I doubt this will happen but I'd like the 'Home Server' PS3
- Thread starter Megadrive1988
- Start date
PC-Engine said:
Well pc i don't think dual layer is a big deal for a console.
a normal 4-6x dvd r with 4.7 gigs cap is more than enough for saving games and new content along with a movie per dvd .
Esp since it only costs 2 dollars a dvd and is droping quickly (when i got my 2x dvd r it was 8$ a dvd and thats jsut a year and a half ago)
A hd capable 4x - 6x dvd r would be a great feature for next gen consoles and is most likely what we will end up with.
Correct. And gee, isn't this a better footing to start out on than sarcastically asking why someone would "spend that much" ($700) when there were others selling for under $300? No examination of companies or model/feature comparisons or quality reports... No applying consumer shopping to targets you feel like and not to the ones you don't...PC-Engine said:
We pretty much went over these same things last time (when PSX discussions were up), and I was rather hoping to not see them recur.
At any rate, now that things are logical and equivalent, people can spar back and forth about other features (such as how Panasonic's $700 list DVD/HD recorder is again missing all inputs--DV, card, and otherwise--and their associated picture and video formats; you need the $1200 model for that), or hash about having/lacking + formats, time slipping, or what have you. Nobody's even touched on picture quality or dependability!
For myself, I could give a rat's ass about any of these machines. DVD recroders go in the PC, dammit!
The only obvious thing is that Sony has crap for options right now. (And looks like it won't get better until the PSX comes Stateside--though at that point it gets notable better-looking, so long as they don't settle on huge price points.) The "price-worthiness" I'll leave up to others--and the market--to determine. (Though I might have an appropriate Consumer Reports lying around to see what THEY say on the matter... Hehe.)
Huh? The Panasonic has so much over the SONY of the same price its not even funny. Does the SONY have card inputs? I don't think so...like I said the only thing the SONY has over the Panasonic is the DV input THAT'S IT!!. It has no HDD, no timeslip, no DD 2.0 encoding, no MP3 playback, while the Panasonic does. Picture quality and reliability are obviously not discussed because they're comparable and not worth mentioning. What associated picture and video formats are you talking about??? The + fomat is not an issue because it has a HDD! If you want to transfer something from the HDD to a DVD-R you can. Why do you need to be able to record to a + RW disk??? What do you think the HDD is for??? Please give me a scenario where I would need + RW capablility when I already have the Panasonic HDD DVD recorder...
How does the SONY RDR-GX7 compare to the Pioneer DVR-310 or Toshiba D-R2 both which support -RW, timeslip, MP3, WMA, JPEG, and get this..DV input for ~ $350??? Now again why would I want to spend $500 on the SONY??? Oh I know because it also supports the + format but no MP3, WMA, JPEG playback LOL. Then there's the Toshiba RD-SX32 which has a 80 GB HDD, supports DVD-RAM and DVD-RW, DV input, MP3, JPEG, etc. for ~ $470 with a retail of $700. BTW Pioneer, Panasonic, Toshiba standalone DVD players do not support the + format. Why would they need to if they already support the - format? Good luck playing that +RW disc you just recorded on any Pioneer, Panasonic, or Toshiba player.
Edit: Add Hitachi, Sharp and Samsung to that list.Panasonic DMR-E80H ~ $500 - 80GB HDD, MP3, Dolby Digital 2.0 encoding, recording formats DVD-R, DVD-RAM.
Toshiba RD-SX32 ~ $470 - 80GB HDD, MP3/WMA/JPEG, DV input, Dolby Digital 2.0 encoding, recording formats DVD-R, DVD-RW, DVD-RAM.
Pioneer DVR-510H ~ $550 - 80GB HDD, MP3/WMA/JPEG, DV input, Dolby Digital 2.0 encoding, recording formats DVD-R, DVD-RW.
Toshiba D-R2 ~ $350 - MP3/WMA/JPEG, DV input, Dolby Digital 2.0 encoding, recording formats DVD-R, DVD-RW, DVD-RAM.
Pioneer DVR-310 ~ $350 - MP3/WMA/JPEG, DV input, Dolby Digital 2.0 encoding, recording formats DVD-R, DVD-RW.
SONY RDR-GX7 ~ $500 - DV input, recording formats DVD-R, DVD-RW, DVD+RW.
OK now let me ask you this. If I had a budget of ~ $500 why in the world would I go with the SONY model????
Why are you guys bashing each other upside the head with different brands of digital recorders? Just buy the one ya like whydoncha.
Just buy the one ya like whydoncha. I don't like the current DVD recorders offered in the US market. I've seen Japanese fliers with models around the $500-800 (given current exchange rates) levels with + and - capability and 160 GB or greater HDD integrated.
Here's why DVD-RAM isn't that useful to me. I have two DirectTivos already so Timeslip doesn't provide anything I don't already have.
What I need is a portable, re-useable format. I current record some HBO shows on VHS for friends and family. I don't charge any money and I know the MPAA still doesn't like that.
But I want to put at least 4 hours of recordings on a rewriteable disc (don't like the idea of using + or - R discs for one-time viewing, no matter how cheap the media gets).
Don't care about MP3, WMA, WMV, Divx, etc. Just want a portable, timeshifting format. I probably would have gotten one of the Philips models if I hadn't known about what's available in Japan and hope that better models get sold here eventually.
Here's why DVD-RAM isn't that useful to me. I have two DirectTivos already so Timeslip doesn't provide anything I don't already have.
What I need is a portable, re-useable format. I current record some HBO shows on VHS for friends and family. I don't charge any money and I know the MPAA still doesn't like that.
But I want to put at least 4 hours of recordings on a rewriteable disc (don't like the idea of using + or - R discs for one-time viewing, no matter how cheap the media gets).
Don't care about MP3, WMA, WMV, Divx, etc. Just want a portable, timeshifting format. I probably would have gotten one of the Philips models if I hadn't known about what's available in Japan and hope that better models get sold here eventually.
DVD-RW
Pioneer and Toshiba both support DVD-RW timeslip recording without a HDD as I've shown in my post above. I'm pretty sure in Japan it isn't any different. As a matter of fact there is less support for DVD+RW than there is DVD-RW with regards to standalone recorders/players not to mention blank DVD-RWs are cheaper too. AFAIK every rewriter on the market can write to DVD-RWs. Can't say the same for DVD+RW.
Megadrive1988
Veteran
We are not going to have two differently configured PS3s. What will happen is, Sony will release a base PS3 for games + movies, and probably later a deluxe 'PSX-type' PS3 with many more features for those wanting a complete entertainment machine with recording functions, HDD (or larger HDD if base PS3 has one). The chipset for games will remain the same. the deluxe 'PSX' PS3 will have the same graphics and CPU performance as the lower cost PS3. that is what will most likely actually happen.
I stretched the idea, injected my own wishful thinking, taking it a step further by mentioning that a deluxe highend PS3 could also have much more processing power with additional CPUs and GPUs. as well as more RAM. along the like what GSCube had. PS3 games could run on both machines, but if used in the highend PS3, the games could run with much greater detail and higher resolution. now we all know this WONT happen.
however, another idea, to extend the life of PS3 for many many years, would be to make PS3s linkable. especially the base PS3. when PS3 comes down in price to say $150~$100, the idea becomes more feasable. you could connect 2,4 or even 8 PS3's together. new games could be intruduced to take advantage of more than one PS3. we're talking in the 2010 timeframe though. this could extend the life of PS3, if Sony wanted to, or needed to. say if PS4 needs more years of R&D time.
that idea is alot less unbelivable than Ken K's own crazy ideas of having PS3s unite over the internet for realtime processing.
now, by all means, feel free to rip my post to shreds. I don't mind.
Actually I thought it did, but that was my bad. Hehe... You get them on the $550 and $1200 Panasonics, but none of the others it seems. (+$500 for the card slots, a DV port, and +40GB in the hard drive? I'm not sure why the two DVD/HD models are so far apart, considering the same things [minus the +40GB of course] on the HD-less models seems to make for only a $100 sway. It's a bit peculiar why they priced the E100HS as they did...)PC-Engine said:
Well frankly I have no idea about the specifics. Not everyone lists their features the same way (what is "non-linear editing" talking about? Which outputs and converters handle what, specifically?), and since it's not a device I want, I don't really pay attention. At least you're comparing features now, though.
Frankly, way too many people obsess over the picture quality of regular DVD players, so how would it make no difference for DVD recorders? Certainly for those to whom it matters, it will be an influencing factor. Again, not something I can talk about, having not shopped for these devices and seen them. <shrugs> (After checking Consumer Reports, though, the other quality and reliability factors are indeed even. At least straight down the line for all the major names they reviewed. Would likely have been different if they brought in the podunk companies...
)But, uh... Weren't we talking about only the HD-less models to begin with? I was kinda sticking to the initial circumstances. Bringing in the E80H is fine for other comparisons as well, but try to not be bombastic about the original premise, eh?
It's not so much the "not having +" as the "not recording/rewriting on DVD-RW either." Basically every PC recorder out there (far more numerous, and the #1 device one wants compatability with) is -RW or +RW (frequently both), so it's handiest to have those bases covered--at least to share rewritable duty with. (Obviously playing one on the other isn't an issue, but the DVD-RAM drive offered can't record on -RW, and the vast majority of PC burners are not -RAM.)
Not to mention DVD-RAM media is less-easily available and far more expensive (well more than 2x the cost, especially on the RAM disks with 9.4GB capacity). The rewritability is better, but most people would never run out 1000x re-records let alone 100,000 so it's not like they're paying attention to THAT. Hehe... The higher capacity on a single disk is good, but the $/GB is plenty worse, so some folks won't be too happy about that.
Curious, too, since Panasonic makes a great "DVD MULTI" drive for the PC which covers the whole spectrum. (Well, still not the +'s, but it has -RW which is all that really matters as an addition.) Guess the cost difference between those drives is a bit larger than they'd want to cover.
Obviously "compatability between set-top DVD recorders and other ones" is not high on the "giving a shit" list.BTW Pioneer, Panasonic, Toshiba standalone DVD players do not support the + format. Why would they need to if they already support the - format? Good luck playing that +RW disc you just recorded on any Pioneer, Panasonic, or Toshiba player.
(I mean, how many do you plan on having in your house? ) Between the recorder and PC's it is, though, and that it has moreso than others. (I think mainly them and Philips, who doesn't record in -R or -RW, which is bad.) PC's are coming pretty standard with DVD recorders at this point, and they seem to be +R/+RW first, if they even include others afterward.First off, when have I been promoting the Sony model or expressing any desire for it? Even were I considering such devices, I would neither get myself nor recommend the RDR-GX7, as it is indeed overpriced for what it offers. (You'd basically have to have some specialized needs to consider one. Say, definitely needing the DV connection, or desiring +RW and -RW capabilities...)
Of all of them, Toshiba's RD-XS32 looks to offer the most stuff for the least $$$, so I'd swing that way if I were considering them at all. Though I'm a bit confused about this model... why in heck does Toshiba have no mention of it on their site?
(Well, at least it's here, but they should really buck up their international sites.Regardless, I objected to your heavy-handed, mocking tone and illogical approach, which is all I wanted to square up. And since you'd done it before, I was possibly being a bit testier than usual.
Sony probably rides on their name for this device, as they're certainly not making much of an effort in this sector--and we're unlikely to see anything much from them in the DVD/HD vein until PSX shows up. But we're talking about a $0-150 swing with certain feature trade-offs (models depending) not some $350-more behemoth getting beat up on the playground.Would be interesting to see the sales numbers, though. Even Consumer Reports put it last in their overall rating (basically because of that high price) so if it IS selling more than others despite that...?
Tells something scary about consumer buying habits. I rarely if ever see sales figures that specific, however.---------------
At any rate, this this is pretty far away from the topic, and we've pretty much dried up anything useful to say anyway.
PC-Engine:
I doubt it that anyone is interested in what YOU would buy and what not. Obviously, Sony CAN AFFORD to sell their products despite having less features in distinct cases at a higher price than their competition. From this we can assume that obviously there ARE people that buy the higher priced Sony products so what is the point in whinning about what is a fair price and what not? I don't see anyone complaining about Ferraris car prices compared to cheaper sportscars that can do more for *less* money. So much for brand preference.
pc-engine said:
I doubt it that anyone is interested in what YOU would buy and what not. Obviously, Sony CAN AFFORD to sell their products despite having less features in distinct cases at a higher price than their competition. From this we can assume that obviously there ARE people that buy the higher priced Sony products so what is the point in whinning about what is a fair price and what not? I don't see anyone complaining about Ferraris car prices compared to cheaper sportscars that can do more for *less* money. So much for brand preference.
PC-Engine:
Perhaps if I would be smoking, maybe your arguments would make some sense then? :? But that's probably just wishful thinking on my side...
Where did I say SONY == Ferrari? I brought up Ferrari because it is one of those brands that are leagues above others where prices are concern - despite other sportcar brands that have at least as much going for them technically. For all your argument is worth, I could have picked BMW's / Mercedes - BMW's / Jaguar's or what ever one would prefer.
I guess most consumers out there must be idiots then. I also must be imagening factors such as brand-recognition, quality, design/style, brand-loyalty and many others that are totally absent in your black and white world..
If you can manage to make as much money as SONY selling sh*t on ebay, I'll be the first to congratulate you. As long as this is not the case, I am left wondering.... what's YOUR point?
If the world would be as simple as black and white, sure. It isn't though and there are more factors to consider. However if you ask which player has the better price/performance ratio, then I'd have to agree (based on the information you supplied and that they are correct).
I didn't delete anything nor did I edit my post. I am not quite sure which post you are refering to - but it certainly isn't mine. Please elaborate?
PC-Engine said:
Perhaps if I would be smoking, maybe your arguments would make some sense then? :? But that's probably just wishful thinking on my side...
PC-Engine said:
Where did I say SONY == Ferrari? I brought up Ferrari because it is one of those brands that are leagues above others where prices are concern - despite other sportcar brands that have at least as much going for them technically. For all your argument is worth, I could have picked BMW's / Mercedes - BMW's / Jaguar's or what ever one would prefer.
PC-Engine said:
I guess most consumers out there must be idiots then. I also must be imagening factors such as brand-recognition, quality, design/style, brand-loyalty and many others that are totally absent in your black and white world..
PC-Engine said:
If you can manage to make as much money as SONY selling sh*t on ebay, I'll be the first to congratulate you. As long as this is not the case, I am left wondering.... what's YOUR point?
PC-Engine said:
If the world would be as simple as black and white, sure. It isn't though and there are more factors to consider. However if you ask which player has the better price/performance ratio, then I'd have to agree (based on the information you supplied and that they are correct).
PC-Engine said:
I didn't delete anything nor did I edit my post. I am not quite sure which post you are refering to - but it certainly isn't mine. Please elaborate?
hmm.. I don't want to defend anyone, but I've been on this forum for the whole day... and I didn't notice anything argumentworthy being deleted from Phil's posts :?
PC-Engine's last post was heavily edited though... (response to the Phil's quite innocent Ferrari analogue)
Now, of the topic on hand.... I have nothing to say
PC-Engine's last post was heavily edited though... (response to the Phil's quite innocent Ferrari analogue)
Now, of the topic on hand.... I have nothing to say
Offhand I just got pretty confused by that last exchange--especially since nobie's attempt to shift things back to the Subject matter looks so out of place in the middle of everything else. Heh...
Phil's mainly bringing up the non-technical factors that influence people's buying decisions--which we all know are there. Of course we were pretty much talking ABOUT the technical side specifically...
I'll just leave off with the comment that Sony pretty much MUST be selling an amount acceptable to them, else they'd either drop the product or be forced to drop the price to get some useful volume. So whatever factors are in play, they're certainly having an impact.
Phil's mainly bringing up the non-technical factors that influence people's buying decisions--which we all know are there. Of course we were pretty much talking ABOUT the technical side specifically...
I'll just leave off with the comment that Sony pretty much MUST be selling an amount acceptable to them, else they'd either drop the product or be forced to drop the price to get some useful volume. So whatever factors are in play, they're certainly having an impact.
Hmm...that's mighty strange. I edited my original post because the only thing that was left of Phil's *original* post was this line:
...now his post is back to it's orginal state... :?
anyway...
I understand what you're saying Phil. There WILL be people who buy the SONY model over the others, but not many. Though if they did it would be over superficial things like brand, appearance, color etc. not functional things.
The point I was making is why any normal person would pay MORE for less functionality. For $500 you're only getting an additonal + format on the SONY, while losing the 80GB HDD, MP3/WMA/JPEG, Dolby Digital 2.0 encoding, DVD-RAM. I don't think styling will be one of the main factors that causes people to go with the SONY model, because from the pictures I've seen, it doesn't look that much different from the competition.
Anyway to sorta get back on topic. I don't think many people will buy the SONY DVD recorders in the US especially when there is only one model in their lineup and it doesn't even have a HDD. Maybe this is because they already have plans for the PSX to be their volume selling DVD recorder?
...now his post is back to it's orginal state... :?
anyway...
I understand what you're saying Phil. There WILL be people who buy the SONY model over the others, but not many. Though if they did it would be over superficial things like brand, appearance, color etc. not functional things.
The point I was making is why any normal person would pay MORE for less functionality. For $500 you're only getting an additonal + format on the SONY, while losing the 80GB HDD, MP3/WMA/JPEG, Dolby Digital 2.0 encoding, DVD-RAM. I don't think styling will be one of the main factors that causes people to go with the SONY model, because from the pictures I've seen, it doesn't look that much different from the competition.
Anyway to sorta get back on topic. I don't think many people will buy the SONY DVD recorders in the US especially when there is only one model in their lineup and it doesn't even have a HDD. Maybe this is because they already have plans for the PSX to be their volume selling DVD recorder?
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