Xbox 360 to Receive More GTA IV Episodic Content

[Zassk]

If most GTA2/3 owners bought at $150, are they going to stretch to ~$300 for GTA4? My guess is no ...

My guess is that you'll be able to buy a $199 console that is GTA4-ready on the day that GTA4 releases, so it will not be much of a stretch for those people.

Yes, the $199 console probably won't be able to download the episodic content, until the owner buys a storage add-on. But the crowd we are talking about was already accustomed to paying for storage add-ons (i.e. PS2 memory cards).

 

[AntShaw]

Am I the only one who thinks the extra content packs are going to be a bad thing? I cannot see how they would not be excluding great ideas from the core game in order to make the pay-extra expansions more appetising.

That doesn't have to be the case? Oblivion provided some solid additional content. Even if you want to consider the expansion 'episodic' type content.

Adding additional tasks/mini-games/vehicles/villains etc can be done seamlessly leaving the single player game fully in tack.

Or if you look at it more like the HL2 content, it can be a complete additional 'area' of the world to circumvent the main story as well.

 

[PARANOiA]

That doesn't have to be the case? Oblivion provided some solid additional content. Even if you want to consider the expansion 'episodic' type content.

Adding additional tasks/mini-games/vehicles/villains etc can be done seamlessly leaving the single player game fully in tack.

Or if you look at it more like the HL2 content, it can be a complete additional 'area' of the world to circumvent the main story as well.

I agree it can be, however I don't see this idea mixing well if the plan is done simultaneously with the core game's development.

 

[AntShaw]

I agree it can be, however I don't see this idea mixing well if the plan is done simultaneously with the core game's development.

Why not? That would be a plus to me and not a minus.

I think it's silly to think this would de-value the content in any way?

 

[Vic]

This is largely irrelevant to today's market. Xbox is not 360, PS2 is not PS3, this is a ridiculous argument.



Arcade is gimped? Then what would you call the PS2?



I meant across both platforms OBVIOUSLY.

Why don't you use your head a little bit? Did you really think I was saying GTA would have a >90% attach rate?

Eh? But there wasnt a superior version of the PS2 available for a slightly higher price. I agree with Blade as regards price. £50 isnt going to make a difference to anyone but a small minority.

I think I'll wait to see what the pricing/substance is like for this extra content before judging it.


EDIT: The price difference is just £40 on Amazon now.

 

[Blade47167]

Eh? But there wasnt a superior version of the PS2 available for a slightly higher price. I agree with Blade as regards price. £50 isnt going to make a difference to anyone but a small minority.

Thats what I was trying to get at but I went a bit over board I guess. I wasn't trying to compare either console to the predesecor necessarly just that it was more or less a "Playstation Game" and when you look at the fact that EU is a "Playstation" fanned region when they go to buy this game and a console to go along with it and the price difference is only $50 what do you think they are gonna buy it for?

What's your source on these numbers? The only place I've seen try and quote definitive Euro numbers are sites like VGChartz. They currently have the 360 @4.78m and PS3 at 3.04m. That's 1.7m difference (or 60% more than your quoted reference), plus you're insinuating that the PS3 will be able to close the gap in six months . Let's assume the 360 stopped selling overnight... the PS3 would need to increase its user base by 50% in about four months ! And that's ignoring the fact that the LTD numbers includes launch, which is not representative of a typical month. Add to that that the 360 is not going to stop selling, and your theory sounds unlikely - and just plain incorrect.

Eh.. Bud sorry to say but your looking at Others. Thats not really Euro only.

You have to remove Australia, and Other from the numbers...

360 ~ 3.5mil
PS3 ~ 2.45mil

So again somewhere around 1mil apart lol. And as far as closing the gap the PS3 is selling ~ 80k more a week right now in Europe(Yes Holiday) will most likely drop so throw in the next 2 weeks of ~80k(60%) higher sales then a drop to probably 60k~80k a week after holidays even giving the 360 30~50k a week would mean roughly 280k(PS3 Monthly) & 160k(360 Monthly)

(360)2 Week Christmas
3.5mil + 180k + 180k = ~3.86mil
Next 6 Months
160k * 6 = ~960k
Together
3.86mil + 960k = ~ 4.64mil By GTA Release

(PS3) 2 Week Christmas
2.45mil + 250k + 250k = ~ 2.95mil
Next 6 Months
280k * 6 = ~1.68mil
Together
2.95mil + 1.68mil = ~ ZOMG 4.63mil By GTA Release

Since these are the last 2 weeks leading up to Christmas the 2 Christmas weeks could likely be higher. I pulled the after holiday sales from an early week in November after both had their price drop and took off ~10k from the PS3 sales to give 360 more advantage. I know its not exactly right but still my theory does have basis.

Forgot Scandinavia:
Weekly LTD
PS3 14,355 183,333
360 9,228 322,733

There for what little difference its gonna make...

 

[PARANOiA]

OK - fair enough. I've not heard of excluding AU numbers in Euro numbers, since we're both PAL however I appreciate your logic. I definitely think the weekly extrapolated numbers used for 1H 2008 are excessive, since the holidays tend to be about 4x normal monthly spending, however the true impact of the PS3 price drop isn't really clear, since sales haven't had a change to plateau.

Regardless, I'm interested to see how much the changes over the next six months impact sales and whatnot. If MS have any sense at all they'll drop the price a lot in Europe (including Australia) and Canada, given the competition and overall lack of price drops we've seen since launch.

We actually have pretty nicely documented numbers over here compared to most of Europe thanks to GFK.

 

[Blade47167]

OK - fair enough. I've not heard of excluding AU numbers in Euro numbers, since we're both PAL however I appreciate your logic. I definitely think the weekly extrapolated numbers used for 1H 2008 are excessive, since the holidays tend to be about 4x normal monthly spending, however the true impact of the PS3 price drop isn't really clear, since sales haven't had a change to plateau.

Regardless, I'm interested to see how much the changes over the next six months impact sales and whatnot. If MS have any sense at all they'll drop the price a lot in Europe (including Australia) and Canada, given the competition and overall lack of price drops we've seen since launch.

We actually have pretty nicely documented numbers over here compared to most of Europe thanks to GFK.

Ya it will be interesting to see if MS is able to drop the price. I guess it really depends on their situation financially. They so far have only managed to show a profit in their gaming division during the Halo 3 quarter. If they are at a break even point with hardware its possible I suppose. With the new Falcon model it is very feasible that they are breaking even.

But even if MS was to drop the price Sony will most likely have to follow suit in order to stay competitive. I'm sure first party title sales are killing any sort of hardware cost offset they were hoping for coming into the holiday season. Who knows tho considering the PS3 is also focusing on the 65nm approach and the ever decreasing Blu-ray manufacturing costs they could also be about even right now on manufacturing costs.

 

[scooby_dooby]

Eh? But there wasnt a superior version of the PS2 available for a slightly higher price. I agree with Blade as regards price. £50 isnt going to make a difference to anyone but a small minority.

True, and that will have some impact, but that doesn't automatically mean the overwhelming majority are going to want that more expensive model, which is the assumption you're making.

Calling the Arcade 'gimped' just is untrue. There was valid logic to call the Core gimped, but the Arcade is a full package, ready to game out of the box, with a strong value and no major drawbacks.

And for the record, I am assuming MS will make some price cut across EU to coincide with the release of GTA, it would only be smart.

Perhaps Sony will be able to match that reduction, but it seems unlikely that they'll be in a position to do so, IF GTA launches when it's supposed to this spring.

 

[Blade47167]

True, and that will have some impact, but that doesn't automatically mean the overwhelming majority are going to want that more expensive model, which is the assumption you're making.

Calling the Arcade 'gimped' just is untrue. There was valid logic to call the Core gimped, but the Arcade is a full package, ready to game out of the box, with a strong value and no major drawbacks.

And for the record, I am assuming MS will make some price cut across EU to coincide with the release of GTA, it would only be smart.

Perhaps Sony will be able to match that reduction, but it seems unlikely that they'll be in a position to do so, IF GTA launches when it's supposed to this spring.

I guess the Arcade isn't really 'gimped' but still lacking a hard drive its not a 'full package' either. Especially since I've always heard that games load faster on 360's with HD installed.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

For those buying just for GTA, at current prices going by Play, the Arcade's £190 including 256 MB card so that's ready-to-play price, versus £280 for PS3 which lacks component cables, so there'd be an extra price there for a non-output-gimped PS3. And for the record, Wii is £180, so you're talking £10 difference between XB360 and Wii now, which I didn't think we were at!

 

[Vic]

True, and that will have some impact, but that doesn't automatically mean the overwhelming majority are going to want that more expensive model, which is the assumption you're making.

Calling the Arcade 'gimped' just is untrue. There was valid logic to call the Core gimped, but the Arcade is a full package, ready to game out of the box, with a strong value and no major drawbacks.

And for the record, I am assuming MS will make some price cut across EU to coincide with the release of GTA, it would only be smart.

Perhaps Sony will be able to match that reduction, but it seems unlikely that they'll be in a position to do so, IF GTA launches when it's supposed to this spring.

You mean like so far with the Core? The Core had bombed around the 10% mark. Arcade is unlikely to fair any better as most kids would prefer a Wii, and will likely be clueless/ambivalent about the 360's extra power/features. Wii is dominating that end of the market, hence the 360's above-average sales to this point.

I cant see why Sony wouldnt be able to price-match. They are the hardware company, and MS has struggled tremendously to cut its price to this point. £30 in two years? With Cell set to go 65nm around the same time as Xenon, and Blu-ray costs coming down rapidly, I see no advantages for MS in this area.

Its interesting really when you look at cost. MS started with a lower price, but has been unable to cost-cut at the same rate as Sony. Some people will say that Sony was desperate, but their strategy seemed to be 'lets rape the early adopters for £400 then aggressively cut prices, while MS's approach has been more passive and more approachable for the early adopter.

As regards GTA, I dont see it turning MS's fortune any more than any other game in Europe. They already have a bigger catalogue and a slightly lower price than the PS3, and Sony's brand is strong here. Plus GTA will be dropping around the same time as MGS4 and Gran Turismo Prologue.

 

[AlphaWolf]

You mean like so far with the Core? The Core had bombed around the 10% mark. Arcade is unlikely to fair any better as most kids would prefer a Wii, and will likely be clueless/ambivalent about the 360's extra power/features. Wii is dominating that end of the market, hence the 360's above-average sales to this point.

Early reports are that the Arcade is selling much better than the Core did.

I cant see why Sony wouldnt be able to price-match. They are the hardware company, and MS has struggled tremendously to cut its price to this point. £30 in two years? With Cell set to go 65nm around the same time as Xenon, and Blu-ray costs coming down rapidly, I see no advantages for MS in this area.

The fact that MS hasn't cut their price much doesn't mean they are unable to do so.

Its interesting really when you look at cost. MS started with a lower price, but has been unable to cost-cut at the same rate as Sony. Some people will say that Sony was desperate, but their strategy seemed to be 'lets rape the early adopters for £400 then aggressively cut prices, while MS's approach has been more passive and more approachable for the early adopter.

You think Sony is making money on the hardware now? You think they would have cut their price had they been selling better than the 360? I think their next quarterly report will be interesting.

 

[Diamond.G]

You mean like so far with the Core? The Core had bombed around the 10% mark. Arcade is unlikely to fair any better as most kids would prefer a Wii, and will likely be clueless/ambivalent about the 360's extra power/features. Wii is dominating that end of the market, hence the 360's above-average sales to this point.

I cant see why Sony wouldnt be able to price-match. They are the hardware company, and MS has struggled tremendously to cut its price to this point. £30 in two years? With Cell set to go 65nm around the same time as Xenon, and Blu-ray costs coming down rapidly, I see no advantages for MS in this area.

Its interesting really when you look at cost. MS started with a lower price, but has been unable to cost-cut at the same rate as Sony. Some people will say that Sony was desperate, but their strategy seemed to be 'lets rape the early adopters for £400 then aggressively cut prices, while MS's approach has been more passive and more approachable for the early adopter.

As regards GTA, I dont see it turning MS's fortune any more than any other game in Europe. They already have a bigger catalogue and a slightly lower price than the PS3, and Sony's brand is strong here. Plus GTA will be dropping around the same time as MGS4 and Gran Turismo Prologue.

I don't think MS is struggling on price cuts. I think they just don't see a need to cut price in markets where they are selling the system at a healthy rate. Could they be moving more systems? Sure, but I don't think they are doing to shabbily at the moment. MS hasn't been proactive thus far, they have been reactive.

I don't think this content is going to make or break anyone. We haven't even really seen a trend of downloadable content selling like gangbusters yet have we?

 

[scooby_dooby]

You mean like so far with the Core?

No, pretty much the opposite actually.

The core was set up to deter consumers from purchasing it, while the Arcade is setup as an appealing value, it's two completely different situations.

Also, the lower the price goes, the more likely that small differences in price will impact purchasing decisions, as you're presumably reaching a cheaper/more cash constrained audience.

Also, it's a little silly to say MS was 'unable' to drop price, when Sony has given them almost no reason to have to. If PS3 was actually selling well, and there was actually pressure for MS to drop the price, and they didn't, then you might be able to conclude they were 'unable'.

As it sits now, they simply felt no pressure from Sony this holiday, and decided to reap an extra $50/unit on the 4-5million+ units they'll sell WW this fall/winter.

Prudent decision, and given the NPD numbers for Nov from Sony, it seems to have been a wise choice.

 

[Tap In]

I don't think MS is struggling on price cuts. I think they just don't see a need to cut price in markets where they are selling the system at a healthy rate. Could they be moving more systems? Sure, but I don't think they are doing to shabbily at the moment. MS hasn't been proactive thus far, they have been reactive.

I don't think this content is going to make or break anyone. We haven't even really seen a trend of downloadable content selling like gangbusters yet have we?

exactly

they are going to get other consumers at the lower price later anyway.... making as much on your current purchasers (since Sony is not pushing them) is a wise choice IMO

 

[Vic]

[/B]

Early reports are that the Arcade is selling much better than the Core did.



The fact that MS hasn't cut their price much doesn't mean they are unable to do so.



You think Sony is making money on the hardware now? You think they would have cut their price had they been selling better than the 360? I think their next quarterly report will be interesting.

Umm...I never said that, but Sony are earlier in their cycle than MS. Therefore, I think they're more willing to incur losses on their hardware sales at this point in time.

 

[Vic]

No, pretty much the opposite actually.

The core was set up to deter consumers from purchasing it, while the Arcade is setup as an appealing value, it's two completely different situations.

Also, the lower the price goes, the more likely that small differences in price will impact purchasing decisions, as you're presumably reaching a cheaper/more cash constrained audience.

Also, it's a little silly to say MS was 'unable' to drop price, when Sony has given them almost no reason to have to. If PS3 was actually selling well, and there was actually pressure for MS to drop the price, and they didn't, then you might be able to conclude they were 'unable'.

As it sits now, they simply felt no pressure from Sony this holiday, and decided to reap an extra $50/unit on the 4-5million+ units they'll sell WW this fall/winter.

Prudent decision, and given the NPD numbers for Nov from Sony, it seems to have been a wise choice.

Did I say they couldn't cut-price full-stop? Or did I say that they couldn't cut-price at the same rate at Sony? They've been given plenty to cut their prices further (Europe, Australia and Canada for example).

Its a bit ignorant to ignore the fact there is more leeway for price-cutting in the PS3, especially given Sony's expertise in this area.

Also, I notice you said GTA could be a big help in Europe which is what I was responding to, so I'm not sure where NPD data comes into it. Given the price disparity (or lack thereof) and the relative brand strengths here, I see the influence of the forthcoming downloadable content questionable to say the least.

 

[AlphaWolf]

[/B]

Umm...I never said that, but Sony are earlier in their cycle than MS. Therefore, I think they're more willing to incur losses on their hardware sales at this point in time.

When you suggest that MS is unable to cut prices but that Sony is, that's really the only issue. Because of great software sales MS is actually in a better position to incur hardware losses than Sony. MS is just in a position where they haven't needed to cut prices so they can just ride their current price point and not lose money.

 

[one]

It's interesting to see if they contain the DLC in the 256MB limit of the Arcade memcard.