PC Gamer cover story on Doom3

[Laa-Yosh]

There are some scans circulating on the web from the 8-page article in PC Gamer which simply blow my socks off. Right now none of the major news sites have them, but this should change soon (unless PC Gamer can get them to pull the content). Meanwhile here's a link to a hungarian web page, but it might give up if too many of you guys try to grab the images:
www.hardwired.hu

 

[T2k]

I've got my issue last Friday... actually it's called "Doom III The World Exclusive Special Issue"...
(OFF: Heh, according to a reader's letter, after eliminating all of the XXXXX editions/issues/packs, it appears that only 37 original PC games have ever been made! )

It's a 10-pages article - covers everything: gameplay, a bit development and -of course - Carmack.

Yeah and there are helluva' huge pics from the game and art...

 

[marco]

Woaw! Again woaw. Everytime Id builds an new engine, it's leaps ahead over the competition. This time again. I can only hope that Carmack does not decide to leave earth and go into space, so that he won't be developing game engines anymore....

 

[no_way]

this "gameplay" they are trying to achieve .. i'd say its been done before. System Shock 2 is the game that i will always remember. Because it was scary as hell. And it was scary in many ways, not just throwing pure "blood and a million teeth" terror at you.
Graphically, DOOM3 is impressive, but i dont think its so far ahead of competition as all the hype would have you believe. There are other development houses, focusing purely on graphics engines, that have pretty much caught up with iD in this department.

 

[OpenGL guy]

Graphically, DOOM3 is impressive, but i dont think its so far ahead of competition as all the hype would have you believe. There are other development houses, focusing purely on graphics engines, that have pretty much caught up with iD in this department.

I've not seen or heard of anything that is close to DOOM3's graphic quality, particularly with respect to the per pixel lighting.

I can't speak for the gameplay, but I'll probably buy the game even if it gets the worst reviews ever just to marvel at the graphics!

 

[Dave Baumann]

Those models look too low in poly detail. The texture/bump detail is fantastic though.

I think I need to see this in action.

 

[Laa-Yosh]

Most of the time the monsters won't get close to you, and you'll run in 800*600 anyway - so there are enough polygons.

Also, these models aren't that more lowpoly than other games out there today. It's just the incredible shading that makes it more evident.

 

[Riptides]

Okay, i gotta admit, the pics look great.. the tech sounds awesome.
I am totally prepared to be blown away by the visuals, and will probably need a slew of upgrades before i can enjoy this game to its fullest.. VISUALLY.

But from what i have read. After the Oooh's and Aaaah's of the eyecandy, i have a sinking feeling that the game otherwise, is going to totally be unfulfilling. In fact from the article, this game sounds about as drab as every game that has come along on the coattails of the orig. Doom.

My gripes:
1. No Alternate Fire on any weapons.. how inspiring.
2. The same set of weapons featured in the orig. Doom. How nice, we are on a planet in a future setting, and we will be running around with chainsaws, pistols, shotgun, and mini-gun while trying to conserve ammo for the Pulse rifle and BFG... yet again..
3. Totally static environment. so other than the buttons that open doors.. Carmack believes that if we have more things to monkey around with in the game it can only take away from our gaming experience.
4. Oh what an "original" intro they have planned, getting to walk around the facility, talking to scientists and guards. Before the sci's do something nutty to open that 4th demension gate and bring fourth the spawn of hell.
Lets just hope they don't include the levels that take us into the aliens world this time @ the end of the game.. wait.. they did include that.. great..

Okay i will quit there.
Don't get me wrong, i see what they are after here.. total visual ecstacy.. and that i think we will get. But even in the interview they are already being apologetic about the gameplay (mediocre AI and Multi, they mention), while continually hyping the graphics. I mean for them to bring something this good to the table visually, why couldn't they do it all the way with a kick-ass gaming experience. For now its coming across as being a 3-D extravaganzza with a half-assed game attached. As far as it goes, this game seems like it is going to lie somewhere in a mix of Half-Life (game progression) System Shock (fear factor), and orig. Doom (weapons and monsters).

 

[Laa-Yosh]

You may need to read the article again

1. No Alternate Fire on any weapons.. how inspiring.

9-10 weapons are already more than enough.

2. The same set of weapons featured in the orig. Doom. How nice, we are on a planet in a future setting, and we will be running around with chainsaws, pistols, shotgun, and mini-gun while trying to conserve ammo for the Pulse rifle and BFG... yet again..

No running around, notice that you'll have stamina.

3. Totally static environment. so other than the buttons that open doors.. Carmack believes that if we have more things to monkey around with in the game it can only take away from our gaming experience.

Instead of use button, you have Flash-like interfaces for many little things in the game, and also a PDA, NPCs, and lots of scripted enviromental actions.

4. Oh what an "original" intro they have planned, getting to walk around the facility, talking to scientists and guards.

How original was Half-life. I mean you see a 3D world from a first person view, what's new in that? So you se that there might be plenty of room for doing things differently...

As far as it goes, this game seems like it is going to lie somewhere in a mix of Half-Life (game progression) System Shock (fear factor), and orig. Doom (weapons and monsters).

I dunno, I'd give that a

 

[Dave B(TotalVR)]

No, the models are deliberately low in polygon count, because doom is the kind of game where you will find one monster jump out at you all of a sudden and then the next corner will have 15 imps for you to kill with your shottie. Because of the way the shadows are done having higher model polygon counts would murder performance which is slow enough as it is.

Carmack has used bump-maps to increase the detail of the models instead, which works great except at certain angles where a corner or two stick out.


Dave

 

[cybamerc]

OpenGL guy:

> I've not seen or heard of anything that is close to DOOM3's graphic
> quality, particularly with respect to the per pixel lighting.

Halo 2.


Dave B(TotalVR):

> ... doom is the kind of game where you will find one monster jump out
> at you all of a sudden and then the next corner will have 15 imps for
> you to kill with your shottie

id has already stated that this won't be the case. There will be 5 or 6 monsters max on screen at once.

 

[PVR_Extremist]

I agree with Rip in principle. It's about time we had a new "gameplay" benchmark to take over from the likes of HL and Deus Ex.

To be honest I doubt I'd even buy this game as it stands at the moment. Sure I love eye candy but if it's the same old tired gameplay formula of many a HL ripoff I really couldn't be bothered with it.

The engine may be the best thing since sliced bread, but I'd rather they concentrate of gameplay elements and refine their engine later than the other way around.

Now....Doom 3 licensees might come up with something decent.......lets wait and see.

 

[Riptides]

You may need to read the article again

My reading comp. skills are keyed and honed. thankyou

9-10 weapons are already more than enough.

9-10 of the same type of weapons we have been using for 10+ years in gaming.

No running around, notice that you'll have stamina.

You dodged my point completely here. But i made it again above. But as far as stamina goes.. i guess the walking will add to the length of the game, as it seems this is a standard thing to do these days when the game is too short.. Make em walk, and give em a penalty for running.

Instead of use button, you have Flash-like interfaces for many little things in the game, and also a PDA, NPCs, and lots of scripted enviromental actions.

Okay.. We get Netrisca all over again.. Plenty of scripted "boo" moments to make us poop our pants.. yet.. the environments will still be static execpt for the crates we can push and the crap we can shoot off the shelves. Btw i loathed Quake II from early on for that walking up to said button or door to make it open.

How original was Half-life. I mean you see a 3D world from a first person view, what's new in that? So you se that there might be plenty of room for doing things differently...

As far as the scripted story in Half-Life went, i find it was very original, even if it did rip off the idea of DOOM's "base gone bad" idea. The how it did it is what's original. I just find that Doom III seems to be copying this copy of a copy.

... a mix of Half-Life (game progression) System Shock (fear factor), and orig. Doom (weapons and monsters)...

I dunno, I'd give that a

While this would sound great to me too, i still think after i come to grips with the visuals.. This game is not going to fulfill to the same aims that the other 3 i mentioned before. In other words.. this game will be lacking the entireity of what the other 3 had by trying to offer the best of all worlds.

 

[borntosoul]

i think stamina is a great idea and should be used more often ,button mashes and 100 mph freaks lookout

 

[BNA!]

Trolls feeding trolls?

Whether Doom3 will be a good game or not has to be experienced first hand.

Otherwise game developers should stop developing their games while the internet communities and anticommunities can concentrate more on rating previews.
Say: Hey, the pcgamer preview of Doom3 did really give the IGN preview of Unreal2 a run for it's money. I really cannot wait for the expansion pack: Doom3 - "the return to the preview part2".

So what is it all about?
The game or a written preview?

It's a waste of valuable to time to argue over journalists and what they think on how something might turn out or not.
I'm gladly looking forward to Doom3 as to any other game offering me some entertainment - even if it's called HalfLife2.

 

[Derek Smart [3000AD]]

Why the hell is this in here? Shouldn't it be in the general discussions thread?

Children, you can't trust them to do anything right

 

[Bigus Dickus]

hmm... perhaps the topic starter meant for the discussion to go more towards the graphics engine, techniques used to achieve the pictures in that article, etc. (instead of whether carrying a knife is "fun" or not).

 

[Laa-Yosh]

Yes, something like that

Actually I thought that these images look considerably better than what we've seen before. Maybe it's just the better use of colored lighting, or some reworked texture art...

And the question I had was about Doom3 and multisample antialiasing. Considering the extensive shader calculations, the game should run better with 800*600 4x MSAA than in 1600*1200, no AA, but just how much better? Let us stick to existing implemetations of MSAA though

 

[V3]

Anyone have any guesses, as to when PC would be fast enough to handle the high polygon model instead of this lower one and bump maps ?

I hoped low poly + normal maps, is just a stop gap solution. Or will it stick around for the next 5 years ?

 

[Laa-Yosh]

Well, based on offline rendering techniques, shadow volumes would disappear and adaptive shadow maps would replace them. This would make some sort of HOS (possibly subdivision surfaces) and displacement mapping easy to use.

Then again, I could be wrong and maybe the future is multisampled shadow volumes for soft shadows and somewhat higher resolution lowpoly impostors with 128-bit normal maps.

The first method would require some advances to make shadow buffers easy to use (they require lots of manual setup and tweaking for pre-rendered CGI), whereas Carmack's current engine could simply scale with the hardware's performance. Open spaces would be problematic for fully dynamic lighing with both methods, too... I guess it's impossible to tell right now.