And of course we can't have any differences in how we fight it, can we Russ? If you think there might be some other way than bombing the living shit out of 3rd world countries, or favor a police-centric or diplomatic route to combatting terrorism, then you are in effect an agent of Al Queda, right? Yeah, real fucking inclusive.
Bush releases Vietnam-era Guard records
- Thread starter Natoma
- Start date
Interesting testimonial from a ANG contemporary of Pres. Bush's
http://www.washtimes.com/op-ed/20040210-082910-8424r.htm
http://www.washtimes.com/op-ed/20040210-082910-8424r.htm
digitalwanderer
Legend
That's a nice opinion and all Russ, but as I recall my brief brush with the military they seemed a bit overly fond of paperwork in triplicate and I find it just shy of impossible that Bush could have put in the time when he said he did yet the ONLY proof they got is the pay stubs.RussSchultz said:
Goodness, I had no idea somebody recounting his experiences was opinion. No wonder my world view is so skewed.
As for "only paystubs" there sure were a ton of paystubs handed out at that press conference by McClellan. From what I saw, it was about 30-50 photocopied sheets involved, and it was referred to in some less biased circles as "the vietnam era records" and contained things like which days he pulled duty, and other "icky" things like that.
As for "only paystubs" there sure were a ton of paystubs handed out at that press conference by McClellan. From what I saw, it was about 30-50 photocopied sheets involved, and it was referred to in some less biased circles as "the vietnam era records" and contained things like which days he pulled duty, and other "icky" things like that.
digitalwanderer
Legend
Exactly, and recounting of his experiences was opinion because it had nothing to do with Bush specifically...it was just another bit of FUD to imply that he COULD have been there and not been noticed.Natoma said:As John Reynolds recounted earlier, one can have paystubs and not have actually served. The Medical Records would be lock solid evidence and make this entire situation go away completely.
But oops! Bush stated himself that there's no evidence. He just knows he served.
Sigh. Its pointless, you don't really even care what the facts are.
What are the facts pray tell? That the only rock hard evidence is bush's pay stubs, but as we've seen, you can have pay stubs without actually being where you were supposed to be. Unless of course you think JR wasn't being truthful with his story.
I think the medical records of his time would solve this problem and put it to rest forever. Unfortunately, they don't "know" where those records are, and can't produce them.
Other than that Russ, what are the facts?
I think the medical records of his time would solve this problem and put it to rest forever. Unfortunately, they don't "know" where those records are, and can't produce them.
Other than that Russ, what are the facts?
They released a packet that included all of the records from the Vietnam era. From paystubs, to records showing when he showed up for duty for purposes of determining time served and retirement. There might even be medical records--I don't know because no news organization seems interested in actually releasing anything but their opinion.
Truthfully, its apparent that nothing will satisfy you, Natoma; you'll raise the bar everytime it's met. You're operating from a mode of "he's guilty, prove to me he's not".
Sure, its possible he didn't show up and still got paid and still got time recorded for retirement. Any proof of that? No.
Truthfully, its apparent that nothing will satisfy you, Natoma; you'll raise the bar everytime it's met. You're operating from a mode of "he's guilty, prove to me he's not".
Sure, its possible he didn't show up and still got paid and still got time recorded for retirement. Any proof of that? No.
I wish natoma would admit that this is only an issue for him and the democrats because kerry was a vietnam hero. If someone else was the candidate, then this would be a non-issue. Got the guts to admit it?
later,
epic
later,
epic
digitalwanderer
Legend
I do care about the facts Russ, that's why I want to find them out rather than just say; "Well, he showed us the paystubs so I guess that is that".RussSchultz said:
epicstruggle said:
What's there to admit epic? You must have only gotten back into this thread over the last two or three posts I suppose.
As I stated earlier,
Natoma said:
Natoma said:
Natoma said:
Natoma said:
So you and Russ just want to write me and my questions off as just "Bush Bashing" or whatever. There are legitimate questions here that need to be answered. If/When they are, this story will die. If/When they aren't, this story will still be alive.
RussSchultz said:
The only reason I did a :? when I read about the paystubs is because of what JR said regarding his time in the armed forces, and one of his suboordinates getting a pass basically. I already don't trust Bush, and yes, I do put the burden of proof on him, because as we've found in many issues to date, Bush hasn't been necessarily truthful (whether intentionally or not, so lets not get into that little ditty) with the american public.
He lost credibility big time with me in late 2002, early 2003, and even moreso in the last couple of weeks. So yea, I am putting the burden of proof on him to come up with the rock solid goods.
Here's the post where I commented on what JR wrote, earlier in this thread:
That offers credence to this particular section I bolded:
If he was really there, why is there no evidence of him being there save for the fact that he got paid? Are we really supposed to believe Bush was there, without evidence of it, simply because he said he was? Sounds like the WMD situation all over again.
John Reynolds said:
That offers credence to this particular section I bolded:
If he was really there, why is there no evidence of him being there save for the fact that he got paid? Are we really supposed to believe Bush was there, without evidence of it, simply because he said he was? Sounds like the WMD situation all over again.
jandar said:
There is a 6 month gap in the time of his service that hasn't been accounted for yet. The White House is currently trying to find evidence of him actually being there beyond paystubs. If John hadn't shared his story regarding the armed forces here, I would have accepted the paystub story as enough proof, but his story opens a whole other can of worms.
There is enough circumstantial evidence to bring up a charge. Is it enough to convict? That remains to be seen, but Bush has not been convicted yet. Merely charged.
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