NPD August 2016 Sales Results, Results Ranked by Revenue (Hardware Now, Software Later)

[JPT]

Sony doesn't own UHD from what I understand, I don't think they owned BR for that much either. They certainly have shares in it, that being said, they may have less shares in UHD BR.
They don't seem committed to the standard, their latest offering: http://4k.com/news/sony-finally-ann...blu-ray-player-with-high-dynamic-range-16496/ isn't even being sold mass market.
It's pretty clear they are not committed to UHD disc format.

They probably have data that suggests it hasn't been beneficial for them, or they are banking on the world moving to streaming technologies and/or would rather promote streaming technologies of their own service where they would receive a greater return on investment.

Not sure how much weight the format war between HD-DVD and BD had on the BD in PS3 decision had. But there is no format war this time, I think, so Sony might not need to be flag bearer for UHD, like it might had to last time. Or it was just a bonehead move of them to actually push BD as hard that time.
Is there any public info, that says the BD push last time was a good decision for Sony, Sony Playstation?

 

[Rangers]

XBO needs to keep that UHD drive. It's a big differentiating factor.

If you bought a 4K TV, and you wanted to max it out because current no other source can, you'd want a UHD player. But not all UHD players are often on sale. In fact most go on sale at special times of the year.

XBox is almost on sale several months of the year and people love sales lol.
And you get a gaming console. And it's cheaper.

Hard to deny the value proposition. MS is well positioned here to snatch up many early 4K adopters.




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I dont think it's a big deal. Maybe even a misstep. Discs are on the way out. If I was to get a Xbox S, I imagine any 4k I would be watching would be streamed.

But it probably adds significantly to the cost. Could they have tried for 249 without it, and would that have sold better? Quite possibly.

History seems to show XBO needs to be $50 less than PS4 to sell well, given the lower specs. Both being at 299 probably isn't a great place for MS. Xbox had a year where they were $50 less, this time they barely had any time before Sony matched them at 299. And no holiday season at $50 less.

 

[MrFox]

It feels Sony and MS did it for shit and giggles.

Mark Cerny called Phil Spencer:
"Haha it worked! did you see the internet meltdown?"
"So funny! Next time you pay us to add windows media extender on PS5, and we won't have it on Scorpio!"

 

[Rangers]

From aquamarines twitter @AstronautClaire

Xbox One USA Retail ASP (Average Selling Price) Trends: June 2016: $298.47, July 2016: $258.24, and August 2016: $330.73

So as expected S model did some work bringing the ASP up. But, still below PS4

PS4 USA Retail ASP (Average Selling Price) Trends: June 2016: $352.40, July 2016: $351.43, and August 2016: $348.27

Dead Wii U doesn't move. Thank that clunky controller...

Wii U USA Retail ASP (Average Selling Price) Trends: June 2016: $295.82, July 2016: $297.27, and August 2016: $298.19

 

[Arwin]

Ages ago when the Wii U came out I voiced exactly that concern, that such a controller would make it harder for its price to drop. Without the controller I bet it could have been 199, and that would probably have helped software sales.

 

[function]

I dont think it's a big deal. Maybe even a misstep. Discs are on the way out. If I was to get a Xbox S, I imagine any 4k I would be watching would be streamed.

But it probably adds significantly to the cost. Could they have tried for 249 without it, and would that have sold better? Quite possibly

I doubt the additional cost for UHD BR is $50. Maybe a few extra dollars for the drive, a couple for the silicon, and a few dollar for the licensing fees? Some of those costs would have been required just to support 4K HDR for streaming.

$10? $20 at most?

 

[Rangers]

All those things add up. $15 is probably huge on a BOM.

I just wonder if they should have dropped that in conjunction with some other things, like going with a matte finish, lower quality presentation etc, and pushed for 249. Kind of what Sony's been doing with their slim's. Keep the HDR and 4K streaming of course. Hell even Sony when asked why no UHD BLu ray said "we're looking to the future and streaming".

I dont expect this board to really get it because an enthusiast board will side with more features. But in the end I think 249 base price with less flair would have longer legs. It's nice that XBO Slim did well one month but dont get fooled, it's probably going to get killed from here on out (judging by Amazon). Some of that is likely set in stone because of PS4 Pro, but if you have lower specs then a lower price is how you have to position.

Well, on the flip side MS will probably push all kinds of promotions and effectively be 250 this holiday. The higher end features may cost them some money though.

If you're gonna stay at 299 they should have at least went to a default 1TB HDD. Companies are really tight fisted with those HDD's though. They need them for artificial market segmentation I guess. Just like in Phones. Corporate BS...

 

[MrFox]

If you're gonna stay at 299 they should have at least went to a default 1TB HDD. Companies are really tight fisted with those HDD's though. They need them for artificial market segmentation I guess. Just like in Phones. Corporate BS...

User replaceable HDD is the solution.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

User replaceable HDD is the solution.

Or user added HDD is the solution. Why replace the HDD if you can just add more HDDs?

Regards,
SB

 

[Jay]

I dont expect this board to really get it because an enthusiast board will side with more features.

wow that sounds really patronising.
anyway, I think people do get it.
you say that $10-15 BOM adds up, yet now your saying well sure that wouldn't make it hit $250, let's cut and change other things, you think the paint work is enough to make it hit that price point. Maybe you don't get it.
maybe with all your changes, it still can't hit $250 or would be sold at a loss compared to now.
physical media being on way out, true or not doesn't stop the perceived value at selling it at $300 with or without drive if all your cuts don't bring it down to $250
nothing stops them from selling a DD version once all the internals becomes cheap enough.

it's amazing how much they make on the different size hdd.

 

[MrFox]

Or user added HDD is the solution. Why replace the HDD if you can just add more HDDs?

Regards,
SB

To put an SSD.

 

[Rangers]

I thought I was pretty clear. They'd been better off IMO doing everything they could to hit 249. Pretty simple to understand.

On the one hand people are always saying in relation to Xbox One S "you cant get stand alone a UHD Blu Ray under $400 right now". But it's only $10-15 to the BOM? I'm sure the cost will come down, I just dont think physical media matters much.

And, again, short of cutting HDR/4k output. Those are must haves IMO. UHD isn't.

 

[BRiT]

Why race to the bottom when they are touted as the best bang per buck in terms of 4K UHD BluRay players? This way they keep a higher ASP and get extra marketing push from all the retail stores such as Walmart and BestBuy as they're pushing it as the 4K UHD player to get.

 

[Jay]

guess we'll have to wait for bom breakdown for better idea how much drive costs.
but considering their able to make a uhd & console for $100 less, I'm not sure you can put it down to cost of drive.

I'm not sure slim being $250(without drive) would compete a lot better to $300 ps4 than the fat was in the long term.
usually took a bigger deference than that.

but slim seems to have a pretty good buzz around it now, large part of that is due to the drive from what I've seen

 

[RobertR1]

MS got a free product differentiation by Sony not adding a uhd drive which I'm sure surprised them even. So it's something they will certainly press on.

And even though these are a/v devices that will often end up in some cabinet, it's generally a lot easier to get a wow effect from an aesthetically pleasing device. People like "pretty."

Since they can't compete on specs they are lucky to have these 2 factors going for them.

 

[Rangers]

Well if the S continues to pull solid sales numbers through the holidays I might change my mind. Still wouldn't know if 249 would have done better, though.

September Amazon rankings aren't too bad for the S.

#2 PS4 Pro (but obviously doesn't really count yet, wont be out in September)
#31 Non slim PS4 Blops 3 500GB
#32 500 GB XB S Halo bundle
#64 PS4 UC4 limited edition bundle (?)
#70 PS4 500 GB Uncharted Collection bundle
#78 PS4 500GB no game (??)
#92 1TB XBox S Madden bundle


We'll see if it holds up.

I didn't realise the 299 XBO was such a good deal, comes with both Master Chief Collection and Halo 5. Also Halo 5 on a disc, wonder if that's a Gamestop thing (Gamestop once said they wouldn't carry consoles without a pack in physical disc, or something)? Both those games have HUGE probably 40-60GB patches...yeck.

I dont think 270k in a Slim launch month is anything to crow about by historical standards. It's ok by XBO standards, we'll see if it has any legs.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

Why race to the bottom when they are touted as the best bang per buck in terms of 4K UHD BluRay players? This way they keep a higher ASP and get extra marketing push from all the retail stores such as Walmart and BestBuy as they're pushing it as the 4K UHD player to get.

With the holiday buying season coming up, retailers pushing UHD might provide some impetus. What better for salesmen to try to push on buyers of 4K TV's than a something that can play the UHD media that they'll want to push as well. And as a side benefit it also plays games.

Sony not including UHD BRD may have given Microsoft an opening this holiday season. It'll certainly be interesting to see.

I also wonder how many clueless sales people at volume retailer chains (like Walmart) will incorrectly inform people that the PS4-P will be able to play UHD BRDs.

Regards,
SB

 

[Silent_Buddha]

To put an SSD.

True, it is slightly more expensive to add an SSD as you need to spend 15-30 USD extra for an external drive case.

Regards,
SB

 

[Deleted member 11852]

With the holiday buying season coming up, retailers pushing UHD might provide some impetus. What better for salesmen to try to push on buyers of 4K TV's than a something that can play the UHD media that they'll want to push as well. And as a side benefit it also plays games.

Unless you're buying from an independent store then the sales reps will push the products that gives them, the sales rep, the best sales commission; that's how chain retail works. The Xbox One S is a great value UHD player but the margins on it are likely way lower than a dedicated UHD player. Customers interested in UHD are going to have the TV/sound system/player combo pushed.

 

[turkey]

guess we'll have to wait for bom breakdown for better idea how much drive costs.
but considering their able to make a uhd & console for $100 less, I'm not sure you can put it down to cost of drive.

I'm not sure slim being $250(without drive) would compete a lot better to $300 ps4 than the fat was in the long term.
usually took a bigger deference than that.

but slim seems to have a pretty good buzz around it now, large part of that is due to the drive from what I've seen

Its $88.50 for the 2TB drive and uhd drive (ihs market) and the original was $49

I am not sure the cost if a 2TB drive but it must be more than the 500gb so the actual drive cost seems like it's marginal assuming component costs have not decreased over the last 3 years.

We will need the ps4 slim bom to compare current prices for 500gb and odd to truly gauge the cost of the uhd.