R520 benchmarks - Hardware Analysis
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Kombatant
Regular
ssassen said:
I've talked to Andrzej quite a few times myself, and I will agree with what you said there. So why don't you post the whole conversation, in order to justify yourself? I don't see the harm in that. You won't do any smear campaign, you will just reinstate the truth.
Geo,
No, not the hitcount, but we were really covering some ground in the pages that were lost a shame that we'll have to do without all that and basically start from scratch. I don't know about you but I kinda hate repeating on myself all the time.
Regards,
Sander Sassen
http://www.hardwareanalysis.com
No, not the hitcount, but we were really covering some ground in the pages that were lost a shame that we'll have to do without all that and basically start from scratch. I don't know about you but I kinda hate repeating on myself all the time.
Regards,
Sander Sassen
http://www.hardwareanalysis.com
wireframe said:
I hardly consider business emails as being "private". I would consider the email being private if it was, say, discussing health concerns or habbits or cooking recipes or living styles. But the emails published were entirely related to a business matter. Most, if noy all, companies even have policies stating that all emails are considered property of the company, and one should not expect any privacy when using company communication resources (email, ims, desk phones, cell phones).
As for laws, at least in the states... Most, if not all, states have laws that are considered to be 1-Party centric. That is, if this was any other form of communications such as verbal or in person (audio-recording or video-recording), only one party engaged in the action needs to know that said actions are being recorded. That also extends to publishing of said actions; only one side needs to give consent. Now I realize ATI is located in Canada and Sanders may be located elsewhere, but I believe these laws can serve as a reasonable basis for what one can expect.
These emails serve to show motivation behind a person's actions. Now ATI could have claimed that was his intent without publishing the transcript of the conversion, but then it would be more of a he-said/she-said deal. That would have made matters even messier. Then everyone would just claim ATI was doing damage control and trying to spin things.
Oh, I do too. In fact, I'm not even going to start re-lambasting your article. 
Tho I reserve the right to change my mind as new facts appear.
But I will do this. Since my documented offer to apologize to you if the broad range of actual R520 XT benchmarks in the p/reviews support yours has gone away, I re-document it here.
Tho after the emails from ATI, it will not be as fulsome as it would otherwise have been, should it prove necessary. And I think that's a pretty low-order probability anyway, frankly.
Tho I reserve the right to change my mind as new facts appear.But I will do this. Since my documented offer to apologize to you if the broad range of actual R520 XT benchmarks in the p/reviews support yours has gone away, I re-document it here.
Tho after the emails from ATI, it will not be as fulsome as it would otherwise have been, should it prove necessary. And I think that's a pretty low-order probability anyway, frankly.
Kombatant
Regular
Btw Ryan over at R3D got some more statements from ATI:
Here: http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?threadid=33829017
Here: http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?threadid=33829017
I'll do that for our site but it's a bit of a problem for others!ssassen said:
That's the second time you've insinuated that I've done this on purpose. I've already made it clear, and others seem to have accepted this okay, that this was an accident, to which I've apologised for.
Regeneration
Newcomer
Hello guys,
I really dont care about the benchmarks because the results in every benchmark is not 100% accurate. There are alot of issues around hardware and since the X1800 is new then we should expect some issues around it like every other new product arrival. It really bothers me to see this become into personal fight and private emails appear on headlines and alot of weird accusations without facts. Even if it's real or not ATI should ignore it and not leak private emails to websites. What kind of behavior is it? If he really threaten then they could sue him. Sander can you please post the entire mail log?
Best Regards,
I really dont care about the benchmarks because the results in every benchmark is not 100% accurate. There are alot of issues around hardware and since the X1800 is new then we should expect some issues around it like every other new product arrival. It really bothers me to see this become into personal fight and private emails appear on headlines and alot of weird accusations without facts. Even if it's real or not ATI should ignore it and not leak private emails to websites. What kind of behavior is it? If he really threaten then they could sue him. Sander can you please post the entire mail log?
Best Regards,
Kombatant,
I don't know if I should to be honest, which sounds like a sorry excuse. Just because they stoop down to that level and post part of an email conversation should I then post it fully? How does that help the situation? DH's Zordan, Allan, the site owner, just said I posted in their thread under a different name, which I obviously didn't as I have nothing to hide, I post under my own name, or I don't post at all. So when people resort to lying about me, like Allan has, what am I to do? I'm sure they'll say that email thread is made up as well etc.
http://www.driverheaven.net/showpost.php?p=681050&postcount=57
Regards,
Sander Sassen
http://www.hardwareanalysis.com
I don't know if I should to be honest, which sounds like a sorry excuse. Just because they stoop down to that level and post part of an email conversation should I then post it fully? How does that help the situation? DH's Zordan, Allan, the site owner, just said I posted in their thread under a different name, which I obviously didn't as I have nothing to hide, I post under my own name, or I don't post at all. So when people resort to lying about me, like Allan has, what am I to do? I'm sure they'll say that email thread is made up as well etc.
http://www.driverheaven.net/showpost.php?p=681050&postcount=57
Regards,
Sander Sassen
http://www.hardwareanalysis.com
I find the way this thread going highly inappropriate. Why some people disclose/encourage to disclose personal communication? This is a public place where people discuss over facts and opinions, not a chatting room. Such a low level interest is what feeds the yellow journalism in the first place.
lop
Who is this Andrzej Bania character?
lop
Who is this Andrzej Bania character?
BRiT said:
What I meant by private is that we can see in these emails that it is two people talking, Sassen and Bania, and it is addressed personally, not HardwareAnalysis to ATI. Now, if you want to talk legalities, maybe Bania's emails don't belong to him either and are the property of his employer; ATI.
These emails are obviously some sort of private "negotiations" between two people. Presumably, Bania acts on behalf of ATI or under some other authority within the organization (I don't know who decides who goes to Ibiza and who doesn't...is that Bania's job?) The point is that if there are some complications between two organizations, you don't normally see individuals bickering and releasing any evidence they have to wave in front of the audience. The normal, and more mature approach, in my opinion, is for the matter to be escalated within the company (ATI), an action decided on and then followed through. If, as you suggest with the legalities of the emails, this means some sort of legal recourse, then I would expect the emails to be produced then, before a court and not waved as some immediate response on some website "look! look what he said!" That, IMHO, just seems very silly. I could see this happening the other way around and somewhat overlook it, but I would not expect this behavior from a corporation or a person representing a corporation. This is what the "little guy" does to get attention, not the big boys.
This should be taken in context with the very weird "smear campaign" that ATI seem to have concocted ad hoc. By being so "wordy" in their response they seem to give HardwareAnalysis some credibility points. Instead of a nebulous statement of denial on some website they have sputtered out these very silly responses. ATI has also managed to put their foot in their mouth by inadvertently stating that R520 XT is not ready for release and boards don't even exist for testing purposes yet (in their claim to refute the possibility that the benhmarks in question were conducted on such a board). I dunno, it just looks like a very sloppy response or a sequence of responses by an individual or small group of individuals that are panicking instead of the slow moving bulldozer we are used to seeing from large corporations.
Kombatant
Regular
ssassen said:
To defend yourself. Hell, If I was attacked like that, and I had the full email correspondence which would prove my innocence, I would post it. It's an email correspondence, which is business, not personal. So really don't see the problem, honest.
As for the DH thing, that account was made from the same subnet as your account. But that's a different story which I won't even touch in here, it's totally irrelevant.
wireframe said:
perhaps because it is happening over the weekend and everyone is off we will see the proper response come monday... anyhooo... it is fun to watch
Nick,
Mind PM-ing me your email, I'd like to email another part of the original thread (thanks Mr J).
Regards,
Sander Sassen
http://www.hardwareanalysis.com
Mind PM-ing me your email, I'd like to email another part of the original thread (thanks Mr J).
Regards,
Sander Sassen
http://www.hardwareanalysis.com
Neeyik said:
He must have an excuse to stop posting here... The truth is out there and we are starting to understand it....
http://www.driverheaven.net/#news85118
Even if the numbers were correct there is no professionalism in here at all - this is not the way of making business - you have no right in doing this. Shame on you!
Regeneration
Newcomer
Simple Logic:
No logical person will threat some major guy in a big corporation unless it's a joke.
No logical person will threat some major guy in a big corporation unless it's a joke.
It's just neeyik@ for the Beyond3D.com name - Natoma is sending me some stuff over but it won't get done until tomorrow (it's bedtime for me!). To be honest, I'm expected this thread to be enormous by then and if it's not close to be locked due to heated arguments I'll be quite surprised; either way though, I think it would be best for me to just post up the comments made in the original thread and then close this one down - purely because I suspect that the debate will be "done", ie. nothing more to add, only the same arguments being used again and again. As somebody has already pointed out, this probably isn't the best place to resolve matters of a personal nature.ssassen said:
Regeneration
Newcomer
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