Microtransactions: the Future of Games? (LootBoxes and Gambling)

Shifty Geezer said:
That's true, but doesn't change the threat to gaming culture. If the market changes to microtransactions and nickle-and-diming, game principles that gamers have known and enjoyed will be destroyed and replaced with a different model, meaning an end to gamers' hobby as we know it. Gamers will either have to adapt and accept the new way, or go find something else to do. But faced with that prospect, it's fair (and right in a free-market with free-speech culture) to express one's reservations with this model in a hope to secure a safe future for one's interests.

If you don't acknowledge that, you don't belong on a discussion forum.
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Sorry, what?

I don't acknowledge that paying for cars with tokens, - bought with real money, is the end of gaming as we know it.

Should I close my Beyond3D account?

Paying for cars with tokens is a shortcut, - a cheat code, for people who don't have the time or inclination to play the game proper. You'd have a case if T10 had made it impossible to progress in the game without spending real cash. That isn't the case at all.

Cheers
 
Shifty Geezer said:
That's true, but doesn't change the threat to gaming culture. If the market changes to microtransactions and nickle-and-diming, game principles that gamers have known and enjoyed will be destroyed and replaced with a different model, meaning an end to gamers' hobby as we know it. Gamers will either have to adapt and accept the new way, or go find something else to do. But faced with that prospect, it's fair (and right in a free-market with free-speech culture) to express one's reservations with this model in a hope to secure a safe future for one's interests.
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Look at it this way, has the size of the core gamer audience for which these types of games are targeted at increased from last generation? Not really. Has the price of games increased from last generation? Nope. Has the cost to make games that will meet gamers "next generation" expectations gone up? It sure has. So what do y'all expect these guys to do? Forcing people to double pay, like paying for dlc then having to pay to unlock parts of that dlc is not something I agree with, but that's not what Forza 5 is doing from the looks of it in spite of media and others trying to make it seem that way. In the Forza 5 case it looks like they are trying to cope with ever increasing development costs in a way that shouldn't affect the typical gamer. Like Gubbi mentioned you can still play the game like you always do, that hasn't changed, they just increased the cost to cheat and get cars quicker. Is that really so terrible as to ruin all of gaming? Ultimately can't gamers continue to do the same thing they have always done and not pay for the cheats, and just play the game normally like all previous Forza games while giving other gamers that aren't as patient the cheat option?
 
Gubbi said:
Sorry, what?

I don't acknowledge that paying for cars with tokens, - bought with real money, is the end of gaming as we know it.

Should I close my Beyond3D account?
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He didnt say that.
He said you should acknowledge people have a right to voice their concerns with the way things are going.
 
We tend to convince ourselves that everything always evolves towards the better and nothing for the worse. There are many reasons why we do this. But until we acknowledge this I dont see things becoming pretty
 
joker454 said:
Look at it this way...
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That's the counter argument. I wasn't talking specifically about F5, but the change of the game model from up-front payment to microtransactions and the case against it. I didn't even say I support that case; only that it's valid and worth discussing. ;)

There are a number of possible futures leading to different balances between what the consumers want (awesome AAA games for free) and what the publishers want (money-making cash-cows and crazy profits). They are all worth considering and debating in public. F5 isn't the be-all-and-end-all of the discussion either. Even if F5 is a fair system (which I think it is going by current discussion), that doesn't mean the future isn't going to turn into something different and microtransactions won't affect game design with a change in development priorities.
 
I think it's likely all but a very few games will eventually use the free to play/micro transaction model.
The positive side of that is that in order to have people spend money, it has to be compelling. The downside is developers optimizing for a single easily measured metric with direct feedback, that isn't directly related to game quality.
 
Shifty Geezer said:
That's true, but doesn't change the threat to gaming culture. If the market changes to microtransactions and nickle-and-diming, game principles that gamers have known and enjoyed will be destroyed and replaced with a different model, meaning an end to gamers' hobby as we know it. Gamers will either have to adapt and accept the new way, or go find something else to do. But faced with that prospect, it's fair (and right in a free-market with free-speech culture) to express one's reservations with this model in a hope to secure a safe future for one's interests.

If you don't acknowledge that, you don't belong on a discussion forum. Every opinion post ever can pretty much boil down to, "if you don't like it, just ignore it." Just don't buy the game, don't buy the console, don't by the product or service. And history shows that complaints can cause change for the better, certainly more than just being quiet and hoping things will improve.

If those advocating XB1's always on policy were more vocal about it, perhaps those being noisiest to the contrary wouldn't have won through?
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You cannot asume to know what's best for gamers or for other people in general.

And MS didnt bend to bickering - they were scared by the pre-order cancellations, which is more proof that voting with you wallet is what matters and what make changes happen.

The reason I come to this forum (and btw it's the only forum that I'm currently active in) is to get educated, not to try to change the world.

Incidentally, I fully agree on the microtransactions point, but it's just my opinion. I'm also of the opinion that multipalyer and online and social features are useless - all I wanted was a PS2 with better graphics. However, other peoples wallets have put my opinion in an insignificant minority...
 
baten said:
You cannot asume to know what's best for gamers or for other people in general.
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I didn't say I did. It's somewhat remarkable how few people are capable of entering into a discussion from the perspective of exploring it instead of arguing a POV.

If (posit) the market changes to microtransactions and nickle-and-diming, game principles that gamers have known and enjoyed (you buy a complete game and have access to all its content from a single purchase price, and can share and trade that game, and designers designing to maximise game experience) will be destroyed and replaced with a different model, meaning an end to gamers' hobby as we know it (and the birth of a new gamer's hobby that's different including game design with a degree of focus on microtransactions ).

This change might be better for the industry, or worse, but it will be different and there will be people arguing against what they perceive as a threat to their hobby. Just as there are people arguing against the way microtransactions are handled on tablets in an exploitative fashion and are asking for legal changes to affect the structure of those microtransactions.
 
You guys should a) watch the second vid and b) don't judge and condemn someone just because he is overweight.

Not so nice gentlemen!
 
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