Halo: Reach

Is the resolution and AA really the single most important thing in graphics?

It was meant more specifically towards bungie and thier previous engine, to me the single most important thing for them to improve on is the IQ. Everything else was already fine and doubt it can be improved upon to give as great effect as improved IQ.

For example they may talk about improved lighting, better LOD system, bouncing sparks etc. but none of those things were bad in the first place and improved IQ is more important to me than improvements in any of those other individual areas.
 
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I don't think they will be using the same method for HDR.
I'm talking about the Light Pre-Pass (version A) where the first pass is to render out the normal & depth buffers. These will have to fit within the eDRAM simultaneously to avoid tiling. The other version of LPP avoids the second geometry pass whilst rendering out the specular info along with the other two buffers.
 
why should they avoid tiling? it was mention by sebbi that performance hit its not so big. It can be tricky to implement but i think bungi can handle it.
 
why should they avoid tiling? it was mention by sebbi that performance hit its not so big. It can be tricky to implement but i think bungi can handle it.
Not saying they should or should not do it. That's entirely up to them sparing the time for redundant processing. It's just easier if they can avoid it. But who knows, maybe they can afford it.
 
Is the resolution and AA really the single most important thing in graphics?

Well, even the best graphics are ruined if you try to display them in a sub-720p resolution without any AA and blurry texture filtering. Image quality does have an important role IMHO.
 
Is there some good article on pre-pass lighting renderers? I recall GTA4 being one, and UC1/2 the other of the better known examples...
 
People should manage their expections. Reach won't be "Halo 3.5" even though some will claim it regardless of what it ends up looking like, but 60 fps is very unlikely.

720p w/2x AA sounds reasonable, hopefully they've embraced tiling.
 
Is there some good article on pre-pass lighting renderers? I recall GTA4 being one, and UC1/2 the other of the better known examples...

Ah yup. More recently:
http://www.bungie.net/images/Inside/publications/siggraph/Engel/LightPrePass.ppt (some nice flow diagrams to describe the setup).

CryTek's version:
http://www.crytek.com/fileadmin/user_upload/inside/presentations/2009/Light_Propagation_Volumes.pdf

A good blog post on deferred "shading vs lighting" (4MRT G buffer vs multipass MRT setup):
http://gameangst.com/?p=141

Crackdown had a pretty similar (if not the same) way to setup their buffers as well.
 
I'm talking about the Light Pre-Pass (version A) where the first pass is to render out the normal & depth buffers. These will have to fit within the eDRAM simultaneously to avoid tiling. The other version of LPP avoids the second geometry pass whilst rendering out the specular info along with the other two buffers.

No problem in fitting normal + depth during the first pass in EDRAM, that's what all 720p (without MSAA) games do.
 
Right, but we were on the topic of 2xMSAA. :)

The original blog post by Wolfgang Engel on Light pre-pass suggested running the first pass and the subsequent lighting calculation without MSAA, then using MSAA only for the last pass, where, on 360, you only have to write to a color buffer.
 
Ah right. Forgot about that. :oops: Doesn't that mean any lit edges will be aliased :?:

Of course, it's a compromise. If you have a lit object on a distant unlit background, there will be some kind of jaggies, somewhere between what you'd get without AA, and the full MSAA.
 
Er, not really, his mission was to capture a Prophet, right? Then he tries to save Reach and fails, then they run for it and stumble upon Halo...
 
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