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Jawed
Legend
Nvidia overcomes bad graphics chips
http://www.networkworld.com/news/2009/060809-nvidia-overcomes-bad-graphics.html
http://www.networkworld.com/news/2009/060809-nvidia-overcomes-bad-graphics.html
Jawed
http://www.nvidia.com/object/io_1244461304623.html
Rambus Moves To Withdraw Patents From ITC Proceedings Against NVIDIA
Another big win for Nvidia against Rambus patent troll.
Rambus Moves To Withdraw Patents From ITC Proceedings Against NVIDIA
Another big win for Nvidia against Rambus patent troll.
Well he actually did not show that. He showed they are not the worst type of offenders that only gets vague patents and never produces anything. Instead they actually produce things, get vague patents, then try to sue everyone under the sun for royalties, not just the DRAMurai.
That is what he said. Unclear was his assertion, not that they were clearly a patent troll, or clearly not.
Have you guys seen this little gem: http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/06/08/nvidias-boss-kill-your-company-a-bit-every-day/
Hope he's doing less killing and more building
Hope he's doing less killing and more building
I think most people's grievance with rambus. Isn't that they try and protect their patents. Its that they havent used them for anything productive in years. If Rambus was out revolutionizing the memory industry. And building new patents and products. I think these lawsuits would be less prevalent and a bit more relevant.
aaronspink
Veteran
As an FYI, they are building new products and researching new technologies.
They are a design house and not a mass memory manufacturer so they are in some respects limited in their abilities by the fabs they outsource manufacturing to.
And apparently you don't view the variety SoCs and things like the PS3 that use rambus provided IP blocks as productive.
http://www.rambus.com/us/products/partner_products/index.html
And then there's CELL, XDR1/2, the DDR memory controllers they have designed, etc. etc.
The problem with Rambus is that since they don't make products themselves, they can sue without being worried about countersuits. That is the advantage that patent trolls have.
However, most patent trolls aren't doing anything productive. Rambus is.
DK
Silent_Buddha
Legend
Well, they are a design house, and if you hold patents you have to defend them or you lose the patent...
The problem comes in when they join a board like JEDEC in which you are supposed to disclose any relevant patents that you hold with regards to any standards that are being proposed. And that license fee's from those patents will be "reasonable and non-discriminatory." That way memory makers making memory to JEDEC standards wouldn't have to pay unreasonable royalties when making JEDEC standardized memory.
Rambus didn't adhere to any of that during the design of SDRAM. Thus they got to know what would be used, had input on what would be used. And were able to make sure they had patents that would be used. And were in fact filing patents with the knowledge gained while in JEDEC to tailor patents in order to ensure they could charge royalties and/or sue for patent infringement.
Rambus later withdrew from JEDEC and proceded to sue makers of SDRAM and DDR.
A move that was done to make their own memory technology more attractive (as their memory created to their standard was significantly more expensive than SDRAM or the more competitive DDR) by forcing memory makers to pay fees for every stick of SDRAM or DDR made.
Slimy yes, but not exactly a patent troll. IE - they don't submit patents for the sole purpose of litigation. They actually do some good design work. But the way they use those patents to make their own work more attractive is very very slimy.
Regards,
SB
The problem comes in when they join a board like JEDEC in which you are supposed to disclose any relevant patents that you hold with regards to any standards that are being proposed. And that license fee's from those patents will be "reasonable and non-discriminatory." That way memory makers making memory to JEDEC standards wouldn't have to pay unreasonable royalties when making JEDEC standardized memory.
Rambus didn't adhere to any of that during the design of SDRAM. Thus they got to know what would be used, had input on what would be used. And were able to make sure they had patents that would be used. And were in fact filing patents with the knowledge gained while in JEDEC to tailor patents in order to ensure they could charge royalties and/or sue for patent infringement.
Rambus later withdrew from JEDEC and proceded to sue makers of SDRAM and DDR.
A move that was done to make their own memory technology more attractive (as their memory created to their standard was significantly more expensive than SDRAM or the more competitive DDR) by forcing memory makers to pay fees for every stick of SDRAM or DDR made.
Slimy yes, but not exactly a patent troll. IE - they don't submit patents for the sole purpose of litigation. They actually do some good design work. But the way they use those patents to make their own work more attractive is very very slimy.
Regards,
SB
I think that is the case with trademarks, but I wasn't aware of a use it or lose it policy for patents.
Silent_Buddha
Legend
Not really, No. But thats personal opinion. I dont feel anything rambus has done anything that couldn't have been done by someone else in the industry. Or that anything they have done is really revolutionary.
Is rambus reputation deserved? I don't know. What I do know is you hear more about rambus sueing everybody than about anything they have ever made in the last 7 years.
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Which in itself (as SB points out) was in violation of agreements. Rambus gambled that they had more to gain than to loose by their conduct, leveraging and arguably manipulating the patent legal system.
The reason many of us would like to see Rambus dead, is that if this would prove to be correct, it would be a disaster for all sorts of cooperative bodies trying to promote common standards. Even as it is, their actions has already to some degree damaged trust (and by consequence, efficiency) of such groups.
They need to be ostracised.
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Don't be silly.
I explained exactly why Rambus needs to die. Not because they have patent disagreement with the Dramurai per se, but because of the background story and its wider implications.
The world isn't black and white.
But shades of gray still matter.
The Dramurai not being pussycats doesn't make Rambus' behaviour any less destructive.
Silent_Buddha
Legend
No, however in the specific case of Rambus with regards to JEDEC and SDRAM/DDR manufacturers, the court agreed that Rambus' actions were in violation and thus their litigation was thrown out when it was finally brought to court.
The whole point of JEDEC setting memory standards was to not only set a standard for all memory makers to guarantee compatability if the memory standard was used but to also make sure the standard wasn't monopolized by one memory manufacturer or another.
Thus relevant patents must be revealed and for those patents that would be used a reasonable and non-discriminatory price set for the use of those patents.
Rambus not only didn't reveal all patents it may have held in regards to the then developing SDRAM and DDR, they filed and tailored patents while it was a member of JEDEC, while having information on what technologies would be used for SDRAM/DDR.
And THEN using the patents that weren't revealed started to use them to charge royalties with the aim of not only securing another revenue stream but to artificially increase the price of SDRAM and more importantly DDR in order to make their own competing proprietary memory standard more price competitive.
Added to that if the memory manufacturer caved in without making a fuss it was offered a more lenient pricing structure for licensing the use of the patents that were secretly tailored for SDRAM/DDR while they were under developement and Rambus was a member of the organization creating the standards. Both of which actions were against the contract they signed in joining JEDEC.
If Rambus had managed to inflate the price of DDR at the crucial time when the open DDR standard was in competition with the proprietary Rambus memory standard, Rambus stood to gain billions as Intel at the time was pushing hard for it. However the cost to produce Rambus memory at the time was almost twice as high as DDR making it unattractive in comparison.
Noone said memory manufacturer's are angels. They are a business. Just because they are a business doesn't suddenly make Rambus' actions in this case excusable. And the courts all agreed, both here and in Europe.
At least with regards to this particular incident.
Now, had Rambus not been a member of JEDEC they could have used past patents in any way they wish. Had they revealed their past patents while a member of JEDEC they could have licensed those patents for a reasonable and non-discriminatory fee. Had they not filed and tailored patents to be relevant to the memory under developement while they were a member of JEDEC they would have been fine.
However, Rambus did none of that. In this particular case.
In other cases, they have won. And rightfully so. And for other patents they do receive royalties. Again rightfully so.
Regards,
SB
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