Na, the bad implementation in RE8 has nothing to do with the consoles. Look at Call of Duty Cold War which is the definition of a console game. Raytracing is fully scalable from the Series S to a 3090.
GPU Ray Tracing Performance Comparisons [2021-2022]
- Thread starter DavidGraham
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Na, the bad implementation in RE8 has nothing to do with the consoles. Look at Call of Duty Cold War which is the definition of a console game. Raytracing is fully scalable from the Series S to a 3090.
DavidGraham
Veteran
Makes sense. Hence i wrote it doesnt matter anyway in this particular case since well, the game doesnt take a huge hit on rdna2 pc gpus anyway. If the subtle RT would mean a huge framerate impact, then yes, it would be kinda annoying for RDNA2 pc gpu users. But they actually get quite good performance returns, likely due to the ray tracing being so light. Not all games are going to push ray tracing and other graphical features hard already at the start of the generation.
Most games so far that really aim for more heavy RT, yes then RDNA2 pc gpus suffer (and consoles even much more so), and then NV has the huge upper leg since their a generation ahead.
As said, RE is more of an outlier so far then a prime example of how games scale (luckily enough, they could have left RT out of any HW otherwise).
Unreal Engine 5 is going to be intresting.
Is it better to have a super heavy implementation than none at all? Of course. I don’t think thats better than the approach in Village though. Most RTX implementations that have options to achieve a reasonable performance hit comparable to Village do so by just turning RT off most of the time so its even less of an improvement than what people are complaining about here.
Better visual return through general gameplay. I’m not sure why you expect many reflections in the environment Village is portraying. GI is more noticeable in more places than the improved shadows in Tomb Raider. Particularly on the medium setting where performances are much more comparable. On medium RT shadows are only enabled for spot lights of which there are few.
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DavidGraham
Veteran
That's not true at all. RTX titles either disable some RT effects, or decrease the resolution of said effects as you go lower with RT settings.
I have news for you: RE8 has no difference between Low, Medium, and High RT, they are just stupid tricks, the highest RT setting is just the standard console implementation, I don't know how could anyone defend such a trash move! There is literally ZERO performance difference between all three.
https://www.computerbase.de/2021-05/resident-evil-village-benchmark-test/3/
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I was referring to the medium RT option in Tomb Raider.
I don't see how anyone can make a qualified statement on AMD RT hardware right now. It was literally just released a few months ago. Its a different implementation than RTX which has been around 2+ years. Given that RDNA2's RT doesn't accelerate everything that RTX does, it will force devs to come up with better solutions to deal with that issue and that's going to take time to implement.
I imagine that RDNA2 RT will never be as performant as most of RTX's current offerings but it does not mean we will not see more capable games that will better reflect what the current AMD cards can offer.
Subtlesnake
Regular
People are not asking for the 1/8 resolution reflections to be removed from Village, though. They are asking for the option to set higher resolutions, even in a text file! Perhaps Crysis is not right comparison point here, since it seems that even a 3060 can get playable framerates at 4K with ray tracing, and Alex said that his 3080 was sitting at 30% utilisation.
From the very moment RE8 RT benchmarks came out, the entire discussion up until now is about the same group of people pushing one thing: - How to use RE8 limitations to invalidate the results and blame an IHV.
Since those benchmarks were released however, an Elephant that goes against their goal appeared in the room: - Metro - Rational attempts to conciliate their agenda with the Elephant in the room are instantly dismissed. The self-back-patting-circle-jerk group shifted to obtain support from: More settings good! less settings bad.
The conversation, is very much the same. It cannot advance because the next piece of evidence went against them. And i'm watching.
DegustatoR
Legend
You're hilarious.
Its the ethos of a public forum. What was said, will be read.
Subtlesnake
Regular
The discussion started because troyan said he didn't like the IQ of the ray tracing implementation and provided a visual example. I think arguing in good faith requires addressing the actual points people bring up rather than attacking their presumed motivations.
Precisely, and when a particular comment fails to the standards of reason but gathers unwarranted support from others in the discussion, you then begin questioning motivations.
ideally, any poor reasoning stops right there. In this case, it kept going. A hallmark of this new Beyond3D forum we have on our hands.
I've been wondering - how do you notice half or quarter res RT for diffuse lighting like in Metro? It's easy to see the res structure in reflections (ie Miles, Control, easy to see), but I can't figure out what happens when you do that with GI, where the result is blurred, diffuse light. Or even RT shadows? Not sure if I'm making sense.
Exactly like you think! In Metro it is not possible to notice the res structure really - just that it is much noisier or frame cuts/disocclusions have more artefacts. To know the actual resolution, I ask the developers.
This highly depends on denoising and where it's placed in rendering pipeline.
In case of RE8 @ 4K, denoising works in low res 1080p space, then upscaling kicks in and increases spatial resolution of RT render target to 4K.
Upscaling for RT in RE8 is not depth aware and produces quite visible low resolution silhouettes along high res geometry edges and pixelation in general.
Also reflections upscaling quality is lower in comparison with 1080p image upscaled with bicubic filtering to 4K because they use full res RT with 1080p (and performance indicates the same)
Here are screens which illustrate this:
full res 4K screens - https://imgsli.com/NTM4NzY
1080p crops - https://imgsli.com/NTM4Nzc
Bicubic upscaling clearly improves quality of reflections)
If accumulation and denoising were done after upscaling in higher res space (and with bicubic upscaling), quality would have been way better than what we have in RE8 even without increasing RT resolution.
DegustatoR
Legend
The ethos of public forum is to discuss the matter which is brought up instead of derailing the discussion into personal insults and unrelated topics - which is what you are doing.
Are you reading? Cause to me it seems like you don't.
I doubt that anyone has any doubts that every "partnered" (I don't like saying "sponsored" for various reasons) PC title gets into some level of IHV politics. This isn't even up for serious discussion.
What is being actually discussed is the difference between these politics between different IHVs.
A difference thanks to which there is Metro Exodus EE with its abundance of new features, RT modes and upscaling options and there is RE8 where RT is seemingly cut down below quality tiers available for things like shadow maps.
DavidGraham
Veteran
No you don't have the right to question anything, all you have is to discuss the merits of the argument, for which you provided none, other than repeatedly referring to Metro Exodus without actually understanding what Metro Exodus does and how it is leaps and bounds above RE8.
