How well can Gamecube do bumpmapping?

For bloddy sake, it's a freaking bump/normal map. It's NOT a gloss map. Anyone that's actually worked with some bitmaps to make different levels of gloss on a 3D character would know that you can't fake height with it. you only get 256 levels of gloss if I remrmber right. Infact, the icy road surface in ralisport has the same gloss value all across it. The bump/normal map gives the illusion of height and the lights takes that into account.

It could even be embossed bump mapping instead of dot 3 (although I think it's most likely a normal map), since the chip in xbox supports all the bump mapping formats. Also as far as nvidia is concerned, bump mapping falls under "pixel shading".

You guys that haven't played the bloddy game before need to stop talking about what you haven't seen. it is 100% bump mapping on the ICE levels without any doubt Imo.
 
I'm just not seeing height, I am seeing a darker reflective surface mixed in with snow, the last screen shown actually shows well that its just a good texture.(and dont say it isnt reflective, because it reflects)
 
This is a gloss map. Notice how the road surface doesn't look bumpy. It's flat and ares of the track are masked out with the gloss map.

large04.jpg
 
DeathKnight:

> cybamerc, you really need to stop digging yourself into a deeper hole.
> Now it's becoming utterly pathetic.

The only one who is digging himself into a hole is you. I haven't ruled out bump mapping but I've stated my reasons for thinking it's a gloss map. You've completely failed to provide any logical argumentation and instead resort to posting pictures (that don't exactly help your case) and insults.

When you start making sense you can act smug. Until then... begone.



Kolgar:

> The only place I remember for sure where SMB uses bump mapping is
> on the "Target" multiplayer game.

Hmm... I will have to check that later. It's been a while since I played the game but I can't say I've ever noticed any bump mapping.



Ozymandis:

> Would nVidia trumpet gloss maps as "pixel shading"? I wouldn't think so.

Why not? That's what it is.



Qroach:

> This is a gloss map. Notice how the road surface doesn't look bumpy.

It doesn't look bumpy because the specularity has been toned down and aside from the cracks in the road the specularity is pretty uniform. The underlying texture also has something to say.
 
Captain,

They are specular highlights. that's what gives the impression of depth. The darker/deeper areas aren't recieving the light, so you won't get the highlights on those areas. It's possible to do specular and diffuse dot3 bump mapping in a single pass.
 
Cyber,

It doesn't look bumpy because the specularity has been toned down and aside from the cracks in the road the specularity is pretty uniform. The underlying texture also has something to say.

That's basically a load of BS. even if they just turned the specularity down on the paved road surface it would still give the appearence of bumps. The icy roads are bump mapped where the non icy roads, or paved surfaces in the game are are NOT bump mapped. You need to play the game and/or shut up about it. I'm so tired of seeing you troll like this.
 
Why does RSC bumpmaps just disappear halfway?

Back to topic, many GC games do not use bumpmaps is mainly because they cutdown on the Cube fillrates? I wonder how heavy is bumpmapping on GC?
 
Qroach:

> even if they just turned the specularity down on the paved road surface
> it would still give the appearence of bumps.

So now you agree with me that it is possible to make things appear bumpy with a gloss map? You make little sense.

> I'm so tired of seeing you troll like this.

Who the hell is trolling you fucking dolt? It's always like this with you Xbots. "Oh noz.... teh mean man si saying our XBOX can't do teh bumpy maps." I am not ruling out that the ice is bump mapped but based on screen shots I see no reason to believe that it is. Other ppl who have the game seem to agree with me. The biggest X-drones on this board obviously disagree.

But please explain to me how saying that something is gloss mapped constitutes trolling? Are you that much of a brainwashed gfx whore that anything below bump mapping isn't acceptable. If so, you're a fucking sad excuse for a human being.

Fuck... I might as well be talking trash about your mothers. The reactions are every bit as rabid.
 
So now you agree with me that it is possible to make things appear bumpy with a gloss map? You make little sense.

No, try reading it again! you seem to have a comprehension problem. I said turning down the speculaty wouldn't make a bump map look any flatter, or turning up specular reflections wouldn't a gloss map appear to look like a bump map. The point is they are NOT using a bump map on the paved surfaces, but they are ont he ICE surfaces. You're clearly wrong (as usual). if you saw it in motion in frotn of you, you'd see it.

The fact you won't listen to the people that have the game, and continue to argue your points with no ground to stand on is exactly WHY people call you a troll.

Who the hell is trolling you fucking dolt?


YOU are trolling, you little kiddie. Everytime you open your mouth about xbox, it's another troll statment. you do the same thing day in and day out. look at this, you're arguing about an effect in a game you haven't actually seen. Arguing about something in a game with people that actually own it, is what a troll does. When it comes to xbox, or anything on xbox, what your're saying simply can't be trusted/listened to, since you're 9 times out of 10 NOT correct and or your statment is tainted with a biased approach. Plain and simple.
 
I think in the end, who cares? There are plenty of other Xbox games that most certainly use bumpmapping. Halo, GUNVALKYRIE, Panzer Dragoon Orta, Bloodwake, among others.


cybamerc, I don't know if I'd call you a troll... but you have the dirty mouth of a 14 year old child, and it's kind of annoying seeing that language in almost every single one of your posts. :rolleyes:
 
Qroach:

> No, try reading it again! you seem to have a comprehension problem.

Maybe if your writing skills weren't botched I'd have an honest chance.

> I said turning down the speculaty wouldn't make a bump map look any
> flatter

What bump map? You've already said that the paved road wasn't bump mapped.

This is a gloss map. Notice how the road surface doesn't look bumpy. It's flat and ares of the track are masked out with the gloss map.

That's basically a load of BS. even if they just turned the specularity down on the paved road surface it would still give the appearence of bumps.

Please note that you were talking specifically about the paved road.

There are severe continuity issues in your posts. I can't be bothered making sense of something where I have to make guesses to get a meaning out of it.

> The point is they are NOT using a bump map on the paved surfaces, but
> they are ont he ICE surfaces.

Why did you specifically mention the paved road in both your examples then? Either you're backpeddling or you're one confused individual.

> You're clearly wrong (as usual).

Nonsense. There are ppl who have the game that agree with me. It's not that clear cut.

> if you saw it in motion in frotn of you, you'd see it.

I admit, that the possibility exists. As I've pointed out several times I'm basing my opinion on screenshots.

> The fact you won't listen to the people that have the game

I do. It just so happens, that the ones who have been able to formulate proper arguments are also the ones that agree with me.

> and continue to argue your points with no ground to stand on is exactly
> WHY people call you a troll.

People = you and Johnny (not so) Awesome. What an overwhelming opposition!

> Everytime you open your mouth about xbox, it's another troll statment.

Why? How? If you can't concretize your complaints I can't take them seriously.

> you're arguing about an effect in a game you haven't actually seen.

Which I have made sure to mention several times. That said I have seen screenshots and noone has been able to offer compelling counter-arguments to my claims.

> Arguing about something in a game with people that actually own it, is
> what a troll does.

What about the ppl that have the game and are of a similar opinion?

> since you're 9 times out of 10 NOT correct

Impressive! May I gander a peek at the research that this statistic is based on?



Johnny Awesome:

> Cybamerc is a little dense at times. He can't tell a gloss map from a
> bump map. Foolish kid should go back to school.

Another insightful post from Johnny Awesome. I'm so glad you find the time to share your wisdom with the rest of us in between writing all those informed console articles.
 
Bump mapped, not bump mapped... Whatever the case, this thread has been good for a couple of good laughs.

Thanks, all - and happy holidays!

:D

Kolgar
 
Happy holiday Kolgar! :)

And cybermerc, I'm not goign to continue arguing with someone that hasn't seen the bloddy game. The fact you keep arguing this is completley idiotic! It's bump mapped, get it through your thick skull.
 
I have the game(PC Version). It is bump mapped. Not everywhere but where it needs to be on some parts of the tracks.

It looks great and performs great too. However looking great and performing great does not maketh a great game. Fortunately this game plays rather splendidly too.
 
DICE has some serious talent. I think it'd be wise for MS to try and buy them out (if they haven't already).
 
Im sure you know this CaptainHowdy but DX bump mapping does not deform the polygons, all it does is add the illusion of height detail to 2D textures. It does work pretty well but it is just a hack.

Interestingly it was the BB's that made this technology. :)
 
Interestingly it was the BB's that made this technology.

BB did not invent bump mapping, they did invent the a specific bumpmapping technique EMBM. I believe it was Jim Blinn who first suggested the idea.
 
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