Even then they still did 40k units a week.
NPD February 2007
- Thread starter Rangers
- Start date
It is gigantic though - we're talking an extra $1 billion in *loss* for the year due simply to that $100 price cut alone. There is no conceivable BOM that I can envision in which Sony is producing a console in which they are not losing a lot of money, and yet with a profitable PS and PSP operation, losses still hover around $2 billion at SCE for the fiscal year.
Now, I do think that out of all the consoles PS3 will reduce it's manufacturing cost the most rapidly, and they'll feel some of that relief from the Euro launch on through to the end of the year as everything moves to 65nm, BD expenses come down, chipset/motherboard is simplified, etc etc... but for the short-term, it's been painful.
In terms of 2nd party, this usually refers to a title being produced by SCE themselves, even if the developer is external. So unless Sony decides to cut the funding, these relationships are generally secure; ie the developer isn't going to be the one to walk away from a project.
quest was talking about 1st party titles. FF, MGS, DMC are 3rd party titles.
What does SCE develop and publish that rivals Zelda, Mario Bros (Super Mario, Mario Kart, Paper Mario, SSB), Metroid, F-Zero, Pilotwings, Pikmin, Animal Crossing, Pokemon, Wave Race, etc? Not much I'd wager. But on a 3rd party level, Sony has been unrivaled since PS1.
Oh I know what Quest was saying, and I think I addressed just that. And I even made a point of it with the FF, MGS, and DMC point-out, indicating that those were the only non-Sony produced properties I was looking forward to; the rest are internal efforts to Sony. Resistance, Motorstorm, LAIR, Heavenly Sword, and White Knight Story are all titles that are set to do better than most third-party counterparts I imagine, and then consider other efforts (on PS2 and their extensions on PS3) such as Gran Turismo, God of War, Rogue Galaxy, SOCOM, everything Naughty Dog, everything Insomniac, SingStar, EyeToy - and I'm sure you'll agree although the "legendary" factor compared to Nintendo's IPs is less, Sony is indeed responsible for self-publication of some of their strongest titles. For example which will sell more in the end, God of War 2, or Zelda Twilight Princess?
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That would have been true if the region the console had been sold in had the same kind of launch-price for the PS2 as it does for the PS3. But since the price isn't even remotely similar, that simply doesn't hold.
But that has nothing to do with console sales right now. This is not a product that has reached the mass market, let alone influence their purchase decisions.
First of all, hardly any one thing will sell a $600 console, unless maybe you happen to want BluRay right here and now, and the PS3 is your cheapest option, or you are a diehard fan of Virtua Fighter 5, or maybe Resistance, and you just need to have that right now, etc.
But the price of the console will go down, to match and foster demand. It's that simple. Sure, there are boundaries - Sony needs to keep an eye out for cost, and they need to make sure they make some kind of profit eventually. But there are a lot of components in the machine with room for price reductions, and price of manufacturing will definitely go down.
There are several reports that retailers at this point request the 60Gb over the 20Gb version 4:1.
I can't believe that the price will still be $600 a year after release. Price will go down, for sure, unless there is suddenly a magical upswing in demand for some weird reason. I'm banking on at the very, very least, $100 dollar price drops each year. As the console reaches the mass-market interest, the 20Gb version will probably also become more popular.
The reason why I think the European launch is important for getting a picture of how well the PS3 will do eventually, is because then the system is available in all regions like the 360 was from day 1. Had the PS3 been out in Europe, would that have doubled the February sales? Who knows ...
The Xbox 1 did well in the U.S., compared to the other regions (even Europe), and I expect that trend to continue, and the 360 will gain marketshare there for sure (at least I think so). Now it's a matter of finding out if the same trends continue in Europe, or if the Xbox's popularity accellerates, or even slows down. I expect a slight improvement for the 360, but by how much I cannot tell. Imho the PS3 is poised to do well in Europe, but I couldn't tell you when that will happen. Summer 2007? Winter 2007? Or even 2008?
Oh I know what Quest was saying, and I think I addressed just that.And I even made a point of it with the FF, MGS, and DMC point-out, indicating that those were the only non-Sony produced properties I was looking forward to; the rest are internal efforts to Sony.
Obviously, from what you are saying, there are enough 1st/2nd party titles coming to satisfy you. But being overly-dependent on in-house development has been a sign of a weak overall platform in the home console market in the past.
You really need both. And I think even Nintendo's Wii success will be dependent on how 3rd party developers embrace the system. A positive indication in this area is that I just yesterday saw a commercial during the Final Four broadcasts for Tiger Woods 2007 on Wii that featured Tiger himself playing golf with the Wiimote.
360 numbers last February were better than PS3 now (was around 160K, IIRC), 360 was supply-limited and had launched into 3 territories. Besides, it's not very useful to compare numbers in a vacuum except for making fanboys feel better (although it's not even possible in this case) : outside of this theorical vacuum (ie when you compare 360 now and PS3 now), the 360 has picked up a lot of steam, sells solid numbers every month in addition to large amounts of SW, and has a number of killer apps planned for the rest of the year.
I'm not sure the EU launch will have any influence on March and April NPD numbers, btw.
Regarding the state of the PS3 EU launch, wee Sony has claimed they were on target for 6 millions units by the end of March, has yet to sell over 1 million in JP (tracking behind the NGC right now), and has very slow sales in NA. Which must mean there are something like 3 or 4 millions units on their way to EU right now.
What I'm saying is that there are enough 1st/2nd party titles to serve as differentiation. I don't think that they alone combine to create 'killer app' levels of purchase enticement (on the whole), but I also don't think the PS3 is at risk of losing 3rd party development; IMO it will still have all the mass market titles. The risk is in losing 3rd party *exclusives*, which does suck for Sony, but is not a deathblow in and of itself.
Regarding the state of the PS3 EU launch, wee Sony has claimed they were on target for 6 millions units by the end of March, has yet to sell over 1 million in JP (tracking behind the NGC right now), and has very slow sales in NA. Which must mean there are something like 3 or 4 millions units on their way to EU right now.
Right, well again... you can ship 6 million without selling six million Corwin.
Where are you shipping them and to whom? The retailers here don't seem to need a refresh, Japan surely doesn't, are the units all destined for PAL territories?
I might PM you my scuttlebutt talk that took place last week, to see where I am coming from...
allegedly as discussed in previous threads and according to some PDF documents from Sony, "shipped" means left the factory for Sony warehouse. (IOW, they have been built) ...but Carl should know for sure?
Well, probably the same place where all those unsold Xboxes from last year's ten million went: the backyard of Bill Gates's mom
Well, probably the same place where all those unsold Xboxes from last year's ten million went: the backyard of Bill Gates's mom
really?
I heard she preferred the Wii
I view it as that as well - bascally 'shipped' as meaning manufactured and ready for delivery, rather than delivered to retail proper. But then again if there were a million consoles presently in the channel in both the US and Japan right now, I wouldn't think that such an overkill situation either mind you, so who knows.
And Nav, if you've got some cool anecdotes, definitely feel free to PM me whenever with them!
Well, probably the same place where all those unsold Xboxes from last year's ten million went: the backyard of Bill Gates's mom
Well, at least those "shipped" Xboxes had all been ordered and paid for by retailers. Sony can't even say that about all these excess "shipped" PS3's.
Does Sony have a fleet of ships, laden down with millions of unsold and unordered (but shipped!) PS3's, doing slow circuits around the ocean until holiday 2007?
How many console generations do we have to go through before we realize that one console's install base is not the install base for its successor? The general trend in console history has been one of extreme fluctuation due to the longevity of a hardware generation and the way each console stands apart from its predecessors as a distinct, isolated product. The consistency of sales numbers between PS1 and PS2 is the exception, not the rule. It's relatively unsurprising, then, that PS3 sales aren't being driven by the number of PS2 sold in the last 6 years.
tongue_of_colicab
Veteran
How would the EU have any influance on US/JAP sales? We hardly ever get any data on consoles sold in europe so it wont change anything at all. Americans wont suddenly start buying more ps3's because we europeans can now buy one.
How do you know that these shipped XB360s have been paid for?
Actually, MS doesn't talk much about "shipped" units. MS PR generally refers to "sold", which means "sold to retailers" (and may or may not have been bought by consumers). Nintendo generally refers to "sold" as "sold to customers", and Sony uses the term "shipped", which doesn't mean "shipped to retailers" but rather "factory shipped", and includes units in warehouses and used for repairs and exchanges. So it's hard to compare official data from all three manufacturers.
When MS talks about "shipped", it means "shipped to retailers", and includes units :
- sold to consumers
- currently in stock at retailers
- having left MS warehouses and on transit to retailers
DuckThor Evil
Legend
Hmm... Extra one billion for the year, because of 100$ price cut...
I wonder what sort of fuzzy math they have used to calculate that??
Correct me if I'm confused, but wouldn't that mean Sony has forecasted to sell 10 million units in Japan alone in 1 year, as 10 million units x 100$ is 1 billion dollars!?, or is there some other method to count it? Naturally it's unnecessary to say that they actually haven't forecasted selling that many units, because that would be nuts.
It would make sense if they calculated to lose 1 billion during the whole lifetime of PS3. I could see that this drop would have been implemented in their road map so that it would actually affect the first 10 million units sold in japan, and after that the two different road maps would have merged.
You don't see the, let's call it overly optimistc "we'll sell 5 mln without ANY games" Sony projecting to sell 10 mln in their home turf, Japan? I wouldn't put it past them.
