Windows 8 Dev build

[Grall]

I've never actually used a windows mobile device, but from what I've read about the live tile UI it sounds very good on paper, and something I'd really wish apple had implemented in iOS. Now it's kinda late in the game and prestige will make apple hold on to its meh-ish basic icon grid even though there's better UIs to be had.

It''s being forced to use metro on my PC which I object to. That, and MS's clumsy, hamfisted separation of metro apps and standard windows desktop programs.

 

[Bouncing Zabaglione Bros.]

I've never actually used a windows mobile device, but from what I've read about the live tile UI it sounds very good on paper, and something I'd really wish apple had implemented in iOS. Now it's kinda late in the game and prestige will make apple hold on to its meh-ish basic icon grid even though there's better UIs to be had.

My wife has a low end Nokia Lumia that I'm basing my WP8 enthusiasm on. It's really good, especially on a low end phone that Android would choke on.

It''s being forced to use metro on my PC which I object to. That, and MS's clumsy, hamfisted separation of metro apps and standard windows desktop programs.

Me too. It's the wrong tool for the job, and they should at least allow users to turn it off completely, and give us back some kind of structured start menu.

 

[zed]

then it becomes annoying in Chrome if you want to drag the entire window

when a window is maximized the user typically does not want to move it around!
OK but say you do, click on the icon next to the closewindow icon, then you can move the window around and resize it (this has been in windows since 95 perhaps even before btw)
eg here Ive made it nearly with the bar there, but it suffers the same 90% wasted space at the top

heres my start screen, note apart from the chrome and the firefox icon, none of the tiles jump out at you, OK this is partly due to the icon makers but also due to the icons
A/ being too small inside the tiles
B/ the background color is often similar to whats a common color in the icon

 

[Davros]

my god thats an awful background colour

 

[CouldntResist]

my god thats an awful background colour

Then it's a match for the awful foreground colors

Seriously, Metro tile color selection reminds me tasteless stained glass in my church (childhood memories)

 

[zed]

you can change the background image, though it looks like you can only choose from one of 20 different MS approved images.
i.e. you cant do in windows what you could ~20 years ago
well thats progress

 

[-tkf-]

I am not sure whether it works well, it just works to some extent.

This certainly has an aim and they, at least, tried to achieve it. But unfortunately (for them) didn't predict the concequencies and people's reactions...

They should have forced the normal desktop UI on mobile devices, not the other way round entering unknown adventures which will end in a bad and painful way

'Misunderstood'... well, possibly, but in no way it is customers' fault. It was both Microsoft's and hardware suppliers' faults because they didn't build an environment where Vista would be accepted better.
For Windows 8 it is not misunderstanding but rather the simple, minimalistic look which obviously can not be called 'modern' in 2013

They should just have let the metro apps run in metro mode on the desktop in resizeable metro Windows. And then only enabled the rest of metro if there was a touch screen present and if the user wanted it. I like the metro picture viewer, it's fast, defaults to full-screen but in classic 8.1 fashion, pressing escape doesn't bring you back to where you clicked the file but instead back to the clumsy metro interface..

 

[Grall]

you can change the background image, though it looks like you can only choose from one of 20 different MS approved images.

In 8.1 you can configure the start screen to use the same background as your desktop. Although it's really really weird you have to choose one of MS's default images and nothing else if you don't enable this option...

One of my big pet peeves I have with win8 is that you now have two separate control panels/settings screens. One for desktop interface and one for metro, but the metro settings can obviously affect your desktop experience, so why are they separate? There should be a metro settings applet in the regular control panel! Yet another MS fuckup by keeping the two interfaces artificially separate even though they both exist on the same computer at the same time.

What a load of bollocks!

 

[liolio]

I'm really pissed off at MSFT right now, I bought my HP pavilion with Windows 7. I asked for windows 8 as a present last year as I was willing to try.
Now my HDD died, I've just reinstalled Windows 8 to discover that the copy that was offered to me only works as an upgrade... What a fucking scam!

What is the point, my parents in law paid 80$ so I've a copy of windows (it happens to be windows 8) in case things get wrong... and they did.

What is the fucking point in selling copy if you can install the copy... it is not even a license issue it the fucking same computer, they could check the MAC or whatever part of the laptop. It is the same computer, even if the license were binded to a computer >> that is the same one.

Fuck you Microsoft you won't ever a see a dime from me again, that some really scammy business practices...

Any advice on a Linux distro? I used Ubuntu on my failing HDD for a while> It looks ok, are there better distro wrt to hardware support? (and Wine...)
To make things worse my laptop used a funky AMD switchable graphics solution (llano+redwood) and I've an odd feeling about the support of such a conf in the Linux realm

I'm pissed... I may have to search for a new job soon, I've games on steam and so on... I was a legit costumer, I have not pirated anything in years. Anger...

EDIT
Does Steam OS come with Wine installed?

 

[Babel-17]

IIRC there are workarounds.

http://www.eightforums.com/tutorials/13375-clean-install-windows-8-upgrade.html

 

[Grall]

I assume you can't download a win8 ISO and use your key with it...?

You can't just install win7 first and then "upgrade" (*ahem!* ) immediately to win8, or have you lost your win7 key?

Yeah, even if you can go through this procedure it sucks. It's totally bizarre MS has upgrade-only keys. In fact it's bullshit, but what can you do eh?

It's like win8 OEM is locked to whatever language you've bought it in. There's no legit reason it should be that way, they just do it to try and inconvenience people into paying more for a more expensive version with multi-language support. Scumbags!

 

[liolio]

IIRC there are workarounds.

http://www.eightforums.com/tutorials/13375-clean-install-windows-8-upgrade.html

Wow thanks, I removed it for now and reinstalled Ubuntu out of anger. I wondered about trying SteamOS but I don't have a 4GB USB key at hand.
I might give it a try one of those day.

I assume you can't download a win8 ISO and use your key with it...?

I assume you can't, it is not a valid key for clean instal.

You can't just install win7 first and then "upgrade" (*ahem!* ) immediately to win8, or have you lost your win7 key?

I don't have a windows 7 dvd, and as I did not suspect that behaviour from that Windows copy when the HDD failed badly I erased everything and installed Ubuntu. I may have been able to burn recovery dvd... (Actually I might have stuck to Windows7, truth be told the UI I prefer is Ubuntu's one but Linux still comes with some headaches wrt to drivers supports).

Yeah, even if you can go through this procedure it sucks. It's totally bizarre MS has upgrade-only keys. In fact it's bullshit, but what can you do eh?

I might the trick in Babel's link (latter I'm done for a while too many instals in one day...).
But it is indeed weird and it is not obvious looking at the casing or DVD.
There are some words about upgrading from previous windows to Windows 8 but nothing about the DVD only allowing upgrade, may it was on the wrapping, still it is misleading to say the least.

It's like win8 OEM is locked to whatever language you've bought it in. There's no legit reason it should be that way, they just do it to try and inconvenience people into paying more for a more expensive version with multi-language support. Scumbags!

Greed...I think MSFT is doing good job at giving people intensive to let them behind. I asked Windows8 as a present when Windows7 was already fitting the bill perfectly for me, I lost (unexpectedly) office starter edition in the process which lead me to use libre office.
May be in a couple of month I will settle for SteamOS, I've few games on steam, I may sell or give my account. I'm more console guys than a PC and actually my 360 still fills my gaming craving unexpectedly well.

 

[Blazkowicz]

eg here Ive made it nearly with the bar there, but it suffers the same 90% wasted space at the top

This is an annoying thing with Windows 8 (maybe 7 sometimes, I don't remember). That big flat space is not only wasted : you lose the window's title, which is very invaluable to me i.e. in a web browser, I can read the web page's title in its entirety.

The other day I was in Internet Explorer with about 10 to 15 tabs, they share the display width with the URL bar so even though I was running it on a wide monitor I could only read like three letters for each tab's title, Google Chrome does not behave so well with lots of tabs either. So to find a tab back I may have to cycle them till I find what I wanted, and maybe check the URL or go back to the top of the page if it isn't obvious what the page is about.

I prefer the old way of 1000+ pixels width that displays a full title, e.g. "AMD Mantle API [updating] - Page 51 - Beyond3D Forum - Mozilla Firefox" ; if I'm using Chrome/Chromium on my computer I enable the title bar back, too (in linux at least this gives you back the full decoration drawn by the window manager, and the title is displayed)

 

[Blazkowicz]

I assume you can't, it is not a valid key for clean instal.

Apparently, the warez versions of Windows 7 are recognized as fully valid licenses, just like XP Pro Corporate was. So you could maybe install warez Windows 7 and then use your upgrade license on that.

If your PC is an OEM (Acer, Dell, whatever) you can probably ask for "recovery discs" to be mailed to you, at cost.

 

[liolio]

Thanks a lot Babel actually the trick described in the link worked as a charm

 

[Blazkowicz]

I think with Windows 95 Upgrade or such you had to create a C:\WINDOWS directory with a WIN.COM file in it, and then the check for an existing installation was satisfied .

 

[Babel-17]

Thanks a lot Babel actually the trick described in the link worked as a charm

Great! Thanks for letting us know. Which method did you use?

Activate by Refreshing the Windows 8 Upgrade

or

Activate Windows 8 Upgrade using a BAT File Download

 

[liolio]

Actually I went for the lazy version aka refreshing the install, though I guess the other version is faster.
I was angry at MSFT for a lame practice, I'm equally surprised by them let such a huge loop hole opened. Though I would expect some costumers to fall for it.
Actually I was to fall for it I did not want to have an illegal version of Windows, especially as I paid for it. Turns out the work around is "legal" in some way, so I'm fine with it.

 

[Babel-17]

Yeah, even Paul Thurrott posted a guide for doing a clean install with Windows 7, and now Windows 8, upgrade media. So I guess Microsoft is cool with it.

http://winsupersite.com/article/windows8/clean-install-windows-8-upgrade-media-144648

Paul Brian Thurrott (born October 29, 1966)[1] is a technology blogger, published author, podcaster, and news editor for Paul Thurrott's SuperSite for Windows and Windows IT Pro magazine. He regularly writes news, previews, and reviews for beta and completed Microsoft products, such as Windows, Microsoft Surface, Windows 8, Windows Phone, Microsoft Office, and other products.

 

[Blazkowicz]

Microsoft always aimed to stop Joe and Grandma from installing Windows without paying for it, but otherwise didn't make it too difficult to install and use Windows. Just like Adobe, Autodesk and such.

With 98SE you simply needed to learn the key (VGF6G-7JJVD-...) to be able to make unlimited installations. There was no need to burn a disk, even : format a hard drive, put bare DOS on it ("format d: /s" does it), copy the \WIN98 or such folder.. then put the hard drive in the other computer, boot, change directory, run the setup. To make it faster, do the same but have your DOS use SMARTDRV.EXE.
So, the installation is reasonably fast, you paid nothing/didn't deal with licenses, and you have the Windows CD-ROM's content handy when the system prompts for it (adding/removing components, drivers etc.)

With Windows 8.0/8.1, as far as I know for using a computer with no legit license, Windows nags you about every 24 hours by displaying a fullscreen Metro-esque screen. Says something about activation or license. You wait five seconds for a link to appear, you click on it. Then you escape the thing the same way you try to escape Metro, by mashing Alt-tab/Windows key/Win+D until you're back to your application.

Microsoft by the way had a program to "redeem" warez Windows on old PC by paying a fee I think, and has another one that gives away legit Windows to non-profits (evil plan so they don't install linux instead, but if we give them the benefit of the doubt it's a commendable thing.)