Mark Rein Interview @ Shack News

[aldo]

Shack News:
Shack: What are your thoughts on AGEIA's PPU hardware? Any thoughts about how that's going to take off?

Mark Rein: One thing AGEIA's done that's really smart is that--well, if you've seen our PS3 demo, and this is really version 1, really not a finished performance at all, but we've got some really great cool physics things going on PS3. They've done a really good job of optimizing their library to work well with the SPUs in the Cell processor, which means we're going to be able to get a lot of physics performance out of PlayStation 3. Also on Xbox 360 to some extent, but definitely on PS3 we're going to be able to get a lot of physics capabilities out of that. Which means that, to bring [games using those methods] to a PC, you're probably going to need the hardware. Or you could maybe scale it up even further on the PC, I believe, with their hardware. I think that bodes really well for them if developers go nuts and do really cool physics on PlayStation 3, then if people want to play it to that level on PC, they'll buy the card. So it's a matter of them coming out with great applications, great games that use it. I know Ghost Recon Advanced Warfighter will be using the hardware, and Unreal Tournament 2007 will be using the hardware. Not today, but eventually. So I think that's pretty exciting for them, and I think it's going to be pretty cool.

It seems to confirm Ageia’s original statement where executives claimed that the X360 will not be able to process some of the Ageia physics technology because of the limitations of its architecture.

-aldo

 

[Qroach]

don't take it out of context. rein is just saying ageia has had optimizations for PS3. Ageia stated after they made the claim that what they didn't have 360 devkits didn't they?

 

[superguy]

I dont understand this..people make Cell out to be so great based on it's flops count..well, X360 CPU has half as much. So that wouldn't make it exactly chopped liver, if you assume Cell is revolutionary and all that based purely on flops (not saying all did, but that has been by far the biggest driver of Cell hype)

I mean, you should be able to do the same things, just maybe a bit less (and 360 CPU will be better at other things, always the tradeoff).

Anyways this kinda says to me it's the memory topology that's the difference here, not flops.

Anyway this will be a controversial statement, but I can actually see it eventually ending up that PS3 games have a bit more physics, while X360 games have a bit more visual polish and effects.

 

[RavenFox]

I dont understand this..people make Cell out to be so great based on it's flops count..well, X360 CPU has half as much. So that wouldn't make it exactly chopped liver, if you assume Cell is revolutionary and all that based purely on flops (not saying all did, but that has been by far the biggest driver of Cell hype)

I mean, you should be able to do the same things, just maybe a bit less (and 360 CPU will be better at other things, always the tradeoff).

Anyways this kinda says to me it's the memory topology that's the difference here, not flops.

Anyway this will be a controversial statement, but I can actually see it eventually ending up that PS3 games have a bit more physics, while X360 games have a bit more visual polish and effects.

Huh? what is it your trying to say here? uhh never mind saw your avy.

 

[dukmahsik]

it's being optimized for cell, isn't it obvious it'll run better?

 

[superguy]

I'm trying to say:

I dont think it's flops that's driving physics so much. It's that the SPE's have local store. This is a difference to Xcpu.

If it was straight flops you could do everything on 360 you could do on cell, just less (of some things, more of others)

The 2nd part is just looking forward, I could see PS3 games having more physics, and X360 games having more visual polish due to high framebuffer bandwidth for things like HDR.

 

[aldo]

don't take it out of context. rein is just saying ageia has had optimizations for PS3. Ageia stated after they made the claim that what they didn't have 360 devkits didn't they?

I edited in " the Ageia physics technology" to emphasize that very point.

Still, you have to take in to account that Epic and Ageia have had the final version of the X360 for some time and Rein basically states here that the PS3 and PC w/PPU versions of the product will have more physics than the X360.

-aldo

 

[superguy]

I edited in " the Ageia physics technology" to emphasize that very point.

Still, you have to take in to account that Epic and Ageia have had the final version of the X360 for some time and Rein basically states here that the PS3 and PC versions of the product w/PPU will have more physics than the X360.

-aldo

Actually pc with PPU will have more:

Or you could maybe scale it up even further on the PC, I believe, with their hardware.

 

[aldo]

Actually pc with PPU will have more:

Thanks, I must have caught the error about the same time as you did. I left the "w/PPU" behind when I had performed a cut and paste.

-aldo

 

[Dr. Nick]

No the Xbox 360 shouldn't be a slouch when it comes to physics it's just that for a long time people have believed that the Cell would be better at it. Out of all the things people have said about the Cell this is one of the things that most everyone is in agreement with. Are there other ways of doing it that could prove them wrong? That I don't know about.

 

[superguy]

Might as well post the other big item about Revolution:

Shack: A little while ago, there were job postings from a major publisher looking for developers to join a project using the Unreal 3 engine, and it listed all three next-generation consoles. It wasn't really clear if they just checked all the boxes on accident, or if there was anything to that. Do you have any comment on that?

Mark Rein: I have no idea. I just don't know. I don't see the Nintendo platform as a likely target for Unreal Engine 3. Nintendo has said they're not going after high definition, and we're definitely--the kind of hardware it takes to run Unreal Engine 3 is definitely the kind of hardware it takes to run HD, so I don't really see that as a likely target for us at this point.

 

[scooby_dooby]

I'm really interested to see how Rein uses these extra physics capabilities to improve the game. At GDC the UT2k7 demo was basically a room of barrels that you could shoot around from what I saw...oh joy.

It will be very interesting to see the difference between the various platforms, and how the extra physics power is used.

 

[m1nd_x]

I'm really interested to see how Rein uses these extra physics capabilities to improve the game. At GDC the UT2k7 demo was basically a room of barrels that you could shoot around from what I saw...oh joy.

It will be very interesting to see the difference between the various platforms, and how the extra physics power is used.

Those physics were mind boggling though, I could see myself playing around with that demo for at least a few minutes. Maybe they'll make a new demo for e3 with 5x the barrels!!!

 

[Dr. Nick]

I'm really interested to see how Rein uses these extra physics capabilities to improve the game. At GDC the UT2k7 demo was basically a room of barrels that you could shoot around from what I saw...oh joy.

It will be very interesting to see the difference between the various platforms, and how the extra physics power is used.

One of the big this that people like to talk about in games if fully distructable environments. Realtime physics will play a roll in making something that seems cool now mind blowing.

 

[Diesel2]

I'm really interested to see how Rein uses these extra physics capabilities to improve the game. At GDC the UT2k7 demo was basically a room of barrels that you could shoot around from what I saw...oh joy.

It will be very interesting to see the difference between the various platforms, and how the extra physics power is used.

If the extra physics capabilities enable the developer to immerse the gamer even more, then job done, just like with enhanced graphics. Not every game is going to put extra physics capabilities to new and unique uses, but I guess that would not be acceptable to a position with a stance such as yours.

 

[jonnyp]

I'm really interested to see how Rein uses these extra physics capabilities to improve the game. At GDC the UT2k7 demo was basically a room of barrels that you could shoot around from what I saw...oh joy.

It will be very interesting to see the difference between the various platforms, and how the extra physics power is used.

I don't think that was a UT2K7 demo. I think it was just a UE3 demo which was supposed to show off PS3 development and the devkit. It wasn't a very impressive demo, especially from a physics standpoint there was nothing new or exciting in that video and the graphics didn't look all that great either IMO.

There was a vid of UT2K7 which looked better than the above-mentioned demo but not much going on in it, except some running around and shooting at walls.

 

[Ooh-videogames]

Might as well post the other big item about Revolution:

Kind of confirms what I previously believed that he's only pointing to the lack of HD, based on his comments Epic has no plans to support Revolution due to the lack of HD capability. I assume its a memory issue more than anything. But, hey, I'm no tech-head, so inform me.

 

[Nesh]

I'm trying to say:

I dont think it's flops that's driving physics so much. It's that the SPE's have local store. This is a difference to Xcpu.

If it was straight flops you could do everything on 360 you could do on cell, just less (of some things, more of others)

The 2nd part is just looking forward, I could see PS3 games having more physics, and X360 games having more visual polish due to high framebuffer bandwidth for things like HDR.

Who mentioned flops in this thread?

 

[mckmas8808]

I'm trying to say:

I dont think it's flops that's driving physics so much. It's that the SPE's have local store. This is a difference to Xcpu.
.

So what's the point? At the end of the day does it matter why the PS3 will be pushing more physics, besides just for conversation?

 

[mckmas8808]

I'm really interested to see how Rein uses these extra physics capabilities to improve the game. At GDC the UT2k7 demo was basically a room of barrels that you could shoot around from what I saw...oh joy.

It will be very interesting to see the difference between the various platforms, and how the extra physics power is used.

Seriously I would like the see the differences too. I should say this but "F" it! I wonder it UT 2K7 will have more physics like situations and things happening than Gears of War. What do you guys think?