Next-Gen iPhone & iPhone Nano Speculation
- Thread starter Arun
- Start date
I don't see them claiming twice the GPU power anywhere. Not for the iPad Air at least.
EDIT: hmm, yes. Seems like you're right. The wording is slightly ambiguous, but still. They're specifically talking about the A7 chip and mention that it is twice as fast in CPU and GPU performance compared to its predecessor, they're not actually talking about the iPad itself. But they could make that more obvious.
More EDIT: I'll just quote Apple. About the A7 chip they say this:
In other words, they tell us the A7 has twice the CPU and GPU performance of its predecessor. i.e. the A7 has twice the performance of the A6, which we already knew. They're not comparing to the A6X.Apple said:
About the iPad Air they say this:
In other words, it has twice the CPU speed compared to the previous iPad and enough the graphics performance for all you want to do on your iPad.Apple said:
In other words, never is it actually stated that the A7 chip in the iPad Air will have more graphics performance than that same A7 that's used in the iPhone 5S.
P.S. I apparently like the phrasing "In other words"
.
Last edited by a moderator:
They have a graphic on the ipad air web page, up to 2x the cpu performance, up to 2x the graphics performance, up to 10hr battery. Right below where it says A7 chip.
Doesn't seem ambiguous.
Marketing, they have reduce the bezel size ( so the size ) , reduced weight by ~20%, so its the new iPad "Air". Not really important... problem is for name the next iPad ( or maybe a 12" version will come soon ? ( Many brand will bring 12" tablet next year . )
And, to follow on from my last point, if I'm remembering correctly, they even had a graph which showed the Air as having a 2x gain from the last iPad.
And, going from memory again, the performance improvement mentioned for the retina iPad Mini suggests that its A7 is only as fast as the one in the iPhone 5S.
So, the A7 in the Air should have faster graphics performance (somewhat less than 2x) than the A7s in the iPhone 5S and retina iPad Mini.
And, going from memory again, the performance improvement mentioned for the retina iPad Mini suggests that its A7 is only as fast as the one in the iPhone 5S.
So, the A7 in the Air should have faster graphics performance (somewhat less than 2x) than the A7s in the iPhone 5S and retina iPad Mini.
They are comparing to A6X. They showed a graph that featured previous iPads, including 4th generation (the current up until today); ipad air was claimed to be 2x faster.
So yeah, the comparison is absolutely made to A6X, and not A6.
The SoCs in the iPad 4 and iP5 weren't the same though, the quad-channel memory and larger / more numerous GPU cores were already using up a lot of the thermal / power budget, so Apple couldn't ramp the CPU freq much.
I doubt that Apple will boost the CPU in the iPad Air by much, maybe 200 MHz, but the GPU is a different matter, they have to double the frequency to meet the claimed 2 x GPU perf.
Memory bandwidth is the dark horse, the iPad 4 had 17 GB/s, but the A7 I thought was using 2 x 32-bit wide DRAM interfaces with 533 MHz LPDDR3. Surely Apple won't regress memory bandwidth on the iPad Air, especially if they're targeting a doubling of GPU perf. @nerdtalker tweeted this "no I mean there’s more to the memory bandwidth story on A7 than has been talked about" So are we talking about dual x64 wide interfaces, or something else?
The graphics performance of the 5S's A7 is a decent amount higher than the iPad 4's A6X, so they don't need anywhere near a full doubling of the 5S's GPU clock rate in order to be 2x iPad 4 graphics.
Also, increased performance can come from more than just higher peak GPU clocks, even on variants of the same SoC.
Also, increased performance can come from more than just higher peak GPU clocks, even on variants of the same SoC.
I was just coming back to correct myself on that point from earlier after re-watching that part of the presentation.
The A7s in both the retina Mini and the Air are supposedly 2x the graphics performance of the A6X in iPad 4, which might make them about 50% faster at graphics than the A7 in the 5S.
For reference, Apple's claimed improvement in graphics performance from one iPad generation to the next (some arbitrary overall measure of performance based mostly but probably not solely on FLOPS):
9x from 1st to 2nd gen, SGX535 to 543MP2
2x from 2nd to 3rd gen, 543MP2 to 543MP4
2x from 3rd to 4th gen, 543MP4 to 554MP4
2x from 4th to 5th gen, 554MP4 to A7 Rogue
The A7s in both the retina Mini and the Air are supposedly 2x the graphics performance of the A6X in iPad 4, which might make them about 50% faster at graphics than the A7 in the 5S.
For reference, Apple's claimed improvement in graphics performance from one iPad generation to the next (some arbitrary overall measure of performance based mostly but probably not solely on FLOPS):
9x from 1st to 2nd gen, SGX535 to 543MP2
2x from 2nd to 3rd gen, 543MP2 to 543MP4
2x from 3rd to 4th gen, 543MP4 to 554MP4
2x from 4th to 5th gen, 554MP4 to A7 Rogue
With regard to the name for the latest gen iPad, they could not call it the "new iPad". That name was the official name of one of the previous iPads, you can't have two gens of iPads with the same official name.
At a guess based on the information revealed, it looks like it is the same chip, but with a slight improvement in CPU speed, and maybe 50% increase in GPU Clock.
Question, if this is the exact same chip, then either the iphone5s and the new iPads have the same memory interface( albeit with the iPads clocking quicker), or some of the memory interfaces seen on the die shot are only active on the iPads.
Finally, the only separation between iPad mini and iPad is the screen. Everything else would appear to be the same. I thought they would go in the opposite direction and try to make the full size iPad a higher end one somehow.
I wonder was the ram increased ?
I watched the entire presentation. Major change of direction for apple, in that all the software announcements ended with the word "Free". In a world where it is getting increasingly difficult to differentiate your tablets/smartphones in hardware, apple have made an interesting move and decided to differentiate by supplying a wide range of highly engineered, highly developed and integrated applications for free. The other tablet suppliers, might provided various wrappers and front ends for their interfaces, but they fundamentally rely on the google App Store to provide its apps. That model won't be able to compete on software quality. Apple is leveraging its in-house software expertise to good effect.
At a guess based on the information revealed, it looks like it is the same chip, but with a slight improvement in CPU speed, and maybe 50% increase in GPU Clock.
Question, if this is the exact same chip, then either the iphone5s and the new iPads have the same memory interface( albeit with the iPads clocking quicker), or some of the memory interfaces seen on the die shot are only active on the iPads.
Finally, the only separation between iPad mini and iPad is the screen. Everything else would appear to be the same. I thought they would go in the opposite direction and try to make the full size iPad a higher end one somehow.
I wonder was the ram increased ?
I watched the entire presentation. Major change of direction for apple, in that all the software announcements ended with the word "Free". In a world where it is getting increasingly difficult to differentiate your tablets/smartphones in hardware, apple have made an interesting move and decided to differentiate by supplying a wide range of highly engineered, highly developed and integrated applications for free. The other tablet suppliers, might provided various wrappers and front ends for their interfaces, but they fundamentally rely on the google App Store to provide its apps. That model won't be able to compete on software quality. Apple is leveraging its in-house software expertise to good effect.
Last edited by a moderator:
ltcommander.data
Regular
I'm guessing the A7 clock speeds will be the same for the iPad Air and retina iPad Mini to reduce developer fragmentation so there will only be two bins: iPhone and iPad.
They probably believe the iPad Mini will see demand equal or greater than the iPad Air, although the new Air design does take away some of the Mini's size advantages, so they don't want to appear to be penalizing Mini users. In the face of increased tablet competition at the low-end, it's also consistent with Apple's usual strategy to respond by moving the Mini a higher hardware tier to add value rather than focusing on lowering the price.
Not only is it a move to highlight where hardware markers may be lacking in software, I also saw it as a move to highlight to software companies like Microsoft and Google the importance of hardware. Specifically rather than selling software individually, selling a subscription or pushing ads on users, Apple can give it all away for free with no further direct transactions because they already made their money on the hardware.
Would a slightly smaller display really offset the smaller battery in the mini compared to the air if the A7s are clocked at the same speed and of the same bin? Apple claims same 10 hour lifetime.
Engadget is saying the iPad air has a 32.4 watt hr ( down from 42.5), iPad mini is 23.8 up from 16.3. So iPad air has 36% bigger batter capacity. Diagonally screen is 22% bigger. I havnt done the maths but seems screen area difference and battery difference might be similar.
loekf
Regular
Qualcomm, the Chipzilla of mobile, who else ?
Intel, Broadcom, samsung, Mediatek are all lagging in terms of basebands and marketshare