The Uncanny Valley

[fearsomepirate]

I just watched a video of Namco's engine they're using on Tekken 5 and realized water effects have hit the uncanny valley for me. I remember being amazed by Unreal 1 for having an effect that at least kinda sorta looked like water, same deal on Rebel Strike, Baldur's Gate (PS2), and Resident Evil 4. But now that things are splashing around in games like Bioshock and now this, all I can do is notice how unlike real water it looks.

Anyone else see the same thing, or think some other effect is in the uncanny valley for you?

 

[oramay]

I've seen the term "uncanny valley" used a lot but has yet to be convinced it's real. Has people actually done controlled experiments to see if people in general do experience this effect? Is there an example on the net that I can see the effect for myself? By example, I'm thinking of something like, starting with an extremely life-like, high polygon count, rich effects character model, then reduce the polygons and effects gradually until it looks like a PS1 in-game model. That should allow me to see whether my subjective sense of likeness really drop first, then rebound, and then drop again.

 

[vazel]

I've seen the term "uncanny valley" used a lot but has yet to be convinced it's real. Has people actually done controlled experiments to see if people in general do experience this effect? Is there an example on the net that I can see the effect for myself? By example, I'm thinking of something like, starting with an extremely life-like, high polygon count, rich effects character model, then reduce the polygons and effects gradually until it looks like a PS1 in-game model. That should allow me to see whether my subjective sense of likeness really drop first, then rebound, and then drop again.

Uncanny Valley is very real. Didn't you watch Final Fantasy: Spirits Within? Didn't the way people looked annoy or creep you out knowing they were striving for realism? That's Uncanny Valley.

I'm not sure there's such a thing as Uncanny Valley for non-humans though. For non-human renderings it either looks real or it doesn't. The thing about Uncanny Valley is that it involves a human's empathy towards other humans. Uncanny Valley is more of a creeped out feeling more than it is the ability to distinguish what is real or not.

 

[AlphaWolf]

For Shrek I believe they actually ran tests and based on viewer input they scaled back the realism of the fiona character.

 

[oramay]

... Didn't you watch Final Fantasy: Spirits Within? Didn't the way people looked annoy or creep you out knowing they were striving for realism? ...

I didn't watch the movie, only saw trailer. It didn't annoy or creep me at all. I actually thought it looked great, better than any CG I've seen at the time. :smile: To date, I haven't seen anything that makes me think I've experienced the uncanny valley.

 

[archangelmorph]

I just watched a video of Namco's engine they're using on Tekken 5 and realized water effects have hit the uncanny valley for me. I remember being amazed by Unreal 1 for having an effect that at least kinda sorta looked like water, same deal on Rebel Strike, Baldur's Gate (PS2), and Resident Evil 4. But now that things are splashing around in games like Bioshock and now this, all I can do is notice how unlike real water it looks.

Anyone else see the same thing, or think some other effect is in the uncanny valley for you?

I thought the water in bioshock looked pretty darn real..

The dynamics of the water however were pretty darn uncanny.. (pre-canned animations with no physics model..)

 

[Simon F]

I've seen the term "uncanny valley" used a lot but has yet to be convinced it's real. Has people actually done controlled experiments to see if people in general do experience this effect?

Perhaps you should have attended SIGGRAPH this year.

 

[_phil_]

''Uncanny valley" is human-likeness phenomenom. Unrealistic water has nothing to do in this particular valley.

 

[DieH@rd]

Heavy Rain trailer
Heavenly Sword
upcoming Beowulf CGI movie...

they all have their uncanny valley moments

 

[fearsomepirate]

I guess for me, "uncanny valley" is just when I start noticing what's going wrong rather than noticing what's going right. Maybe that's not really the accepted definition, though. With water effects, any time someone tries some sort of real-time splashing/waves, I stop noticing how the reflections look so much better than they did in the DX7 era and am thoroughly distracted by how horrible the waves and ripples look.

"Waving bedsheet" is to water effects what "wet plastic" is to normal mapping.

 

[Jedi2016]

I guess for me, "uncanny valley" is just when I start noticing what's going wrong rather than noticing what's going right. Maybe that's not really the accepted definition, though. With water effects, any time someone tries some sort of real-time splashing/waves, I stop noticing how the reflections look so much better than they did in the DX7 era and am thoroughly distracted by how horrible the waves and ripples look.

"Waving bedsheet" is to water effects what "wet plastic" is to normal mapping.

I think the term for that is "nitpicky".. hehe. Don't feel bad, though, I feel the same way. Even the best effects, like water in Bioshock, I say "Yeah, but it would look better if they did this or that..."

Uncanny Valley is traditionally used to describe human empathetic responses, as mentioned above. Wiki has a good article on it. To date, I don't think I've ever hit the Valley while playing a video game. The closest thing to it was the Final Fantasy: Spirits Within film. But I think I may have a certain immunity to the Valley in CGI because I know the processes so well. So rather than slipping into the Valley, I simply slip into picking apart the CGI.

 

[Nightz]

I didn't watch the movie, only saw trailer. It didn't annoy or creep me at all. I actually thought it looked great, better than any CG I've seen at the time. :smile: To date, I haven't seen anything that makes me think I've experienced the uncanny valley.

Not everyone is affected by Uncanny Valley. It doesn't bother me at all. I'd imagine that if you're scared of lifelike Wax Models and robots you'd probably be more susceptible to it. Alot of people are scared of Wax models they look human but not quite and thats what gets alot of people.