Wii U hardware discussion and investigation *rename

Discussion in 'Console Technology' started by AlBran, Jul 29, 2011.

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  1. liolio

    liolio Aquoiboniste
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    I missed something? The CPU is a power7?
    I would be surprised.
    Based means a bit nothing.
    Power7 are design to work with their 256kb of super low latency L2 (8 cycles I believe) and their share of L3.
    Breaking the L2, the L3 the 4 way multi-threading, how wide the CPU is, etc. it's no longer a power7 at all.

    My believe is that a weak CPU is worse than a weak GPU, you can afford to not keep up with the graphics but with things even more relevant to the gameplay :???:

    Honestly I don't know what they have if they were constrained in power and silicon budget, & years into the ps3 life cycle, they should have gone with a rebalanced Cell (better CPU less SPuS).
     
  2. Ika

    Ika
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    You did not miss anything, but speculations on the web (and in some other threads here) are suggesting that the processor might share some characteristics with power7 I should have put it more clearly that it's just a guess, my bad, sorry.

    I agree that "you can afford to not keep up with the graphics", but I do not agree that a weaker CPU could stop somebody in 2012 to code any gamelpay related code. These modern CPUs are very powerful, one just needs to stop throwing shitty code into them =]
    As I said it might slow down development , which - indeed - could drive studios away from the hardware, but looking closely at the game industry since the ZX80, I can tell you that one might code anything to any hardware if he really wants to.

    I'm more concerned about that the RAM (or the cache) will be very slow like with the N64, or that it's not really a 3 core CPU and it will turn out that the other two cores are seriously handicapped, and only there for the tablet and stuffz, because one full core just won't cut it, not today.

    You are absolutely right, but I'm afraid Nintendo will go after the cheapest solution and not for the most efficient one.
     
  3. pc999

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    Every rumor and/or interpretation of info point to it. The core parts are also relatively small a it does not use much power too, seems like good fit.

    That is why I think it would be very interesting to compare both, according to wikipedia at 3 Ghz each core would be able to get ~25 Gflops, if tricore would put it around Xenon (77 Gflops IIRC).
     
  4. wsippel

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    Well, to quote Audiokinetic:

    And from the changelog:

    So Wwise seems to do on the CPU what should be done on the DSP for the sake of portability, with the 120MHz audio DSP seemingly relegated to being little more than a rather fancy volume controller. Assassin's Creed 3, Darksiders 2 and Arkham City are all ports - and they all use Wwise (which also performed like ass on Wii U until March 2012).
     
  5. pc999

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    Still if CPUs are more or less the same it should be easy to port, giving a advantage to exclusive games? Although izotope products (audio fx) are as good sounding as CPU intensive.

    Any info on the DSP that you can share (or any other part), I personally found the audio on 3DS quite impressive for what it is, specially the stereo fx.




    Anyway that wouldnt give them much time with good dev tools.
     
  6. wsippel

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    Yes. Audiokinetic stated that they reached roughly 360 levels of performance in March (in some cases better), and they were not done optimizing back then. That's for the software pipeline, of course.

    Nope, sorry. I don't even know who provides the DSP. Probably Ceva or Tensilica, maybe Macronix/ Modiotek.
     
  7. pc999

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    That is good to know.


    You probably know more than me about audio DSPs, is there any "off the shelf" dsp that they could use and incorporate useful features for gaming audio (eg, virtual 5.1 on headphones/2.1, (convolution) reverbs (!) noise cancellation for audio input...), so they could really offload the CPU and get a very nice sound?
     
  8. wsippel

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    There are quite a few options. On the high end, Analog Devices TigerSharc or Blackfin DSPs come to mind. Too expensive, though. Something along the lines of the Creative DA255 seems more likely. In fact, the DA255 even kinda matches the leaks, running at a rather low clock speed (compared to current Ceva or Tensilica designs).
     
  9. liolio

    liolio Aquoiboniste
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    You don't get it "based" means nothing.
    As I said a power7 without its fast l@, L3 4 way SMT, etc is not a power7.
    "Based" does not offer any insight on what the CPU actually is and how it performs.
     
  10. COPS N RAPPERS

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    hmmm, yeah .

    well, on the other side note, I had heard ubisoft saying that the wii-u has much more memory to work with than cpu/gpu power. so it maybe only 720p for gaming but the plus side is the solid performance. which sounds about right for nintendo, getting their mario, star fox, zelda, metroid, and supersmash bro games running solid might be more important for them.
     
  11. bgassassin

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    Getting extra details been very tough. Most likely due to Nintendo keeping stuff like that close to their chests. But the basic info on the GPU is that it's supposed to have three cores w/ two threads per core.

    Also to put things into context, all of this took place in the 4th dev kit. While the 5th (final) kits came out in January, Nintendo put that kit through a rather extended tweaking phase. Mostly to get the hardware and some 3rd party middleware to run efficiently. Though it also saw a small (emphasis on small) bump in power. It seems that Nintendo is really just now getting final kits out to most companies hands. So maybe we'll begin to learn more soon.
     
  12. ninzel

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  13. Squilliam

    Squilliam Beyond3d isn't defined yet
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    Maybe the reason why there was some porting problems is that the DSP isn't being used at this early stage and perhaps the design of the console anticipates that much of the vector processing be done on the GPU instead? It seems to make sense that if you've got a modern GPU then it can handle much more itself rather than relying so much on the CPU as in Xbox 360 games?
     
  14. SedentaryJourney

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    The Wii U Batman shots are horribly compressed and the quality of the AC3 shots is a joke. Just seems like bait to draw traffic. If the Wii U specs are accurate I can't see it not matching PS360 quite easily if not having a clear advantage. It just doesn't jive.
     
  15. wsippel

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    Judging by the toolchain Nintendo uses, I think we can rule out anything based on Cell or Power7 (or any PowerX based design, really). Because GHS doesn't support any of those. They seem to focus on embedded 32bit PowerPC cores like the IBM 4xx and Freescale e500 line. I consider something 470S based more and more likely at this point. As the Wii U CPU is supposedly dual threaded, it might be a CMT design instead of SMT or something.
     
  16. babybumb

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    Specs dont reveal much. I think the CPU is clocked much lower than 3.2Ghz. GPU grunt is anyones guess but..

    And then there was the story in develop.net not delivering on target specs it gave out last year. I do wonder if this has anything to do with total absense of EA Sports even though Peter Moore visited Japan last year to discuss the machine
     
  17. AlBran

    AlBran Ferro-Fibrous
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  18. Xenus

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    Not only that but the same as PS360 and 1.5x PS360 is a joke. The CPU's in the machines aren't very comparable let alone being called equal while the GPU's are vastly different as well.
     
  19. stiftl

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    This. Doesn't look like the PS3 version at all to me. Digital Foundry article also says that WiiU version looks better.

    http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-vs-wiiu-e3-2012

    Also most interesting sentence IMO:
     
  20. Xenus

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    Except in this case those reports make no sense. Apart form the pad itself anything else should be easily surpassed by a dev kit if they so wanted.
     
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