The majority of games are still primarily GPU limited though, especially Sony's 1st party output. And it's not as if on PC you're going to escape all drops due to the CPU. The resistance to the Pro is puzzling to me, when you're effectively paying as much for a mid range graphics card on the PC, and in some ways getting a worse experience due to stutter struggle.people keep forgetting that the CPU is essentially the same in the PS5pro - all those games that are CPU limited below 60 fps are going to be essentially the same on that machine.
Or just 44% more powerfull4 stripes, so 4 times more powerful than PS5.
And in some ways getting a worse experience due to stutter struggle.
The majority of games are still primarily GPU limited though, especially Sony's 1st party output. And it's not as if on PC you're going to escape all drops due to the CPU. The resistance to the Pro is puzzling to me, when you're effectively paying as much for a mid range graphics card on the PC, and in some ways getting a worse experience due to stutter struggle.
I don't think consoles have ever offered incentive for existing PC gamers to move to console. It's never been the case, outside of PS1/PS2 era, that people who maintain a capable PC would find better value in a console. It's more a case of the Pro offering reason for console owners to upgrade. It's cheaper getting a PS5Pro than a GPU and that's even if you have a PC that can take a GPU upgrade. So, if a $500 GPU is good enough to upgrade, a console for the same price should be good enough value also.There's certainly an argument for console only gamers to move to the Pro, or for people completely new to the gaming market to choose a Pro over a brand new PC build. But I'm seeing little incentive for existing PC gamers with a half decent CPU to move away from PC gaming to the Pro.
I don't think consoles have ever offered incentive for existing PC gamers to move to console. It's never been the case, outside of PS1/PS2 era, that people who maintain a capable PC would find better value in a console. It's more a case of the Pro offering reason for console owners to upgrade. It's cheaper getting a PS5Pro than a GPU and that's even if you have a PC that can take a GPU upgrade. So, if a $500 GPU is good enough to upgrade, a console for the same price should be good enough value also.
I have seen plenty of people online question the need for the Pro's existence. And I remember Alex saying that he doesn't feel the Pro is a compelling upgrade, due to the absence of a faster CPU. I listened again to what Alex said, and he is at least consistent, since he thinks that on the PC, a 4070 say, should be paired with a faster CPU.I'm not seeing a lot of resistance to the Pro tbh. There's a different between realistic expectation setting, and being negative towards something.
I wasn't trying to make a direct comparison between the PC and consoles in terms of what you get for your money. I was talking about the worth of the Pro as an upgrade in comparison to parts like the 4070 or 7700 XT/7800 XT, which plenty of users will not have paired with cutting edge CPUs.On the expectations side... I don't think it's realistic to expect you will be able to pick up a Pro for the same price as an equivalent PC GPU when it launches. The Pro is expected to launch at what, $550 - $600? And with raster performance equivalent to an RX7700XT, but more RT performance.
Well the RRP for an RX 7800XT today is only £499 and the Pro will be going up against the RX 8800XT which will be either faster, cheaper, or both (and add full RDNA4 RT capabilities to at least match or improve on the RT improvements in the Pro relative to the product tier). So the occasional shader compilation stutter aside (and frankly I feel we are past the worst of that issue now anyway) you're going to be getting a better experience across the board at a lower price with a PC GPU upgrade - and without having to rely on "Pro patches" to see those gains.
There's certainly an argument for console only gamers to move to the Pro, or for people completely new to the gaming market to choose a Pro over a brand new PC build. But I'm seeing little incentive for existing PC gamers with a half decent CPU to move away from PC gaming to the Pro.
We don't even know what the PS5 Pro is going to cost. It's just general discussion about general value to upgrade a console.I agree with your points aside from the cheaper getting a PS5Pro than a GPU part (assuming you're talking about equivalent performance). $500 should get you something like an 8800XT in the same timeframe as the Pro launch which should be a reasonable amount faster (and likely cheaper) than the Pro.
Why? This is a thread about PS5 Pro. What has the number of upgradeable PCs got to do with it?As a side note, to put some numbers to the point of how many existing PC's could take such a GPU upgrade
Yes indeed. At 549$-599$ it should have a very good value. And we don't really know how it will perform. Leakers have guesses, yes, but the proof will be in the pudding.We don't even know what the PS5 Pro is going to cost. It's just general discussion about general value to upgrade a console.
Why? This is a thread about PS5 Pro. What has the number of upgradeable PCs got to do with it?
Zen 2 is a relatively low IPC core by modern standards, I would say. Add to that the low frequency, reduced caches, and higher latencies of graphics DRAM, and I would expect it to be at least 2 to 3 times slower in SPEC2K6 compared to modern PC CPUsIt’s wild to me that an 8-core 3.5Ghz Zen 2 struggles to hit 60fps in any game.
Consoles aren't underperforming versus what an eight core Zen 2 processor with just 8MB of L3 and 3.5Ghz clockspeed would do on a PC, though. This isn't some infinitely powerful CPU by any means(should remember Skylake-based Intel CPU's still outperformed Zen 2 in games), and there's nothing about it that suggests that devs couldn't push games to a point where 60fps isn't possible on them. I'd have been shocked if this didn't happen.Relative to what we’re seeing on the screen. Besides we know how Zen 2 performs in windows and therefore have a point of reference for what to expect from the consoles.
Why? This is a thread about PS5 Pro. What has the number of upgradeable PCs got to do with it?
That doesn't tell you how many PS5 owners own a PC capable of being upgraded though, and that wasn't even the point. The question is whether the PS5Pro represents value to PS5 upgraders, not PC upgraders.I was responding to your comment of: "It's cheaper getting a PS5Pro than a GPU and that's even if you have a PC that can take a GPU upgrade." The context of the point in relation to the Pro was whether it would be worth moving from an existing PC to a Pro, with the data I provided being to demonstrate that for roughly 50% of existing PC gamers according to the SHS, it wouldn't be worth it from a price/performance perspective.
Not sure why. PS4Pro was reportedly developed to stop PS4 owners migrating to PC and not to woo PC gamers to console. It's unlikely anyone who games on PC would want to swap to console given the economics. Even if the Pro is cheaper in hardware costs, the online tax is substantial.Sony may consider the existing PC gaming audience as a prospective market for the Pro ...
Consoles aren't underperforming versus what an eight core Zen 2 processor with just 8MB of L3 and 3.5Ghz clockspeed would do on a PC, though.
PS5 Pro in 2025 will run GTA6 at 30fps whereas my Nvidia RTX 5090 ti ultra triple SLI setup with my quad Intel 1600XTs and 1.5TB DDR7 Ram will run it at approximately 0 fps
So I’d say at 599 compared to 37967 dollar : PS5 Pro in my case, is much better value even at 30fps