sword of the stars/sword of the stars 2

The original game is a good MOO2 replacement with a variable (between games and races) tech tree and some pretty big differences between races (esp. in moving between stars). Combat and graphics are it's weakest parts. If they are improved it will be a must buy.
 
Well its sort of out on Steam, hard copies a week or two away.

When I say sort of, its a huge debacle.
Buggy, poor performing & apparently incomplete.

Release was delayed at least twice then it seems like they made the decision that rather than another delay, to go ahead & knowingly release a very buggy, incomplete version in full knowledge that it'd cause outrage from people who bought it :oops:

Kerberos forums are basically down with the load but Paradox & Steam forums are full of complaints & official statements of contrition/promises to patch/complete the game post-release.


I just don't understand what could lead to that sort of decision.
The bad publicity of releasing a blatantly unfinished product has to be worse than the cost of a delay.

Lots of people who would otherwise have probably bought it, on hearing about this will move on & never touch it even if it turns out to be as legendary as it seems to promise after/if it gets properly patched.

Edit: Kerberos forums seem to be up again.
Also this from their main writer indicates they lost a bunch of coding talent in last year.
Not clear if they were 'left' or 'let go'.
Indications seem to be that Kerberos ran out of cash -> had to release or close up without release.
 
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Angry Joe Show guy has a summary of current awful state
Video has some of the really nice bits as they stand & very very nice they are.

I really really hope they will manage to fix it to properly playable state because it has a collection of really nice features, story & art, looks like the space 4X I always wanted to play (OK so not quite there but closest thing to it)
 
Tried the first one, got it cheap on steam...
Unfortunately, the GUI is quite bad, so uninstalled and £3.75 lost :(
 
From Kerberos CEO:
http://www.kerberos-productions.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=22033
Hey folks! Helluva weekend eh?

Welcome to the perfect storm of ♥♥♥♥ up made up of 40% Murphy's Law, 30% Chaos, 20% Overambition and 10% wishful thinking. And you have our deepest regrets for what it is worth as none of this was part of the plan.

I am tempted to go into full blown explanations but a) that starts to smack of making excuses and b) in reality I think the biggest things on people's minds right now judging from your posts is "Who's responsible?!!" and "What's going to be done?!!" And even when its time for explanations I am sure you would all rather hear about it in the context of "How this won't happen again".

That latter question is an easy one and best gotten out of the way quickly. "Who is responsible?"...I am. Half my job at Kerberos is to be the one that makes the hard call. What gets prioritized. What gets pulled. What gets released. What get accepted. And in many ways, what gets said. When push comes to shove, I am the one who makes the deal with the devil. When something is supposed to be watched, its me who has to know the answer. When the switch got thrown on the wrong build, costing many of you an extra big download and letting loose an extra buggy code base, I was in traffic instead of giving the yay or nay myself. That should not have been...hell I should have insisted nothing moved until the right code had been there and confirmed multiple times. Instead I blew it and bad things happened.

So lets set this straight here. When you are dealing with SotS2 this weekend and wondering quite rightly "Who is to blame for this?!!" The answer is me. NOT Paradox...NOT Steam and certainly NOT my team. All of those forces have been exemplary in helping deal with a bad situation. When it comes to who should be at the end of anyone's fingerpoint, it's just plain ol' me.


Ok...so now onto the real important thing...The Future of SotS2 and what you can count on.


First of all the bad news...Thanks to various factors we are now sitting on top of a pile of blown apart code and unstable features. The first thing you can expect though is stability. There will be an update tomorrow which will set right much of the chaos created friday in terms of crashing and keeping you from playing that game. What it WON'T do is magically add back in every piece of functionality. Gods know I wish that I had that magic wand but the reality is that path leads to more chaos and more broken gameplay sessions. Remember that part where I mentioned making the hard calls? This is another one of those. As much as the team wants to throw themselves at this like crazy people, I am not going to ok that. Instead we will go about this in a relatively sane and orderly fashion with regular updates that make sure everything that goes back in is as stable as possible before you see it. Oh I am sure some stuff will leak through, but at least that will be dealt with quickly and cleanly. Sorry to just put the hard facts to you straight without flowers but I think we are somewhat past the flowers make it all better stage of this relationship

What this means to you...

This plan means that you folks can expect at least 2 or 3 updates a week over the next month or so that will gradually make this game into what it should have been when the switch was pulled on friday. Soon after that you can expect personel in black suits to arrive at your house to flash a red light in your eyes. After that you will find yourself happy and enjoying the best release day ever and none of this will ever have happened.
Ok fine...I am a lil shakey on the last half of the plan but what I can tell you is that by the end of this period you WILL have more additional content than you would have under more ideal circumstances. Every update will go out with some thank you for your patience...some badges, extra maps, new nose art, more background entries. Basically whatever can be done alongside the priority path will be put in as well. The people out there who know Kerberos know that we support our games not just for weeks or months but for years. For all of you people new to us, please let me assure you that despite how your purchase may look at the moment, you can look forward to years of support. I would ask that you consider not giving up on us because it will literally take the end of the world for Kerberos and Paradox to give up on SotS2.


What I would like to ask of you...


Oh I know that is hardly what you expected to hear right now, but before your temperature rises, please hear me out becuase this portion is in reaction to ALL the posts I have read which seem to subdivide into certain clear groups.


If you are a Kerberos and/or a SotS fan then please just enjoy the game as you can over the next few weeks. I know you want to help as much as possible but to be honest you should NOT be rewarded for your support with more work. Your feedback is appreciated but in no means are you expected to act as testers or hunt bugs. Literally your patience and continued support is more than enough.

If you truely feel like you have been dumped into an unannounced beta test on this game, then please, I ask you to put the game away and not look at it till someone fires off the "all done" flag. I am not going to tell you that you should not feel this way. What I am going to say is that if you feel this way then you should not feel victimized any more than if you had made a pre-order and then been informed of a delay. I know this does not make it all right but at least it should make it clear that no one wants to use you as a beta tester nor was that ever the intent.

And finally, if you are in the camp that still feels robbed by the time you have reached this point of my post I can only offer what I can. We are fixing it and we need folks to either cheer, step aside or get out of the way cause vitriol is not going to help right now. If you demand a refund then I completely understand and you can be assured, the cost of that will make it directly to us. We will feel your "voting with your dollars", you can be sure about that and we accept that as fair play. On the other hand, if a free copy of the orginal SotS will help tide you over while we get this game shined from turnip to jewel, then please write to "contact@kerberos-productions.com" and we will set you up. If nothing else, if you are not familiar with how we support our products, you can play it and then ask the old-timers how much it changed over the years and that may reassure you.



So if you are still with me after this long post...let me summarize.

a) ♥♥♥♥ up
b) my fault
c) will be Completely fixed
d) fun stuff in many updates
e) Understanding of your position
f) Apology again and underserved request for faith and patience from people who don't know us.


That's about it folks. I hope this helps in some way or another. If enough people care, I will try and post a "Ways I can think of to prevent this from happening ever again". But otherwise its sunday and I got a whole lot of work to get done for tomorrow's update.

Once again, Regrets and our deepest thanks for whatever patience each one of you can offer.
--Martin Cirulis
CEO/Creative Director
Kerberos Productions

Meanwhile some people have been persevering & the ships really are very nice
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792CAA5D0A9765EDB6E0161AB6BFF0F6AC215D6F

MorrigiLV.png
 
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I prepurchased this solely because it stood on the greatness of Sword of the Stars 1. I'm not too happy to hear about the present state of the game. However I'm busy with BF3 right now so I can wait. They'd better use my money for patching the thing.
 
So-far there are 2 patches out fixing various bugs, with a bigger one scheduled for Friday.

Seem to be making good progress at bringing it closer to playable pretty quickly which is encouraging.

Also to encourage people to buy now rather than wait till its properly patched they are giving away the Immersion Pack DLCs (texture/icon packs) if you buy before 30 Nov (presumably 'buy' = buy on steam/install from CD).
http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?568294-Free-DLCs-until-Nov-30th&
Free DLCs until Nov 30th

Hi all,

First of all, we would like to thank you for sticking with us so far. Many of you have been in touch with us over this past week with praise and rage and we're doing our best to follow up with you all individually via our support. We are also reading what you are posting here and passing on information to the developers. While Kerberos are hard at work on the game, we've looked into what we can do in the meantime for everyone as a "thank you for your support".

All gamers who have bought or will buy Sots II up until November 30th will receive the following DLCs/Immersion packs: Liir & Morrigi + Hiver & Tarka + Suulka.

The DLCs will show up on your account sometime between now and November 30th (please note - you do not need to take any type of action to receive them, you will see on your account when they have arrived). It will not matter where you have purchased your copy of Sword of the Stars II, it will be the same for all.

Thank you and we'll continue to see you here on the boards.

Paradox & Kerberos
 
Hmmm. Well we shall see if they get it cleaned up. It somewhat reminds me of the Elemental War of Magic disaster but this sounds less ugly.
 
Then they should of died
rip-off customer vs any scenario you can think of
There is no justification to rip off customers ever......
 
I'm kinda with davros here. It's not okay to release a broken alpha build to customers who paid for a finished product and then explain to them after the fact that they will be beta testing the game for the next few months.
 
This is one of those learning moments where people discover that impulse buying is dumb. ;)
 
I'm kinda with davros here.

Wow, normally I get
"It's not possible to make a bug free program" ,
"With all the different configs you cant expect a program to work" ,
"You have no idea how much work is involved in making a game therefore you have no right to complain"
 
Wow, normally I get
"It's not possible to make a bug free program" ,
"With all the different configs you cant expect a program to work" ,
"You have no idea how much work is involved in making a game therefore you have no right to complain"

What they've done is knowingly sell a broken product that's not fit for purpose. In any other field of business, this would be totally illegal. The software industry tries to do an end run around consumer protection law by claiming you're only buying a licence rather than a product, and that your licence terms absolves them from providing anything that works properly. This is the language of thieves and conmen, and publishers wonder why people prefer to download a copy without paying rather than be conned out of their cash.

Kerberos may have a fanbase that loves them and is willing to forgive them for this crap, but in the long run it's going to damage their business, and lose them customers.
 
I think the choice they had was "con our loyal fanbase out of their money or die".

If the finished (or at least near finished) code did exist and they simply uploaded the wrong build, that's one thing. But the game is apparently nowhere near finished and is in an essentially unplayable state. Nowhere on the store page was this explained. So the people who bought it were conned out of their money.
 
Yeah this sounds exactly like what went down with that Elemental War of Magic strategy game. Their fearless leader also came out to apologize for his ineptitude and ask forgiveness for screwing over customers, with promises of patching as well. I didn't really keep up with that disaster though.
 
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