Linux on PS3? What are the possibilities?

[skilzygw]

Since I have heard that this can be done. I wonder if you will be able to run linux games or something like WINE to run windows games?

Maybe even some will write custom apps for ps3 linux like video editing software for conversion/compression etc... SInce Cell is so highly touted for this.

Any word on any of this?

 

[Rangers]

So, like, when you buy a PS3, Linux comes on it (or on a disc with it?) Period? Is that right?
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SexyBosom

 

[hey69]

no sony has nothing to do with the OS outside of the one (xmb) thats on it.

you have to buy/download whatever your own ps3 compatible linux distro and install it.
already 2 distros are available if i'm not mistaken.

 

[Rolf N]

Windows games won't run. Cell is not an x86 processor
The Linux distro can be downloaded (for free) from the Yellow Dog website and must be burned to a DVD. Then you boot that disc in the PS3 and it lets you install Linux on a harddrive partition separate from the game OS.
It's pretty fucked up IMO that there's no disc bundled in with the system. That really should have been the way to go.

Didn't check whether or not ydl has the goods up already, but I guess they don't.

 

[Rangers]

Windows games won't run. Cell is not an x86 processor
The Linux distro can be downloaded (for free) from the Yellow Dog website and must be burned to a DVD. Then you boot that disc in the PS3 and it lets you install Linux on a harddrive partition separate from the game OS.
It's pretty fucked up IMO that there's no disc bundled in with the system. That really should have been the way to go.

Didn't check whether or not ydl has the goods up already, but I guess they don't.

Nah I can see that. 99.9% of the people who buy "the playstation" dont care...it's not mass market.

It's definitly something I'd toy with, though..
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Redhead Webcam

 

[_xxx_]

As mentioned, that would make me get rid of my HTPC imediately. Would be great.

What if the Linux distro damages something, how will Sony handle this, support-wise? Say, the partitioning goes wrong and damages the PS3 OS?

 

[DJ12]

no sony has nothing to do with the OS outside of the one (xmb) thats on it.

you have to buy/download whatever your own ps3 compatible linux distro and install it.
already 2 distros are available if i'm not mistaken.

I'd say Yellow Dog Linux was "official" considering Sony sent Yellow Dog a devkit or three so they could work on it.

The other one is just a PPC distro, not designed specifically for PS3 or CELL, definitely not the one to use if you ask me.

 

[pegisys]

As mentioned, that would make me get rid of my HTPC imediately. Would be great.

What if the Linux distro damages something, how will Sony handle this, support-wise? Say, the partitioning goes wrong and damages the PS3 OS?

is the PS3 OS on the HDD, I would think since the HDD is upgradeable they would have it on a rom on the MB. either why I'm sure they have some way to fix it if no more then to format the HDD and reinstall everything

I think a mythTV port for the PS3 will probably be out shortly after linux is available, but I wouldn't get rid my htpc for it, I don't think it would be as integrated or flexible as a standalone htpc solution, beside the pain of having to transfer all of my media over since I finally got everything the way I want it

The other one is just a PPC distro, not designed specifically for PS3 or CELL, definitely not the one to use if you ask me.

cell support has been in the linux kernel for a while now, but I think 3rd party OS's on the PS3 only get to use the PPE and 265MB of ram, or something along those lines

 

[Titanio]

What if the Linux distro damages something, how will Sony handle this, support-wise? Say, the partitioning goes wrong and damages the PS3 OS?

The partition utility is part of Sony's GameOS, so if it messes up, it'd be their responsibility I imagine. The GameOS boots out of flash memory, though, IIRC, so I don't think there's a risk of compromising it like that.

The other one is just a PPC distro, not designed specifically for PS3 or CELL, definitely not the one to use if you ask me.

YDL isn't really 'official' but it is probably the distro that is most tailored to PS3 right now.

As far as I know, though, any PPC distro should be patchable and installable on PS3 now. Sony themselves used FC5 in their documentation as an example.

 

[Carl B]

How are people only now becoming interested in the awesomness that is Linux oon PS3? Skilzy, I'm shaking my head at you...

Anyway I don't think it's too much of a stretch to call Yellow Dog the semi-official distro of PS3 for the moment; afterall it's what Sony is using in their own Cell-based cluster. And FYI Yellow Dog is a Fedora 5 derivative to begin with, so I think for now it's just the Fedora 5 strains of Linux that will be good to go on PS3 (although there are a couple in that list for sure).

IBM's going the Red Hat route, and Fedora Core 5 was also the 'flavor' of Linux they've been using throughout Cell's software development.

 

[Arwin]

As mentioned, that would make me get rid of my HTPC imediately. Would be great.

What if the Linux distro damages something, how will Sony handle this, support-wise? Say, the partitioning goes wrong and damages the PS3 OS?

Yeah, the PS3 has a 128mb OS in ROM (a.k.a. the 'GameOS'), which can handle all these things. It also comes into play when you add in a new HDD. It's all very painless. Basically the GameOS is just a really big BIOS .

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Since I have heard that this can be done. I wonder if you will be able to run linux games or something like WINE to run windows games?

Maybe even some will write custom apps for ps3 linux like video editing software for conversion/compression etc... SInce Cell is so highly touted for this.

Any word on any of this?

Definitely. That's been a lot of the talk about PS3 Linux for the past couple of years! If Sony let Linux on there, and let people developer for it, the apps that could be produced could be pretty damned awesome. Various graphics programs should totally whizz on the platform, because of Cell, lots of BW, and a fixed GPU to target.

What if the Linux distro damages something, how will Sony handle this, support-wise? Say, the partitioning goes wrong and damages the PS3 OS?

In theory, Linux shouldn't be able to mess up the rest of the system. If something does go wrong there is a reset system type option in the XMB which restores defaults for running repairs. Not really what you want to see in a console, but having the option is important and should ensure you can't break the machine with running some renegade application.

 

[PG2G]

Think I read that it currently doesn't support hardware video acceleration, anyone else see that somewhere?

 

[Arwin]

What I'm wondering is how good the Cell processor would be for emulation. Certainly multi-core processors with local store memory should definitely have an advantage in this respect, shouldn't they? I mean, you could virtualise several hardware components over different cores ... sure it wouldn't be easy at first, but it could be really efficient because you may have less trouble from parts of the code that slow you down, and you don't need to context switch all the time for different operations.

Or am I completely off-base here? I haven't involved myself into emulation all that much, so obviously I could be very wrong.

EDIT: yeah, I'm hoping Nvidia and Sony will a driver to be released for the RSX.

 

[SPM]

Think I read that it currently doesn't support hardware video acceleration, anyone else see that somewhere?

Sony haven't provided hardware drivers for the X-Window System used by Linux.

There is one of three things Sony has to do to get hardware accelerated video on PS3 Linux:

1) Provice access to and document the hardware so open source programmers can write open source accelerated drivers.
2) Provide OpenGL drivers for compiz / proprietary accelerated drivers for the X-Window System, as nVidia and ATI do.
3) Provide an X-Server running as an application in GameOS to which Linux running as a separate virtual OS can connect to. This is like a thinclient connecting to a server, except that the loopback interface is used instead of the network.

1 or 2 are desirable. 3 would allow the BR playback, GameOS browser and other Game OS functions to run on the Linux desktop, but would take up more RAM.

 

[hey69]

What I'm wondering is how good the Cell processor would be for emulation. Certainly multi-core processors with local store memory should definitely have an advantage in this respect, shouldn't they? I mean, you could virtualise several hardware components over different cores ... sure it wouldn't be easy at first, but it could be really efficient because you may have less trouble from parts of the code that slow you down, and you don't need to context switch all the time for different operations.

Or am I completely off-base here? I haven't involved myself into emulation all that much, so obviously I could be very wrong.

EDIT: yeah, I'm hoping Nvidia and Sony will a driver to be released for the RSX.

you know that ps2 emu released a while ago? I cant remember the name but it was posted somehwere with some nice GFX . i didnt check it out myself (my pc is too slow) but on dualcore x86's it runs very good with upscaled gfx. maybe we can start to play (in the future) our ps2 games trough linux on the ps3 eliminating the ps2onachip inside the box

 

[PeterT]

There are 2 aspects to the emulation discussion:

One is theory: Here, the Cell BE should be pretty awesome for emulation, because of the reasons mentioned by Arwin among others.

The other is practical: Writing an emulator for most gaming systems is a very complex task, and optimizing it for a heterogenous IOE architecture like the Cell makes the whole process even more difficult.

Personally I expect emulators for all systems up to the PS1/N64 to be ported quickly and be fully functional quite soon (measured in months). For Dreamcast, PS2, Gamecube and (maybe) Xbox the situation is different: all should be possible to emulate in full speed given a "perfect" emulator tailored to PS3 (except maybe Xbox because of the relatively fast OOE processor), but I don't expect any playable emulators to show up anytime soon, if ever. For one, all of these systems are still far from perfect on even the most high-end PCs. Some are not even completely documented. Also, no one cares enough for its games to write an Xbox emulator

Now, the true question is: Will we see a Wii emulator
(I'm joking here)

Btw, hey69, PCSX2 doesn't "upscale" PS2 games. It is capable of truly rendering them in higher resolution. With 4xAA and 16xAF also in many cases, as it's mostly CPU limited.

 

[PG2G]

You think they could manage PS2/GC emulation without hardware acceleration?

 

[Rolf N]

You think they could manage PS2/GC emulation without hardware acceleration?

No.

 

[Arwin]

You think they could manage PS2/GC emulation without hardware acceleration?

I know, and so should most people (looks to post above), that Sony intends to deliver PS2 software emulation. They stated they are close to being good enough to do it fully in software, but aren't there just yet (i.e. not enough games running yet, and they are being very ambitious), which is why they decided to include the hardware emulation right now. IBM said a few words on how committed Sony is to PS2 emulation, both in software and in general.