R520 benchmarks - Hardware Analysis
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Supreet Virdi
Newcomer
Hello guys this is Supeet Virdi from Hardware Analysis. I am glad to see a community with such open minded thoughts. I've been flamed there (Hardwareanalsysi) on many numerous occasions for having an Anti-Nvidia attitude. I signed-up today to reply here, and I think I'll be comming here in the future also. Good work guys 
First of all, I must say I am also shocked to see all this, I've been a member of Hardware Analysis from almost three (3) years now, and from what I know about Sander Sassen is, he's very calm, distinguished, intelligent & sensible Gentlemen. I don't exactly know the relationships between Sander & Chris Hook, but somehow I figured it out they don't like each other for some reasons I don't know and I don't want to know.
My initial response to that Article is the following thread, which I concluded:
http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/48955/
I was too eager to see those anticipated Benchmarks, I completely ignored the first page what was written on it, I guess it was mistake by my, (but I was excited ).
I know there are several other things you could do to enhance a chip performance like by increasing operations & Instructions per clock, higher Memory Interface and many otherthings. Even if R520 board has 16 Pixel Parallel Pipelines, but by no means makes it weaker compared to 7800GTX. From time to time I 've said on numerous occasions over Hardware Analysis is that ATI isn't stupid, they exactly know what they are doing. And what I find funny is when a 15 year old stupid kid comes up with a reply and flames ATI Inc. which is in Graphic Industry from over 20 years. I am completely exhausted at the moment, from time to time I told them (community) to stop at once and get their brain working in pefect condition and wait for the final results, but now at this moment Hardware Analysis is being ignored by almost everyone, and maybe that's exactly I was thinking few days ago.
I don't know what the truth is, and I am definately expecting the final board to be lot faster than what was displayed earlier by Sander, as it sure make some sense that why R520 is priced higher than its fastest competitor and it took ATI almost 4-5 Months to make it, which shows they really worked hard for the final specs. I still have a respect for Sander Sassen, as his older articles were 100% correct in my opinion, but this time I believe Sander was COMPLETELY wrong to release those benchmarks too early, he literally ignored the consequences of it, he trusted a board partner without even knowing the full details. It's proved that Sander has some problems with ATI, but it makes me hard to believe that he did it intentionally. His intentions was to bring some fun, but may be he wasn't aware of this situtations, like we are already witnessing it right now. He already lost is credibility & professionalism, and from future people would think thrice before reading his reviews & articles.
I've been a huge ATI fan, and always trusted ATI and I have defended its integrity over Hardware Analysis from time to time. I am just waiting for the final outcome, and I am sure ATI won't disappoint us. They always try to implement something better as far as technology goes. And I always find ATI image quality much pleasing to eyes.
I would urge everybody to lets just wait for the final outcome, as I am also expecting it easily outclass its competitor i.e., 7800GTX by good difference, may be then those few peoples who have some queries may get solved.
Also I am expecting Crossfire to easily trounce SLI, from what I've read on papers, Crossfire seems much better.
Let's just not flame Sander more please, he's also a human and only humans can do mistake not a video card. And I am talking from both prespective at the moment. Sure what Sander did is not acceptable and he should've think twice before posting those benchmarks, but all in all just let it go this time, I know ATI is kind to everyone and will think into this issue more.
And for the 3D Mark 05' I predict, it will be close to 8600 points.
Thanks for reading guys, and I am glad to be a part of this community also. Thanks a lot
First of all, I must say I am also shocked to see all this, I've been a member of Hardware Analysis from almost three (3) years now, and from what I know about Sander Sassen is, he's very calm, distinguished, intelligent & sensible Gentlemen. I don't exactly know the relationships between Sander & Chris Hook, but somehow I figured it out they don't like each other for some reasons I don't know and I don't want to know.
My initial response to that Article is the following thread, which I concluded:
http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/topic/48955/
I was too eager to see those anticipated Benchmarks, I completely ignored the first page what was written on it, I guess it was mistake by my, (but I was excited
).I know there are several other things you could do to enhance a chip performance like by increasing operations & Instructions per clock, higher Memory Interface and many otherthings. Even if R520 board has 16 Pixel Parallel Pipelines, but by no means makes it weaker compared to 7800GTX. From time to time I 've said on numerous occasions over Hardware Analysis is that ATI isn't stupid, they exactly know what they are doing. And what I find funny is when a 15 year old stupid kid comes up with a reply and flames ATI Inc. which is in Graphic Industry from over 20 years. I am completely exhausted at the moment, from time to time I told them (community) to stop at once and get their brain working in pefect condition and wait for the final results, but now at this moment Hardware Analysis is being ignored by almost everyone, and maybe that's exactly I was thinking few days ago.
I don't know what the truth is, and I am definately expecting the final board to be lot faster than what was displayed earlier by Sander, as it sure make some sense that why R520 is priced higher than its fastest competitor and it took ATI almost 4-5 Months to make it, which shows they really worked hard for the final specs. I still have a respect for Sander Sassen, as his older articles were 100% correct in my opinion, but this time I believe Sander was COMPLETELY wrong to release those benchmarks too early, he literally ignored the consequences of it, he trusted a board partner without even knowing the full details. It's proved that Sander has some problems with ATI, but it makes me hard to believe that he did it intentionally. His intentions was to bring some fun, but may be he wasn't aware of this situtations, like we are already witnessing it right now. He already lost is credibility & professionalism, and from future people would think thrice before reading his reviews & articles.
I've been a huge ATI fan, and always trusted ATI and I have defended its integrity over Hardware Analysis from time to time. I am just waiting for the final outcome, and I am sure ATI won't disappoint us. They always try to implement something better as far as technology goes. And I always find ATI image quality much pleasing to eyes.
I would urge everybody to lets just wait for the final outcome, as I am also expecting it easily outclass its competitor i.e., 7800GTX by good difference, may be then those few peoples who have some queries may get solved.
Also I am expecting Crossfire to easily trounce SLI, from what I've read on papers, Crossfire seems much better.
Let's just not flame Sander more please, he's also a human and only humans can do mistake not a video card. And I am talking from both prespective at the moment. Sure what Sander did is not acceptable and he should've think twice before posting those benchmarks, but all in all just let it go this time, I know ATI is kind to everyone and will think into this issue more.
And for the 3D Mark 05' I predict, it will be close to 8600 points.
Thanks for reading guys, and I am glad to be a part of this community also. Thanks a lot
Alright, as promised I would post a reply to Andrzej's post, detailing my side of the story. It is available at the below url, in HTML or can be downloaded as a PDF for easy viewing.
Slander Sander? A reply to ATI - HTML
http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/article/1814/
Slander Sander? A reply to ATI - PDF
http://hardwareanalysis.com/images/articles/large/11602.pdf
Regards,
Sander Sassen
http://www.hardwareanalysis.com
Slander Sander? A reply to ATI - HTML
http://www.hardwareanalysis.com/content/article/1814/
Slander Sander? A reply to ATI - PDF
http://hardwareanalysis.com/images/articles/large/11602.pdf
Regards,
Sander Sassen
http://www.hardwareanalysis.com
Something else, would it be possible/appropriate to split the guessing game off from this thread..? It's quite "fun" (and that might be a good for a change here) but doesn't have much to do with the HA <> ATi issue. Plus I'm afraid we soon have to go look for the serious posts between the number-guessing posts
Sander, You're interpreting the facts wrong..
you were invited as a journalist and the e-mail says that 6 overclockers have also been bcc'ed .. you automatically asume you're one of the 6 elite journalists in the world invited to the event...
you were invited as a journalist and the e-mail says that 6 overclockers have also been bcc'ed .. you automatically asume you're one of the 6 elite journalists in the world invited to the event...
Last edited by a moderator:
Jawed
Legend
ssassen said:
Until you post your full benchmarks and scripts, you're wasting your breath.
I for one will not take anything you say seriously until you comply with the repeated requests to furnish the community with independent verification of your benchmarking methods.
Your continued refusal to do so indicates that you don't have any confidence in your methods and so everything else you might say is absolutely worthless.
Jawed
Supreet Virdi
Newcomer
Tim said:
Alright, we shall see.
Kombatant
Regular
Sander,
I read your side of the story. That still doesn't justify what you did mate - any serious journalist would never publish a thing like that, even with huge disclaimers in the beginning (imo). The Inq might post those, but not a website that considers itself as "serious". Plus, you continuously fail to provide us with your benchmarking scripts and methodologies, as already said.
I read your side of the story. That still doesn't justify what you did mate - any serious journalist would never publish a thing like that, even with huge disclaimers in the beginning (imo). The Inq might post those, but not a website that considers itself as "serious". Plus, you continuously fail to provide us with your benchmarking scripts and methodologies, as already said.
I guess 9701 bob!
"R300King!, come on up, you're the next lucky winner on 'guess that mark!'"
Andrzej, give us a multiple choice option of 3 choices or something. I mean, come on, it's not like nVidia is gonna find this stuff out and have their counter punch card out within the next 2 weeks, right? It would be nice to have a multiple choice AND possibly one of those choices being the MINIMUM for one of those choices.
Honestly, I truely believe it to be in ATis best interest to share numbers early. Some people have already run out and bought a 7800GTX after seeing HA "fake" R520 numbers. I'm dead serious. If the gamers here knew of just the MINIMUM of the R520XT's 05Marks are then that would surely save ATi some sales. Guaranteed. I for one. Hey, ATi may even give you a raise for saving them customers.
"R300King!, come on up, you're the next lucky winner on 'guess that mark!'"
Andrzej, give us a multiple choice option of 3 choices or something. I mean, come on, it's not like nVidia is gonna find this stuff out and have their counter punch card out within the next 2 weeks, right?
It would be nice to have a multiple choice AND possibly one of those choices being the MINIMUM for one of those choices. Honestly, I truely believe it to be in ATis best interest to share numbers early. Some people have already run out and bought a 7800GTX after seeing HA "fake" R520 numbers. I'm dead serious. If the gamers here knew of just the MINIMUM of the R520XT's 05Marks are then that would surely save ATi some sales. Guaranteed. I for one. Hey, ATi may even give you a raise for saving them customers.
ssassen said:
To be brutally honest, having read this document, you come off as being hugely unprofessional in some of those e-mails, joking or otherwise. Having dealt with a fair few IHV and AIB contacts myself (Including Andrzej) I know that I would never dream of making some of the comments seen in your response in any shape or form - I like a joke as much as the next man, but I'd also like to think I know where to draw the line. It seems that you crossed that line, to the point where a simple apology wasn't enough, and now you've exacerbated that issue by producing this current debacle.
But hey, hopefully once you've released all your benchmarking scripts for public analysis everything will become clear.
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