3D Gaming*

[tritosine5G]

Anyway, and you guys seem to ignore DLP projectors, whereas its the most interesting (non autostereo) 3d display tech right now -once you count with hold time...! Think about it

 

[patsu]

and you guys seem to ignore DLP projectors, whereas its the most interesting (non autostereo) 3d display tech right now -once you count with hold time...! Think about it

All I really care right now is a 27 - 30" 3D display. Do they have a DLP that size ?

EDIT: What is the install base for 3D ready DLP today ?

 

[tritosine5G]

All I really care right now is a 27 - 30" 3D display. Do they have a DLP that size ?

EDIT: What is the install base for 3D ready DLP today ?

3d vision users started to migrate as far I see.
I dumped LCD after 30min.
NEC had an attempt at "DLP monitor" , looks cool , eh?
http://www.displayblog.com/2008/06/20/nec-42-curved-dlp-monitor-at-infocomm-2008/
Anyway, hold time stuff:

CRTs - hold time is governed by phosphor decay and is ~ 1.5ms
Plasmas - hold time is governed by PWM and is 4-6ms
LCDs - hold time is governed by "active matrix" and is equal to the refresh rate (8.3ms for 120Hz, 16.7ms for 60Hz)

Shutterglasses with DLP do 50/50 duty cycle, 50 transparent, 50 opaque.
LCD monitors , TV's do 25/75 in the same order. Plasma seems to be similar because of hold time. 'Again, think about it
Heres a cool explanation : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B9kHiJ2kvDQ
Hdmi 1.4 adapter is coming by optoma, http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1267544 hmm...

 

[sebbbi]

I'm still very curious about the output format of Crysis 2 over HDMI bearing in mind that it has to support 360 too which is not HDMI 1.4 compliant.

Can it really be that alternate frames are beamed to each eye? I'm not sure this has ever been supported in any 3D spec. Or maybe a side-by-side 1080p format is used?

EDIT: Reading that German piece, it seems to suggest that the HDMI 1.4 format is used for PS3, while the 360 does indeed use side-by-side or interlace. But 720p, 1080p or both, that is the question.

Single 1080p side-by-side (or top-bottom) encoding is pretty good choice for stereoscopic Xbox 360 games (if you want to have near 720p resolution both both eyes). With 1920x1080 side-by-side the resolution for each eye is 960x1080 pixels. It's slightly more resolution than 1280x720x2 would provide (the likely choice of most PS3 stereoscopic games). Naturally you can use side-by-side 720p (640x720) and feed it to the Xbox hardware upscaler if you want the best performance (the image quality isn't that bad really).

Scanline interlaced stereo encoding from Xbox 360 works also, assuming most of your customers have TV sets / monitors / projectors that are native 720p or 1080p. The bad thing is that the game has to render using the TV native resolution for the interlaced mode to work properly. Many (non technology interested) players don't know how to setup their Xbox to output at their TVs native resolution. And the game obviously cannot use the scaler hardware, as it would mess up the scanlines...

 

[patsu]

IFA started. Quite a few 3D product announcements so far:

Avatar 3D the home movie (and Alice 3D) on Dec 1: http://hollywoodinhidef.com/2010/09/shhh-avatar-3d-blu-ray-dec-1-alice-too/

Toshiba's first 3D Blu-ray player: http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=5076

LG: http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=5072

Sony: http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=5078

Panasonic: http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=5074

Epson says 3D Projection is not ready: http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=5073


EDIT:
Samsung: http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=5082

 

[patsu]

Looks like 3DS is ramping up. Slightly more news on the upcoming platform. May be getting ready for TGS ?

http://www.siliconera.com/2010/09/0...fantasy-dragon-quest-metal-gear-solid-on-3ds/

Gaming website 4gamer conducted a massive survey and received 21,810 responses. One of the questions is which Nintendo 3DS titles they are looking forward to.

Even though they weren’t shown at E3, Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest topped the list. The order is a little unexpected since Final Fantasy beat out Dragon Quest. The first Nintendo title is The Legend of Zelda: The Ocarina of Time, which is the fourth title just underneath the Metal Gear Solid: Snake Eater 3D tech demo.

 

[makattack]

Lately, there have been some news releases about the latest no-glasses 3D TV's.

Mostly lenticular designs:

http://www.ubergizmo.com/15/archive...co_3d_tv_to_usher_in_glasses-free_future.html
http://www.csmonitor.com/Innovation...oshiba-3D-TV-line-packs-a-surprise-No-glasses

Of course, the main competitor to Toshiba and Philips say this technology isn't ready:
http://www.pcworld.com/article/204584/samsung_glassesfree_3d_tv_not_ready_yet.html

Definitely not basing my LCD screen purchase decision on 3D

Incidentally, my local rag has an article on 3D films:
http://www.boston.com/ae/movies/art..._and_tv_can_be_sore_sight_for_eyes/?page=full

 

[MfA]

Dimenco isn't Philips, it's basically some engineers from Philips's old lenticular project which ventured out on their own.

 

[patsu]

Have you tried it ? MfA

 

[MfA]

No, never seen it ... AFAICS they are simply going ahead with the old methods though (ie. highly reduced horizontal resolution and sweetspots).

 

[patsu]

http://www.andriasang.com/e/blog/2010/09/10/am_show_3d/

3D is the buzzword in the living room right now. The same seems to hold true for arcades well.

At JAMMA's Amusement Machine Show in Chiba today, Namco Bandai and SI Electronics both had 3D gaming product on display.

Namco Bandai had two 3D games on display, both requiring special 3D goggles.

...

Separately, SI Electronics was showing its new System Board Y3 board in the Kaga Amusement booth. This board can deliver 3D visuals to general goggle-free 3D displays, and can also be made to toggle the 3D effect on and off.

...

 

[patsu]

Toshiba's glasses-free 3D touch screen tech:
http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/s..._off_Glasses-Free_3D_Touchscreen_Display/5398

2010 is shaping up to be a big year for 3D, but 2011 looks to be the year of the glasses-free 3D display. Everyone seems to be working on the new tech, and there's a lot of pressure for it to perform just right. That's the reason you won't be seeing Toshiba's entry to the glasses-free space any time soon.

"One problem is that it's necessary to create content, such as images taken from nine directions," explains a representative from Toshiba. "The question is how to minimize the burden of creating that content."

...

You can see the video on:
http://www.diginfo.tv/2010/09/09/10-0155-r-en.php

 

[patsu]

Nielson survey:
http://www.joystiq.com/2010/09/09/nielsen-study-people-dont-like-3d-glasses/

A study by the Nielsen Company found that the glasses required for the 3D television experience -- which includes 3D gaming -- appear to be the tech's greatest hurdle. About half of those surveyed said the glasses were uncomfortable or a hassle, while 89 percent said the specs made it harder to do other things while watching TV

The study noted that "active TV shoppers" who were considering a 3D TV purchase dropped from 25 percent to 12 percent after trying out the tech and considering the higher cost and limited available content. Still, half of the respondents were impressed by the 3D picture quality.

EDIT: In my experience, the showroom setup is very important. e.g., The SonyStyle store in Stanford Mall is getting too crowded with products. They brought out the 3DTV to the main showroom, facing a very strong light source. When I looked into the TV with and without glasses, there's this white glow on the screen washing out the picture. How does one evaluate the TV in this lighting condition ?

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Toshiba's glasses-free 3D touch screen tech:

Imagery from 9 directions?! That's not going to get very far! Also this sounds more like a 3D reconstruction, which has it's own issues. Scenes are shot meticulously according to the photographer's vision. Viewing the shot from somewhere else screws that up, and conceptually you could have scenes where someone viewing from the right or left gets a bit of scenery in the way. So now your photographer has to think about 9 views. Sterescopic is very straightforward, but getting independent stereoscopic viewing with glasses is clearly a technical nightmare.

 

[Arwin]

I'm not even going to bother to comment now. I'll just wait for your edit ...

 

[patsu]

「MT FRAMEWORK」DirectX 11 compatibility and Nintendo 3DS compatibility:

Stolen from GAF:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=407060

Original Source:
http://game.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/series/3dcg/20100913_393420.html

 

[Sigfried1977]

Holy shit. I don't care how much this will cost. I'm buying. Day 1.
As for the exclusivity regarding specific movies. Are they trying to kill the format before it actually takes off or what?

 

[patsu]

You mean the TV vendor exclusive 3D Blu-ray movies ? If so, I agree it's a strange idea.

I don't think they affect 3DS movies, so Nintendo should have a free run.

EDIT:
http://www.screendigest.com/reports...ie_3d_blu-rays_potential_killer_app/view.html

Screen Digest research shows that while some studios are fully behind 3D, others are holding back their 'crown jewels' until the installed base of 3D hardware expands. There are real concerns that this strategic approach could cause the home entertainment sector to miss the window of opportunity that currently exists to simultaneously position packaged media at the cutting edge of new technology and to make 3D the 'killer app' that could boost BD's hitherto sluggish sales.

http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=5130

In a recent study, consultancy firm Screen Digest estimates that the widespread exclusive bundling of 3D Blu-ray titles with 3D gear from select consumer electronics brands risks choking off demand.

...

As reported today by Deadline Hollywood, twenty-five 3D BDs will come out before Christmas, but only six of these will not be bundled along with 3D hardware.

...

[More opinions from industry follows]

 

[_phil_]

Exclusive bundles are really a stupid move.Way to go to kill the market before it even exists.

 

[Arwin]

Yes, bundle, fine but they shouldn't have made them exclusive. On the other hand, do we know how many of these 3D movies would have been on the market if not for these exclusive bundles in the first place? They might have otherwise held back like the others. So if they're wise, they just don't make the exclusivity last too long ... Still, the content is definitely holding back the format right now.