PSX3 and PSP blamed for Sony Group's poor performance..

[Paul]

I don't know if this is his or anything.. But I found it at a Starbucks.

Glad you had your laugh. Don't do it again or I will lock the thread.

 

[Vince]

I do believe I've just wet myself from laughter

 

[randycat99]

Man, don't lose it then. It could be worth a lot of money one day!

 

[Paul]

I do believe I'm about to be banned.

Vince, Randy, Pana, everyone; It's been a good 1200+ posts with you guys but I feel the end coming. But it was worth it.

See ya.

 

[randycat99]

What? Are you being serious?! What could be the possible justification?

 

[Vince]

What? Are you being serious?! What could be the possible justification?

Hmm, agreed. I do believe you'll be ok. Fear not. We can show the glove doesn't fit, thus they must acquit.

 

[notAFanB]

What? Are you being serious?! What could be the possible justification?

guys, funni or not maybe that should have been a PM.

 

[randycat99]

Geez, tough crowd here at B3D, it seems. Can we all just loosen up a bit?

 

[chaphack]

I can see we are all diverging here. may I suggest we each clarify what we think CELL will mean in the grand schemes of things for the Sony group?

Yeay! Think some of you are missing me. So my engrish explessons are not as strong, but please bear with me...

You see, me see Cell, codenamed cpu of the broadband(BB) era, as just that. A cpu/architecture that does the BB from non-PC like devices. You can surf the net from your TV, purchase from realtime ads, time-download-record-playback a HD movie from SoNet to your BR player, surf wireless from you PDA, get realtime stocks update, locate your position via GPRS etc.

THAT, i think is what Sony grand schemes of a Cell is. Nothing extraordinary, since you can do most of that today, just that with Cell, Sony is in control, Sony has their own defined chips/architecture, a Sony internal standard if you will. Smart Electronic(SE) i call them.

 

[chaphack]

But you see, BB today isnt all that is. Do you think people are enticed to switch over SE, claimed to be the delievery of BB, only to have to wait 1-2hrs to download a HD movie? Of coz, you still need them to buy up the subscriptions to SoNet first. There is also a common thing called PC.

Also, will a CAKE BR player download-record-playback a HD movie format from SoNet, on a Cell TV? Will it be like electronics today(DVD plays on any player) or like WinOS vs OSX(with their own extensions). Will Linux help?

Which makes me to the thinketh. Anyone know the cost of conventional TV cpu vs one with a PPC architecture? Probably it is cheaper for Sony to do their own SE ICs(instead of buying from say Intel) but its still risky to go all SE when their own BB architecture is not even up yet!

 

[chaphack]

I still think their Cell roadmap *might* be just a PS3, a Cell terminal and a Cell handheld. And not everything SE everywhere within Sony! Unless of coz, a Cell TV is cheaper to make than conventional TV.

A test-bed to enable checks on how normal users take up to such SE and applications. Normal users, that have shown so far, a resistance to widespread changes...

IF they are successful, and IF the technology and architecture are finally in place, and IF there still isnt an agreed standard in BB SE era, then maybe Cell might just become the next big thing, the flag bearer, Cell-tronics will be just like x86 today.

IF like i said..IF...

Thats about the crutch of what i think. Hope it is clear enough to geddit. Forgive if my expressions is weak...

 

[randycat99]

This is drugs....this is your brain on drugs...get the picture?

 

[Panajev2001a]

Chap, CELL can be implemented with any ISA ( the PU part ), as long as the APU part is fine, you are all set.

I just wanted to clarify this.

 

[Josiah]

IMO Cell was designed specifically for PS3, using it in other devices is just an attempt to recoup the R&D money. It will be interesting to see if IBM finds a use for it in their mainframes.

 

[Panajev2001a]

Disagreeing with your ridiculous optimism does not equate trolling.

You know, you're totally correct. If all disagreements were like yours or based on a factual and plausible basis, then we wouldn't have these problems. But, DeadmeatGA here is not only the spiritual father of the PS2 (the pre-VU1 iteration before the scary Sega people frightened Ken to timetravel back and put in a VU1), he also thought up the Cell and is claiming to know things about the architecture and it's licensing model that he just doesn't. Shit, it probably doesn't even exist yet.

This is trolling in it's purest form. Yet, it's so pure it's frightening because he truely believes this utter BS. I disgress so harshly from his posts that I can't even respond to them because I'll loose all semblence of composure and just tell him that he's a retarded ass; and not because it's Sony he's talking about, but because it's an insult to the rest of us that he expects us to believe, follow, or even contimplate these insane thoughts.

Cell was clearly designed for the CE enviroment and Ando or Kutaragi or IBM has said as much in the past. Yet, he keeps saying it's not. He's to ignorant to inquire into the STI agreement and instead says that Sony doesn't "own" Cell but will be paying IBM (WTF?) - which is wrong. He keeps bashing these mystical "tools" yet he doesn't know anything, he bashes the architecture as often as possible latching on to any "current" arguing point that sticks, yet his knowledge on the matter is limited. It's not right, it's not deserving of a place here.

*The Kutaragi article is a great reread for those who don't have a clue what's going on - of which I can think of a few people.

Within it, Kutaragi talks of the product differentiation this will bring that I speak of and explains how Sony's Semiconductors and Cell differ from the fallicious comparasons to Samsung, et al that some make. Among much more, so if you have a few minutes to spare...

Vince, I called in Samsung as in ideology they are close to what can be considered the new Sony and can explaing why Sony is investign so much in Semiconductor R&D ( $4 Billions to CELL R&D and $4 Billions to Semiconductor R&D ).

Producing things in house efficiently has been one of the several keys of the success Samsung experiments and I think that increase production of internally used ICs could allow Sony to keep following the bleeding edge tech and achieve higher profitability in the long run.

Cybamerc,

well, sometimes... just sometimes I do put some thought into it and base my views on rational thoughts... keep that in mind.

I will do the first step and give you the benefit of doubt and admit you do the same.

 

[notAFanB]

But you see, BB today isnt all that is. Do you think people are enticed to switch over SE, claimed to be the delievery of BB, only to have to wait 1-2hrs to download a HD movie? Of coz, you still need them to buy up the subscriptions to SoNet first. There is also a common thing called PC.

correct, however I would like to point out that the PC is pretty much moot as far as home penetration is concerned.

THAT, i think is what Sony grand schemes of a Cell is. Nothing extraordinary, since you can do most of that today, just that with Cell, Sony is in control, Sony has their own defined chips/architecture, a Sony internal standard if you will. Smart Electronic(SE) i call them.

except that you can't do most of that today...yet. it is simply too fragmented. coversely the only device where there 'features' are available in any coherent form is the PC, and that isn't exactly gunning for the living room.


the integration simply isn't there as of yet and this is the 'grand' vision that alot of coporations would like to pursue. I can see MS long term vision as something along the lines of this.

 

[PC-Engine]

Anyway, should there be a "Cell"-Forum I would hope it has a lot better track record then DVD one, which is all but ignored by any companies that have an idea to create a new format anyhow, especially if they are members of the forum.

Pioneer and Philips both have dual layer recordable DVD media already and plan on submitting their proposed formats to the DVD Forum. Next year we'll be able to buy cheap dual layer DVD recorders while Blu-ray is still struggling to gain momentum.

 

[Panajev2001a]

Anyway, should there be a "Cell"-Forum I would hope it has a lot better track record then DVD one, which is all but ignored by any companies that have an idea to create a new format anyhow, especially if they are members of the forum.

Pioneer and Philips both have dual layer recordable DVD media already and plan on submitting their proposed formats to the DVD Forum. Next year we'll be able to buy cheap dual layer DVD recorders while Blu-ray is still struggling to gain momentum.

Interesting, but somehow I doubt those two companies are sand-baggind Blu-Ray

 

[PC-Engine]

Anyway, should there be a "Cell"-Forum I would hope it has a lot better track record then DVD one, which is all but ignored by any companies that have an idea to create a new format anyhow, especially if they are members of the forum.

Pioneer and Philips both have dual layer recordable DVD media already and plan on submitting their proposed formats to the DVD Forum. Next year we'll be able to buy cheap dual layer DVD recorders while Blu-ray is still struggling to gain momentum.

Interesting, but somehow I doubt those two companies are sand-baggind Blu-Ray

No they're not sand bagging, they just got smarter by submitting their proposals to the DVD Forum instead of going it alone and taking the risk of trying to get industry support for their own format which may or may not take off without the DVD Forums approval. With Blu-ray, there's no standard. One player may support MPEG4 while another will not or one player may support DVD record/playback while another doesn't

With the release of red laser dual layer DVD recorders on the horizon Blu-ray just got pushed back further since current DVDRW drives are approaching the $100 now. Also with 8X DVDRW drives available now Blu-ray is becoming less attractive for the immediate future...

 

[Panajev2001a]

With Blu-ray, there's no standard

Not correct: there are two standards worked by the Blu-Ray Founding Members ( who are thinking about a sort of Blu-Ray forum ): Re-Writeable and Read-Only.

Also, about Philips...

This was the original list of Blu-Ray Group Members ( before Mitsubishi and others jumped on board ): Hitachi, LG, Matsushita (Panasonic), Pioneer, Philips, Samsung, Sharp, Sony, and Thomson.