Last edited by a moderator:
Xbox Upscaler... Any Details and Information?
- Thread starter ProjectNatalFan
- Start date
ProjectNatalFan
Newcomer
ok that is the first time I have seen any kind of joking on this site
also first time I saw a gif. lol is that even allowed on here?
I edited it, just to alleviate my guilt -I kept the link of the gif-.ok that is the first time I have seen any kind of joking on this site
also first time I saw a gif. lol is that even allowed on here?
It's infrequent here yes, but this one is almost the only forum where I post online, so for me sometimes a little fun is welcome. There are others, but time is at a prime at forums and I post there once in a blue moon.
I am terrible at reading minds, but I got from Davros' post that he was sorta having fun. I mean, he has a top of the line PC, I think, and he would never use a scaler.
(((interference)))
Veteran
I have some interest in image scaling so I'd like to know what they're doing too (and what PS4 is using) - I tried asking more details about it a few months ago but no one knew any more.
ProjectNatalFan
Newcomer
I know this is a silly question, but can it upscale to 4k if you have a 4k TV. An option to do that on games? Or would that be too much on the scaler. If I can play Ryse at 900p upscaled to 4k id be happy. For some reason I don't see it scaling to 4k, most likely 1080p like in ryse that uses a buffer beforehand to upscale.
Very probably no 4k upscale. There's no need as the TV has an upscaler for 1080p content, making the 4k upscale in console redundant.
Silent_Buddha
Legend
Additionally while a 4k upscaler in console may possibly provide better results than a TV, you're getting into the area where it wouldn't be noticeable. As I've made note of in the past, unless people are going to get very large 4k TVs they won't be able to tell the difference between 1080p and 4k from their living room couch, anyway. Which means that any artifacts from a 4k upscale from a 1080p source aren't going to be visible.
Additionally a 4k upscaled image output from the console would limit your FPS to 30 due to limitations of the HDMI 1.4 spec. Whereas outputting 1080p and allowing the TV to upscale would allow for 60 FPS or greater.
I suppose it's possible that Xbox One could have HDMI 2.0 support, but I think it's highly doubtful.
Regards,
SB
I suspect they won't put a 4k scaler in it too but there would be a very good reason to put one scaler in the xbox and not rely on your TV = Latency. You really don't want games going through the processing pipeline of some TVs...
If it's a 2 lobe lanczos filter the quality will be pretty good.
If it's a 2 lobe lanczos filter the quality will be pretty good.
couldnt you make the argument for the console not needing any scaler as the tv will have one ?
Silent_Buddha
Legend
You could, but some TV's have some pretty horrible scalers. Especially the flood of cheap Chinese TVs.
I think the small cost is justified to make sure everyone has at least good upscaled to 1080p quality gameplay. Rather than just telling people with cheap TVs to deal with it.
And as I mentioned, when upscaling 1080p to 4k, it'll be hard to mess that up as people generally won't be able to tell the difference between 1080p and 4k on typical HDTV sizes at typical living room viewing distances.
Regards,
SB
No, because the game is upscaling framebuffers to output resolution. eg. 900p upscaled to 1080p and composited with a 1080p native UI. If devs were reliant on TV upscaling, they'd have limited options on what resolutions they could use. You couldn't trust how a TV would handle a non TV-standard resolution. You also save a lot of latency doing it in console. Okay, TV upscaling on 4k could add latency, but that's not really a large populace the console companies need to worry about upsetting, and it'll be no worse than this gen. Upscaling was a significant part of last gen, so in goes the hardware to facilitate that this time (in both consoles).
Was it ever fully explained how the XB2 upscaling worked? A lot of people were quite vocal about it's (in their eyes) extraordinary quality, but to me it looked rather muddy, blurry even.
I once read that there was no Xbox hardware at all: it was just a simple filter done on the GPU. This would explain my own observations.
If by XB2 you mean XB360, there was some confusion over the scaler and if it was hardware and the location of the hardware. This came about from conflicting information, official sources saying the ANA chip was used and another saying it was on the gpu. Then this caused people to think it was done using pixel shaders.
The conclusion was on Beyond3d that it does have a dedicated scaler (I am pretty sure it was decided it was on the GPU) The actual location is less important than the fact it does not consume any ALU.
The 360 Scaler was hardware, based on tech that came out of the webTV group at MS.
It was considered to be very good, it was especially good on upscaled text.
I'm interested to know if the XBOne scaler is MS tech or AMD tech.
djskribbles
Legend
So these shots were posted at GAF of KI running at native 720p output and 1080p output through the X1 scaler:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=91025042#post91025042
I took the 720p native image and scaled it to 1080p using Lanczos4.
720p native output:
1080p output (X1 scaler):
Resized using Lanczos4:
Lanczos4 is a pretty standard scaling algorithm that does a pretty good of upscaling images. It is known to introduce some artifacts from minor sharpening. But you can see the Xbox One scaler introduces a lot of rough edges and ringing from over-sharpening when compared to Lanczos4. Lanczos4 does a much better job here IMO. I've said this before on these boards, but again, I'm not a fan of the X1's scaler at all.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=91025042#post91025042
I took the 720p native image and scaled it to 1080p using Lanczos4.
720p native output:
1080p output (X1 scaler):
Resized using Lanczos4:
Lanczos4 is a pretty standard scaling algorithm that does a pretty good of upscaling images. It is known to introduce some artifacts from minor sharpening. But you can see the Xbox One scaler introduces a lot of rough edges and ringing from over-sharpening when compared to Lanczos4. Lanczos4 does a much better job here IMO. I've said this before on these boards, but again, I'm not a fan of the X1's scaler at all.
Last edited by a moderator:
The second image (labelled as 1080p) seems to be 720p which makes it hard to compare…
djskribbles
Legend
Fixed.
Assuming those screenshots are legit....I would prefer something inbetween the X1 scaler and the Lanczos4.
Similar threads
