 3D games, and there is nothing wrong with that. An advantage in certain games may be true but nothing beyond that. We dont generally consider people with loss of sight in one eye as handicapped, they are able to do everything in life as well as other people with no real disadvantage.

 

[MfA]

Texturing is an aesthetic gimmick for most Nintendo games, not like you need it to play the game.

 

[patsu]

WirelessHD 1.1 Spec is 3-D Capable:
http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/show/3D/Wireless_HDMI/WirelessHD_1.1_Spec_is_3-D_Capable/4716

WirelessHD 1.1 throws the old 4Gbps bandwidth out the window in favor of a new 15Gbps minimum. The theoretical maximum is 28Gbps.
So what does all that extra bandwidth get you? For starters, it's enough to support 3-D in high definition. The 1.1 standard is compatible with all forms of 3-D on the market today. It's also compatible with 2K and 4K signals, but it'll only send them at 1080p.

Update on Comcast's 3D effort:
http://www.comcast.com/About/PressRelease/PressReleaseDetail.ashx?PRID=991

ESPN 3D Launch on Comcast to Coincide with 2010 FIFA World Cup on June 11

BRISTOL, CONN. AND PHILADELPHIA, PA - May 12, 2010

Comcast Corporation (Nasdaq: CMCSA, CMCSK), one of the nation's leading providers of entertainment, information and communication products and services, and ESPN today announced an agreement to provide ESPN 3D to Comcast’s Digital Cable customers, to bring top sports events to consumers in next-generation 3D. Comcast is the first cable affiliate to sign on to distribute ESPN’s new network that will launch on June 11 and will include nearly 100 events in its first year.

...

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

Just look at HDTVs the majority of people dont even play HD content yet when they buy a new tv they buy a hdtv regardless. People dont need to be rushing out and buying 3d tvs, sales will trickle through naturally when people need a new tv as they always have done.

Well you try buying a non HD (ready) tv these days... You couldn't even if you wanted. So yes if you wait long enough everybody will have a 3d capable tv. Tv's are a long term investment and in recent years a lot of people bought a new set with hd tv prices dropping so fast and it will probably still take a few years before every tv out there has 3d by default so if you factor that in along with the majority of people again buying new tv's and you probably have to wait another decade before the majority has a 3d tv. Personally I don't care about 3d as long as I have to wear glasses. Besides that I also don't want to spend a small fortune on buying a dozen of glasses just so I can watch a movie with family/friends.

 

[MfA]

Glasses less 3D will probably come to the living room within a couple of years (with directional back lighting through array field lenses) but for the cinema it's much much more difficult ... in theory the same approach could work, but it would be very expensive.

 

[Arwin]

I read a review for 3D televisions, a Sony, Samsung and a Toshiba I think, the latter one a plasma, and reviews were generally favorable, citing that performance/quality already surpassed cinema 3D, and the immersion was no less for being on a smaller (47") screen at home.

It was a test in the Dutch C't, and I'm sure it's in the German version as well, and the tests were very detailed, with excellent timing measurements and so on. It confirms that in principle Plasma is better suited for 3D in general (low latency), although overall the Sony (prototype) and Toshiba screens came out equal in the end. All sets priced at around 2200 euro, which is a lot less than HD TVs started out as and suggests that prices will come down quickly. They were all shutter glasses based, and the lightest glasses weighed just 35g, so that's promising.

 

[patsu]

Yoichi Wada commented on stereoscopic 3D:
http://www.andriasang.com/e/blog/2010/05/19/yoichi_wada_speaketh/

Wada was also asked for his thoughts on one of the big buzz words in the game industry today, 3D games. When asked if he felt 3D could revitalize the market, he said "I'd be happy if it would revitalize the market. However, while it will likely become a big topic, I don't believe it will form a market." Asked for a reason, he said "Whether naked eye or with glasses, the method is unstable." He also seems to feel that there could be cost issues with 3D technology, due to the higher specifications required to render everything twice.