It seems obvious that Sony wants to have simple and powerful box that is not a nightmare to program and at the same time isn't huge R&D undertaking. I assume MS spent alot more money on R&D on new hardware in comparison to Sony. Its looks like MS wants everything, but they "cheap" out on the most important thing of the hardware, one that they always got "right":
Predict: The Next Generation Console Tech
- Thread starter Acert93
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I am more and more confused about what is the "magic dust" discovered by MS to make a GPU of 1.2 TFLOPS similar in performance (as stated by Lherre) to a GPU of 1.8 TFLOPS.
He never said that. He said each should have advantage over other, although I doubt that. But thats not the subject of the topic.
Some people insinuated that FLOPs dont really matter since there are alot of bottlenecks that prevent you from reaching these, but thats assuming MS will nail everything down (ROPs, fillrate, bandwidth) and Sony won't (which is not true).
I am just not convinced that people really know what Durango is all about.
Microsoft is so incredibly secret at this point that everyone is full of BS.
Either they have old specs that mean nothing or they have access to another SDK for another cheaper version of Xbox made to be like AppleTV or their information is from an old Developer Kit.
That is why there is so much garbage out there.
We are just going to have to wait.
Microsoft is so incredibly secret at this point that everyone is full of BS.
Either they have old specs that mean nothing or they have access to another SDK for another cheaper version of Xbox made to be like AppleTV or their information is from an old Developer Kit.
That is why there is so much garbage out there.
We are just going to have to wait.
Lherre wrote this:
In my opinion both machines will be very close, with some details in favor for each one, but I think we will have a ps360 situation again with 2 machines very close
So either MS found some magic or the two machines can never be compared to the level of performance.
From what emerges from the rumor seems more like a situation ps2 (xbox next) vs xbox 1 (ps4) that xbox 360 vs ps3.
Well, Xbox and Gamecube are "close", but one is obviously more powerful. Entire info is out there, as some people very close to hardware makers in this thread said and that points on one being more powerful than other in pretty much every aspect.
maybe because there're two venus soc, not one (2.4 TFs) plus a mars soc and two vector units
Durango: powered by your imagination!
we are talking about rumors, assuming they can be real, if not, all the thread is imagination
DoctorFouad
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yeah exactly thats what I thought too
seriously if people expect some "magic" to happen, they are gonna be very disappointed by the reveal of the nextxbox at this E3...and who invented this nonsense of : "a 1.2 Tflops is going to perform like a 1.8 Tflops with the help of another chip"
a 1.2 tflops processor is going to perform ONLY and as a MAXIMUM THEORITICAL performance 1.2 Tera flops of operations per second. If there is another chip helping, it is this chip that must perform as a 0.6 Tflops chips, but this chip cant transform the original 1.2 Tflops onto 1.8 Tflops....sigh...
I think you are taking this way to serious now. All I said is this - RESTRICTIONS (die space, watts, law regulations etc.) are the SAME for both companies. NEEDS are NOT the SAME for both companies. Sony's aims for simple and powerful GAMING box first, while MS seems to be aiming at MULTIMEDIA first and GAMING later box.
One will go for more RAM in console because thats what they need, even though its slower and doesn't compare to GDDR5 when it comes to gaming. Other has gone with less memory but one that is faster. They won't be able to dedicate much to multimedia in comparison, but their goal was obviously gaming.
And thats why I said, they picked up downclocked Pitcairn GPU (that and 7770 are great candidates for consoles), paired it with 4GB of GDDR5 and called it a day. Its simple, powerful and gaming centric. No body ever said 7850 was impossible, you are to emotional and it clouds your thought process. 7850 was the GPU first said to be in PS4 year ago. Actually, everything we heard today was already known a year ago, except for more RAM (and then it said if densities allow) and dropping 4 core CPU in for 8 core smaller one.
Having 8GB of slow RAM, 8 core CPU from the start that seems to be modified and new Kinect that can turn on your car from couch is not what I would call gaming centric. In the end, both companies will spend similar amount of transistors on their console, they will consume similar amount of watts and the only difference will be companies goal, which seems to be very different as it stands.
DavidGraham
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Could someone please explain the relation between memory bandwidth , capacity , and frame rates ? why would a a frame be restricted to acess certain amount of GBs from a full memory configuration ?
You think 4GB of DDR5 is some amazing feat of engineering??
Yeah, a bunch of people used to say 4GB DDR5 was unlikely, I was never one, anyway. But it's never exactly anything exotic. There's lots of cards on newegg with 4GB GDDR5.
I dont know anybody said a 7850 was impossible either. Many thought a 7970 was.
The laptop GPU thing, I'd still be surprised if it's an actual mobile part, because they're binned. So what? What wont surprise me is 18 CU's, so who cares either way?
PS4 appears very straightforward and nothing exotic, with the exception of the compute block DF talked about. Anyways I'm sure AMD did all the engineering.
tongue_of_colicab
Veteran
The whole multimedia thing is nothing more than a software issue. Hardware will be decided based on what MS and Sony think will be suitable for gaming. Whatever multimedia features they will think up will easily run on whatever will be in the box. Gaming will be by far the most resource intensive, not multimedia.
Sony would go for 2GB GDDR5 if there would be no way to get 4GB by the end of 2013. Obviously thats ok for gaming console, but anything related to full blown OS+kinect+smart glass would not be able to fit in that case, but they didn't seem to care. As soon as you put 8GB of DDR3 it means they need heafty amount of eDRAM/eSRAM in system. That also means alot of transistors will be dedicated towards it, and less for pure GPU with as much of ALUs they can fit.
Its all about trade offs, but different approach will result in different systems like it seems to be the case. One of them with alot of slow RAM and endless possibilities at multimedia front, other pretty much perfect gaming machine that money/power allow.
No it doesn't. Physics foots his foot down. You have 20 years and many, many billions of dollars of research getting us to architectures like GCN and Kepler. There is no amount of money Microsoft could have spent a few years ago to magically and suddenly alter the equation in their favor.
Prophecy2k
Veteran
The wishful hoping and dreaming of some, still trying to hold onto ostensibly ridiculous rumours will oly make the final console HW reveals more devastating to them.
Better to try to take rumour with a healthy pinch of salt (and a generous helping of secret sauce).
The likelihood is we'll know more in the coming weeks.
That's not entirely true. AMD and Nvidia research is aimed to run current games and current rendering technology at their best. They may have some long term graphics research going on, but they can't use it until it becames a standard. Take the tessellation unit as an example of this. Microsoft instead since provides the API can do much more to affect the future of graphic technology. I'm not saying that Microsoft reinvented the wheel, but with the help of AMD they may have design some unique rendering solution that will be standardized in the next iteration of DirectX. Therefore I think that we are missing an element of Durango's design, which makes up for the power difference we see between the two console.
Bagel seed
Veteran
I'm inclined to believe the story isn't over yet for both consoles and we're only hearing what's in alpha or beta kits, especially now that we know there's special sauce for both. People are kidding themselves if this is the final configuration that'll be in the consoles. And devs can only verify with what they've received.
Is target performance going to be close to what we've seen in the rumors? It's likely. But I'm willing to bet that final kits will be different enough to have us say "so that's how it works".
Is target performance going to be close to what we've seen in the rumors? It's likely. But I'm willing to bet that final kits will be different enough to have us say "so that's how it works".
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