Formula 1 - The Eco Friendly Motorsport!

[Bouncing Zabaglione Bros.]

Yeah, it's hilarious. It's a pity Maclaren screwed Lewis's race, first by not putting his wheels on properly for practice, and then going to dry tyres about five laps too early.

That rain storm half way through the first lap was awesome though, including Raikonnen diving for the pit lane, sliding out the other side and having to do another wet lap on dry tyres (his car has just conked out).

Amazing that these guys are supposed to be some of the best drivers in the world, and still half of them couldn't tiptoe around one lap in the rain before changing to wets. Still I'm sure all those guys in the team who are supposed to predict the weather and let their guys start on dry tyres have red faces.

 

[Bludd]

Remember, those dry-weather tyres on a wet surface is akin to driving on ice.

Add that to the fact that the F1 cars aren't the easiest to drive, and you got a recipe for awesome.

Also, I think Lewis himself gambled on changing to dry-weather tyres.

 

[Bludd]

Awesome, Alonso obliterated Massa in the wet at the end of the race. Well done, Alonso!

Too bad for Lewis Hamilton, this race marks the end of his unprecedented debut season in F1; 9 consecutive races on the podium.

 

[Bouncing Zabaglione Bros.]

Yeah, that rain totally screwed the pooch for Massa. I like the way that Massa tried to bully Alonso off the road, and Alonso just bumped wheels and overtook him. Apparently the only person not protesting at that move on the Ferrari pit was Michael Schumacher - who took his headphones off and left the pit after Massa got passed.

If Hamilton called for dry tyres too early due to inexperience, then Maclaren should have overruled him. Although Lewis was trying to recover from the qualifying screw-up, that one wrong choice moved him from salvaging a good result from a bad starting point to nothing at all for the whole weekend.

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

Why did that alonso punk had to win... Also, what happend to kimi? Looked like a fuel problem. For the WC its a good thing Hamilton didnt score any point, its unfortunatly that kimi didnt finish otherwise we would have had 4 drivers still capable of winning the WC. Well, its still possible for kimi but the gap is pretty big and it doesnt seem there will be mclarens missing points because of reliability.

 

[Bludd]

I started rooting for Alonso during the 2004 season where he impressed me greatly and I have been rooting for him ever since, it was beautiful and awesome when he beat Schumi in 2005, ending Ferrari's long dominance. I'm also a Takuma Sato-fan, I like his irreverent driving style and that he takes chances.

Too bad for Kimi. If he ran out of fuel, then the Ferrari team made a HUGE mistake. I doubt they would acknowledge something that embarrassing though.

 

[Dave Baumann]

I think putting Hamilton on the slicks early was really a recognition of a "do or die" situation anyway - there wasn't that much that he could do at that point. I think rules screwed him more.

Had there been clarification that Hamilton could unlap himself from the pace car earlier on (they had done a lap or two before he started to unlap himself) then he could have been much closer to the tial of the field after making his stop; as it stood he came out 60 second down the road already. Also, they had blue flagged him twice while Massa was 3 seconds down the road (and at that point they were still trading fastest laps) and the time he lost stopping to let Massa and Alonos past was more than the time that finished behind Kovalainen.

Still, it was an interesting one to watch throughout.

 

[Bludd]

This defeat will force Hamilton to show his true colours. I wholeheartedly believe that he will step up to the plate and get right back on the podium next race.

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

I started rooting for Alonso during the 2004 season where he impressed me greatly and I have been rooting for him ever since, it was beautiful and awesome when he beat Schumi in 2005, ending Ferrari's long dominance. I'm also a Takuma Sato-fan, I like his irreverent driving style and that he takes chances.

Too bad for Kimi. If he ran out of fuel, then the Ferrari team made a HUGE mistake. I doubt they would acknowledge something that embarrassing though.

I dont like alonso. He's fast, without a doubt, be he's such a cry baby. Remeber the end of last year? complaining all the time how the team didnt help him to become WC, or the constantly waving his hand to other drivers and not to long ago complaining about how Mclaren didnt treated him the same as hamilton. That kind of behavior is just pathetic for a WC, he always points his finger at others. People might not like how schumacher won sometimes or what he did, but he sure as hell was a true WC as he never blamed others if he failed.

I like taku though, the guy always seems to run around with a big smile on his face (or maybe thats just because he's Japanese) and seems really energetic. Dont like his driving though. To much kamikaze actions while trying to do the impossible. Though he didnt do that for some time now.

I think putting Hamilton on the slicks early was really a recognition of a "do or die" situation anyway - there wasn't that much that he could do at that point. I think rules screwed him more.

Cmon, the rules screwed him? didnt you see the truck putting him back on the track after he spinned? Nobody even complained about that! though that probably also is because he didnt get any points because lets be honest, in all reality Hamilton shouldnt have finished. What suprises me is that the FIA didnt say anything about it while they came running out of the tower when Kimi asked the stewards to push him into the pitlane. Apparently its oke to have yourself lifted out of the gravel but having yourself pushed a few meters is not allowed...

Ow and dont forget that mclaren only is so fast because they got a 780page book on the 2007 Ferrari car full of technicall details[/conspiracy]

 

[Davros]

People might not like how schumacher won sometimes or what he did, but he sure as hell was a true WC as he never blamed others if he failed.

So its better to cheat than to complain ?

Apparently its oke to have yourself lifted out of the gravel but having yourself pushed a few meters is not allowed...

they could of moved kimi back onto the driving line, but that would of left him more than 20 meters from his garage with no fuel so what would be the point ?

 

[Dave Baumann]

Cmon, the rules screwed him? didnt you see the truck putting him back on the track after he spinned? Nobody even complained about that! though that probably also is because he didnt get any points because lets be honest, in all reality Hamilton shouldnt have finished. What suprises me is that the FIA didnt say anything about it while they came running out of the tower when Kimi asked the stewards to push him into the pitlane. Apparently its oke to have yourself lifted out of the gravel but having yourself pushed a few meters is not allowed...

Thats perfectly within the rules - they were changed a number of years ago to state that if the engine is still running then they are allowed to be assisted back on to the track (this is a safety issue as it can be quicker just to move the car to an area where it can get traction that it is to stop a perfectly workable car at the side of the track and then have to push / tow it away). If your engine stalls then you are out of the race - this is how Kimi fell foul as his engine had stopped.

 

[Bludd]

Schumi was also helped back on the track without penalty some years ago.

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

So its better to cheat than to complain ?

Well unless the FIA says its cheating its not cheating. And yes i'd rather have some of schu's not so fair actions than some cry baby complaining.

they could of moved kimi back onto the driving line, but that would of left him more than 20 meters from his garage with no fuel so what would be the point ?

Push it into the pits and fuel it up and have him continue the race and maybe score some points? if he really was out of fuel that is.

Thats perfectly within the rules - they were changed a number of years ago to state that if the engine is still running then they are allowed to be assisted back on to the track (this is a safety issue as it can be quicker just to move the car to an area where it can get traction that it is to stop a perfectly workable car at the side of the track and then have to push / tow it away). If your engine stalls then you are out of the race - this is how Kimi fell foul as his engine had stopped.

Well however you look at it moving the car back on the track was neither faster or safer than moving it over the wall he parked his car into. There were a fair few of other drivers who also got stuck in the gravel with running engines that could have been easily pushed back (not even need for a whole freaking tracktor!) but they didnt got back on the track.

Schumi was also helped back on the track without penalty some years ago.

True. He wasnt stuck 10+ meters in the gravel and didnt need a tracktor to lift him back on the track though.

Not that I want to complain that lewis got back on the track but it certainly wernt the rules that cost him the race.

 

[Dave Baumann]

Well however you look at it moving the car back on the track was neither faster or safer than moving it over the wall he parked his car into.

The walls are usually a tire barrier then a debris fence, you normally have to drive to an open section in the wall (where the tractor came from) to remove the car safely; most of the time getting a drivable car back on to the track is the quickest option.

There were a fair few of other drivers who also got stuck in the gravel with running engines that could have been easily pushed back (not even need for a whole freaking tracktor!) but they didnt got back on the track.

In that case it would be clear that the car was either not running or were not in a safely driveable condition.

Not that I want to complain that lewis got back on the track but it certainly wernt the rules that cost him the race.

The point I'm making is that the rule concerning unlapping yourself under safety car conditions is new this year. It was designed to get the field in the right order so car aren't starting out of order when the safety car gone in. Technically, although Hamilton was a lap down, they were in the right order, and its clear that this particular predicent hadn't been set under these rules.

Had it been normal (and he was out of position) then when the safety had collected everyone he would have been able to pass and unlap himself straight away, yet in this instance the stewards hadn't allowed that to happen until the lap before the safety car had gone in, meaning that he wasn't able to get enough time to unlap himself and get back to tail of the field. Had they made that call earlier he could have had his pitstop and had enough time to get to the back of the field, this minimising the disadvantage significantly.

Also, its clear that blue flagging him twice when Massa was still 3 seconds away, at a period when they were both trading lap fastest laps, cost him significant time that could have been used to be passing the Renaults.

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

The walls are usually a tire barrier then a debris fence, you normally have to drive to an open section in the wall (where the tractor came from) to remove the car safely; most of the time getting a drivable car back on to the track is the quickest option.

No its not.

In that case it would be clear that the car was either not running or were not in a safely driveable condition.

No. RF's car was still running, he wasnt very far into the gravel but he didnt get pushed back just as alot of other drivers you see ending up in the dirt every race when they dig themselves in but the car is still in driving order.

Had it been normal (and he was out of position) then when the safety had collected everyone he would have been able to pass and unlap himself straight away, yet in this instance the stewards hadn't allowed that to happen until the lap before the safety car had gone in, meaning that he wasn't able to get enough time to unlap himself and get back to tail of the field. Had they made that call earlier he could have had his pitstop and had enough time to get to the back of the field, this minimising the disadvantage significantly.

Thats bollocks. He was a lap down before the safety car came onto the track, why should he be allowed to get that lap back under safety car? the cars should be in the right order, not in the same lap. It would be unfair to unlap yourself that way.

Also, its clear that blue flagging him twice when Massa was still 3 seconds away, at a period when they were both trading lap fastest laps, cost him significant time that could have been used to be passing the Renaults.

That would only get him 1 point still, so not a big deal especially if you keep in mind that it would have been very easy for hamilton to slow down massa 2 or 3 seconds to let alonso catch up. They flagged him to make sure he wouldnt interfere which at the time wasnt a bad call as hamilton was way behind the others.

In the end the rules at best costed him 1 point but he lost the race on saterday quali, not because of the rules.

 

[Bouncing Zabaglione Bros.]

Thats bollocks. He was a lap down before the safety car came onto the track, why should he be allowed to get that lap back under safety car? the cars should be in the right order, not in the same lap. It would be unfair to unlap yourself that way.

It's a rule that's agreed by the team principles before the race weekend. This weekend, it was a rule that if the safety car was out for (IIRC) 90 seconds, then lapped cars could unlap themselves. It's a way to make sure that lapped backmarkers are at the back of the rolling start, rather than getting in the way of the front runners as they sprint off when the safety car disappears. It's safer, and better for racing. It wouldn't be fair to further penalise those cars in the pack that would have to pass a lapped car, and it's no worse than the fact that a driver 60 seconds in the lead has all that taken away as soon as the safety car comes out and backs the pack up together again.

Whether it's fair or not, it's the rules they are racing under this year, and everyone will get that benefit if they end up in the same position as Hamilton (not that it helped him in the end).

 

[Dave Baumann]

No its not.

Based on?

RF's car was still running

RF?

Thats bollocks. He was a lap down before the safety car came onto the track, why should he be allowed to get that lap back under safety car?

They were the new rules that were instigated this year for safety car periods (along with the closure of the pitlane under SC period).

 

[Davros]

Well unless the FIA says its cheating its not cheating.

well they did say it was cheating

 

[MuFu]

Good race. I love damp.

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

Based on?

Based on the car being next to the tire wall which mean you only have to lift it like 3 meters at best and not carry it around the whole gravel while there was still a change of cars spinning out of that same corner (liuzzi).

RF?

I ment RS (raf schumacher).

They were the new rules that were instigated this year for safety car periods (along with the closure of the pitlane under SC period).

Maybe I didnt understand the rule but wasnt it supposed to be so that all cars got in the right order but not necesserely in the same lap or in one big line? So hamilton passes the safetycar so he's not in the way of other drivers but they dont wait untill he completely catched up.