Airbags in cars, who wants or needs them?

[Frank]

I work at a factory where they (among other things) test airbags for various brands (Ford, GM, Saab and Porsche to name a few), and the general consensus of the people who do and see the tests and their results is, that they rather have no airbags, unless it's a Porsche. Just wear your safety belt!

What do you think?

 

[Diplo]

You'd have to be a complete idiot not to wear a seat-belt (safety belt) regardless of what other safety features your car has.

Now, whilst there are some risks involved with air-bags (inflating when not needed being the main one) I'm pretty sure the benefits out-way the risks. Most new cars come with them and I've read about a lot more cases where people have benefited from the extra protection than where the airbag may have had a negative or contributing affect. So, generally I'm happy to have them. However, they aren't are miraculous device that gives you free reign to drive like an idiot without a seat-belt. The best safety device a car can have is a conscientious and careful driver.

 

[StefanS]

Anyone heard of this urban legend:

A millionaire likes to keep safe and he's total afraid of dying in a car crash, so he just buy himself an ejection seat and mounts it in his limousine. Unfortunately for him he has a crash below 30km/h in a tunnel.

 

[Frank]

You'd have to be a complete idiot not to wear a seat-belt (safety belt) regardless of what other safety features your car has.

Now, whilst there are some risks involved with air-bags (inflating when not needed being the main one) I'm pretty sure the benefits out-way the risks. Most new cars come with them and I've read about a lot more cases where people have benefited from the extra protection than where the airbag may have had a negative or contributing affect. So, generally I'm happy to have them. However, they aren't are miraculous device that gives you free reign to drive like an idiot without a seat-belt. The best safety device a car can have is a conscientious and careful driver.

Yes. But then again: after the introduction of new safety features like ABS or airbags, the amount of accidents increases. People feel safer, and so drive more reckless.

 

[Moloch]

I work at a factory where they (among other things) test airbags for various brands (Ford, GM, Saab and Porsche to name a few), and the general consensus of the people who do and see the tests and their results is, that they rather have no airbags, unless it's a Porsche. Just wear your safety belt!

What do you think?

I wear me seatbelt.. they save more lives.
I've never been a car wreck tho.
My two sisters have been tho, the person who was driving them to school (a friend) crashed into someone

 

[digitalwanderer]

Having had the "fun" of going thru a windshield face-first at about 50mph back in the 80s I have to admit that I like knowing there is an airbag in my vehicle.

Also I've never not worn my seatbelt since that accident, I agree that not wearing one is just stupid. (And that indeed I was stupid in not wearing one when that accident occured, could have spared me a bunch of facial reconstruction surgery)

From my research both my vehicles airbags help in accidents; a 98 Pathfinder and 04 350Z.

 

[Bouncing Zabaglione Bros.]

It's worth noting that US airbags are larger and deploy more explosively than European airbags, and IIRC have had more people hurt from them because of this.

I think airbags are generally a good idea if they stop you going through the windscreen. Windscreens today are very strong and often stressed parts of the chassis, so you are going to get very hurt going through the screen on a modern car. I think it's especially important on the passenger side where there is no wheel to hang on to (or break your nose on without an airbag).

I did however modify my driving position to put me as far away from the airbag system as possible and still drive comfortably.

 

[Frank]

I would like to add, that it's not only the airbag itself that might hurt you, but it has to create a hole in the dashboard or steering wheel while doing so. And that can create nasty fragments, travelling at high speed. Edit: or hurt your hands badly if it's some kind of door.

While that should never happen, it's pretty hard to make absolutely sure. Although the chance is small, there are too many variables. One of the worst ones is the car users putting stuff on top of them. And production of all the parts and everything around it isn't perfect.

But, of course the positive effects outweight the possible bad ones in general.

 

[Diplo]

Yes. But then again: after the introduction of new safety features like ABS or airbags, the amount of accidents increases. People feel safer, and so drive more reckless.

Is this a fact you know, or a supposition? It may well be true, but I know from my point of view that safety features haven't changed the way I drive. However, I do notice that drivers of big SUV's tend to be more reckless and arrogant drivers, probably due to the feeling of invulnerability they get from driving their gas-guzzling tanks....

 

[Frank]

Is this a fact you know, or a supposition? It may well be true, but I know from my point of view that safety features haven't changed the way I drive. However, I do notice that drivers of big SUV's tend to be more reckless and arrogant drivers, probably due to the feeling of invulnerability they get from driving their gas-guzzling tanks....

No, it's a fact. It happened with seatbelts as well, and people in SUV's feel pretty safe. They think that it will at most happen to the other. Probably just subconcious, but then again that's the reason half of them give for buying such a big and heavy car in the first place.

 

[DemoCoder]

I'm sure bad stuff can happen with airbags, just like some people are hurt and killed by seatbelts, but it is not the edge cases that matter, but the macroscopic aggregate. And in that regard, even in spite of people perhaps driving more recklessly, both seatbelts and airbags have reduced deaths in accidents.

http://www.nhtsa.gov/cars/rules/rulings/208con2e.html#sec2.4

To me, even a 5%-30% improvement is worth it. We're talking thousands of lives.

 

[ShootMyMonkey]

the general consensus of the people who do and see the tests and their results is, that they rather have no airbags, unless it's a Porsche. Just wear your safety belt!

I'm curious as to the nature of this consensus. Do they mean it in the sense that airbags don't do anything (or do more harm than good), or that by themselves, they're useless unless the car is a Porsche?

I mean, airbags are referred to as a supplemental restraint system for a reason.

It's worth noting that US airbags are larger and deploy more explosively than European airbags, and IIRC have had more people hurt from them because of this.

Yes, well, not so much among adults, but among small children where there are plenty of known cases of a passenger-side airbag deploying with enough force to decapitate children under a certain age. Which is what started the whole "smart" airbags business where the seat would have a pressure sensor to control how fast an airbag deploys (if at all). In general, though, and I agree with this, children under some age really should be belted into the rear seat.

 

[Bouncing Zabaglione Bros.]

Is this a fact you know, or a supposition? It may well be true, but I know from my point of view that safety features haven't changed the way I drive. However, I do notice that drivers of big SUV's tend to be more reckless and arrogant drivers, probably due to the feeling of invulnerability they get from driving their gas-guzzling tanks....

Yes, it's called risk assessment or something. A person subconciously accepts a certain level of risk, and if you make them feel safer, they will change their behaviour to get back to that certain risk level they will accept. It's the same reason why drivers will pull out in front of a motorbike or small car with less thought, but are more likely to hold off if there's a big truck coming down the road as that appears "more risky".

 

[KimB]

I would like to add, that it's not only the airbag itself that might hurt you, but it has to create a hole in the dashboard or steering wheel while doing so. And that can create nasty fragments, travelling at high speed. Edit: or hurt your hands badly if it's some kind of door.

You can help mitigate this a bit by properly adjusting your steering wheel (for the driver's airbag). It's best to make sure your steering wheel is pointed at your chest instead of your face. Your chest can much better withstand the pounding that comes from the explosion of the airbag.

 

[deviantchild]

I work at a factory where they (among other things) test airbags for various brands (Ford, GM, Saab and Porsche to name a few), and the general consensus of the people who do and see the tests and their results is, that they rather have no airbags, unless it's a Porsche. Just wear your safety belt!

What do you think?

I used to work in QC at a Britsh division of a US auto component company that made for Vauxhall & SAAB (GM), Rover & Land Rover (BMW), Ford & Jaguar (Ford) - when Jag got took over by Ford, the specs were more lenient than they had been used to. Needless to say, a lot of the Jag guys really weren't happy with components that passed Fords' spec and therefore were deemed fit to put into their cars.
Anyway, amongst other things we made fascias with the airbag panels being cut by lasers. Only, the fascia board material caliper was all over the place so it wasn't exactly a precision job and the stuff was all patched up with epoxy where holes had blown in some of the mouldings. These would have been parts where the airbag exit point in the fascia could've done anything in the event of discharge: exploded into fragments, not opened at all.
There wasn't a damned thing I could do about it. By the time I had results the stuff was already out the door, or 'production' would have avoided me somehow. I was only there as a legal requirement and was seen as a hinderance and the scourge of the company's general shitty work practice.
I made myself unpopular - and left.
You'll be happy to know the division is closing up shop in a couple of months. Unfortunately, the parent company continues, and it's their lead which determines the way things were done.

 

[_xxx_]

Whoever doesn't wear a seatbelt has DESERVED to have something happen to him IMHO.

As for airbags, these saved my life as I had a crash in January. Side/windowbags, i was hit from the left side. They prevented my head from crushing into the window. I found my glasses somewhere on the back seat after it was over, the explosion literally blew them away. My "opponent" was also saved by the driver's airbag, prevented his head from hitting the steering wheel.

So both airbags and seat belts are essential, I'd never, ever buy a car without airbags again. Also, never again without ESP.

 

[_xxx_]

Yes, well, not so much among adults, but among small children where there are plenty of known cases of a passenger-side airbag deploying with enough force to decapitate children under a certain age. Which is what started the whole "smart" airbags business where the seat would have a pressure sensor to control how fast an airbag deploys (if at all). In general, though, and I agree with this, children under some age really should be belted into the rear seat.

Modern cars deactivate the passenger airbag as soon as the kids' safety seat is "plugged in". You've probably seen those "Passenger airbag off" LED's in some cars.

EDIT: not through a pressure sensor, but a switch in the belt socket.

 

[rwolf]

Seat belts are a must these days. I didn't wear them at all when I was a kid.

 

[KimB]

Seat belts are a must these days. I didn't wear them at all when I was a kid.

They were just as much of a must back then. Perhaps more, because cars were much less safe.

 

[rwolf]

They were just as much of a must back then. Perhaps more, because cars were much less safe.

I think there are far more people on the road now. What always surprised me was the flimsy head rests or total lack of head rests.