Wii U hardware discussion and investigation *rename

Discussion in 'Console Technology' started by AlNets, Jul 29, 2011.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. bgassassin

    Regular

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2011
    Messages:
    507
    Then you aren't labeling it correctly. Preferred doesn't work for your argument. Expected /= preferred.

    And I don't see how what I'm saying is more powerful than what the evidence supports when I'm trying to project what the final might resemble, not the performance level of the early kit.
     
  2. Stewox

    Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2012
    Messages:
    23
    A now i recall, the only where i saw RV730 was actually on the WiiU GPU speculation article featured here.
     
  3. AlNets

    AlNets ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
    Moderator Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2004
    Messages:
    17,923
    Location:
    Polaris
    Ultimately, it's just guesswork based on what we know of tendencies for silicon processes, die sizes, and focusing mostly on the ALUs (which themselves are attached to a specific number of TMUs). The early vague rumours (+50%, x-times perf etc) had a hand in it as well, but that's why we mention a range.
     
  4. Stewox

    Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2012
    Messages:
    23
    Understandable



    Wanted to add a comment on the ongoing idea abotu eDRAM thingy, however im still 3 pages back so still reading to get here so i'll be short:
    I think that might actually be a CPU thing and might not have anything to do with the GPU's discrete(?) memory. Anyway it goes, i would be disappointed if the console will have only 1 GB of whatever memory, just won't compete in long-term. Memory is so much more important just makes all that hardware useless if you peak the mem out you can't make games better, no matter how fast the CPU, GPU is, this is exactly what Carmack from ID Software points about in many interviews.
     
  5. Megadrive1988

    Veteran

    Joined:
    May 30, 2002
    Messages:
    4,506
    I thought this was very interesting:


    http://www.gametrailers.com/side-mi...aliens-colonial-marines-for-intriguing-wii-u/
     
  6. ToTTenTranz

    Legend Veteran Subscriber

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2008
    Messages:
    6,302
    This guy is right, as were the share drops in the stock market when they refused to disclose tech specs about the console (implying it would be kinda weak for a 2012->2017 gaming console).

    Take the hint, Nintendo.. take the hint..
     
  7. AlNets

    AlNets ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
    Moderator Legend

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2004
    Messages:
    17,923
    Location:
    Polaris
    Double the size of the console, and then we can start talking again. :p
     
  8. Earendil

    Newcomer

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2012
    Messages:
    56
    I don't know if they need to double it, per say. But it would be helpful if it didn't look like a safe deposit box.
     
  9. function

    function Wrong thread
    Veteran

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2003
    Messages:
    4,309
    Maybe that's why Nintendo feel comfortable putting their money into it? :eek:
     
  10. Earendil

    Newcomer

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2012
    Messages:
    56
    lmao

    Really though, I wonder about the length of that thing. My tv stand is a bit on the shallow side, which is fine because the Wii is so small. But if the Wii U is as long as it looks, I'm going to have to find a different place for it.
     
  11. Rangers

    Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2006
    Messages:
    11,331
    GAF has pointed out to me the interview is old. It's originally from a summer 2011 issue of Ngamer (so heck, it could have been from like March given mag lead times).

    Makes more sense that way anyway as Nintendo is likely running out of time to change things one way or the other at this point.
     
  12. Teasy

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2002
    Messages:
    4,563
    Location:
    Newcastle
    The "RAM thing" is confusing you not me. Take a moment to look at Arkams posts, he specifically says he's talking about the dev kit, not the system itself. Therefore he's claiming the dev kit has 1GB of RAM, where as lherre insinuated his had 3GB*

    *Lherre said that Nintendo had a range or memory they were looking at starting at 1GB in the final system (2GB in the corresponding dev kit) but that his current dev kit was using the higher end of that range. So I'm assuming that was 1.5GB (3GB in the dev kit). Could have been higher I suppose but I won't make that assumption.
     
    #612 Teasy, Feb 26, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 26, 2012
  13. Rangers

    Legend

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2006
    Messages:
    11,331
    Maybe he meant that regardless how much was in the system, it was known that 1GB would be in the final.

    If you had a dev system with 2GB of RAM and 1GB was basically extra/scratch pad/debug, you might refer to it as a 1GB system, since the extra RAM was just to enable ease of working with the 1GB you were actually limited too in games you were working on.
     
  14. bgassassin

    Regular

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2011
    Messages:
    507
    He didn't mean that. He was very clear about everything he said. I believe him and I believe his company still had the earlier kit.
     
  15. Stewox

    Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2012
    Messages:
    23
    You really are special, i mean, you bring up these ridiculus ideas that devs would KNOW before nintedo them selfs even finalized their position.

    Your argument about 1 GB being enough is very weird, what on earth would you be sufficed with this. 1 GB WILL not be enough to be competitive in the long run, heck the RAM is the most important and quite probably the BIGGEST BOTTLENECK, they will NOT be able to produce games that really push some big stuff. Im talking about the console's cycle, that's the long-term, and 1GB for long term, is a suicide, with 1.5 GB they would be just fine.

    Because the power of the device is useless if they can't fit all their intended textures on, eDRAM doesn't help, eDRAM is not for storing, it gets filled from the main ram , so it won't help with the bottleneck issue.

    I hope that they are all talking about the main memory, while nobody mentioned GPU RAM ... but i don't know really.

    It's not how it works, and for the record, it has been noted that it might be AN OLD REPORT from the old dev kits.

    I think your an imposter in this forums and please stop diluting this thread. Everything that's presented you keep downplaying it.

    I won't speculate much further, your personal right is to say whatever you want no matter what, but for sake of morale keep it down a notch.

    The reason we don't take seriously the negative is simply because they seem have no idea what they are talking about, these "devs" that came in the forums and said it's "slower than X360" without providing any specific information that could indicate and prove that, all those that were negative didn't say which kind of RAM and didn't said the supposable model of the GPU ... nothing.

    And also, some of the devlopers who migh slip out aren't necessairly the most experienced geeks to know these things enough, what if that was some QA guy or maybe some whoever person at the company who heard things over the counter and didn't remember it well enough.

    One thing is for sure, those that aren't really familiar wouldn't be making up any very high predictions just because of the moral reason a normal person wouldn't be making stuff up, they might be some guys who were lurking around the company, don't know the hardware but maybe have seen the internal demo or whatever and they saw the FPS maybe, and that made them think, but that's just the possibilities.

    Little understanding of the technology could tell you this cannot happen with a R700 chip that's supposedly 40nm and a 45nm CPU.

    However this is all based on what we currently have. If it turns out to be less powerful then nintendo did obviously blew it and the system will probably be a massive disappointment to me personally as well as others who expected more since expectations were set by these very rumors.
     
  16. 3dcgi

    Veteran Subscriber

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    2,340
    Seriously? No one should ever tone it down for the sake of morale.
     
  17. Stewox

    Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2012
    Messages:
    23

    wrong word , i meant ethics
     
  18. Legendary

    Banned

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2011
    Messages:
    26
    I can already say that this come from European big studios which have logically the latest dev kits available to third parties. To be clear, these are not small studios that could have remained at earlier dev kits because they are not important enough to receive Nintendo's latest updates quickly.

    So, from what my sources saw on their screens, they clearly stated that they experienced superior capabilities in comparison to the Xbox360. This is the positive aspect of my info: you can be sure that the Wii U is not on par with current gen HD. You can remove this idea from your heads, and stop speculating about it, it will not happen. The point more negative now: On the power scale, they told me that it’s closer to 2x Xbox360 than 5x. On paper, some components (you can guess which) are mathematically 4 or 5 times more powerful, more in quantity/number, than in the xbox360, but it does not translate for the moment in 5x prettier images, with 5 more complex and finest scenes, etc.

    Further details: These impressions are from a time when studios used revision 4 of the dev kits. Lately, 4.2 kits shipped from Singapore. I don’t know if there is a significant power gain with “.X” type of revisions, I guess it’s the case, but not as important as a change of revision number (from Rev 3 to 4 for example). I’ve heard that V5 kits may exist. It is likely, as for many other consoles before, that Nintendo and first-party have more advanced and therefore more powerful/optimized dev kits. However, these v4 kits are apparently from the end of the year / beginning of 2012, and they are those which have benefited from the hardware boost reported on the net. For people who hoped that this upgrade would make the Wii U 5 times stronger and 5 times more capable of displaying beautiful stuff on screen, from what I know, this is not the case for now, but there are several variables that can explain this, I'll come back to this subject in other posts, but can say that this “not 5x Xbox360” is only valid in the context from which I gathered my informations (third-party, second-hand, subjectivity, news given at a certain time knowing that the console will come out maybe 10 months later so will receive more upgrades, etc.). But again, I put the emphasis on the fact that it’s clearly not on par with the xbox360, it’s at least 2x.

    Furthermore, but read that with a grain of salt, many graphical effects are applied near the “end” of the visual development of a game. I guess some parameters that cause what is rendered on the screen to be more or less clean, complex, for example the type of shadow, the AA applied, and new effects that the Wii U GPU is probably capable of fall into this category (the shiny stuff that developers adds at the end, once the engine is running well), and therefore the final result will feel more like a 3 or 4 or even the famous 5x than 2x Xbox360 to the eyes of my sources, I keep in touch with them to know if it will be the case.

    That is all I can say for now, there will be other posts to come. Do not expect revelations from each of my interventions though. This in not the main purpose of my decision to post on NeoGAF. As my nickname implies it, I want to share my ideas (of game design, background, etc.) confront them, do theorycrafting which I love. I’ll participate on topics that interest me, and of course this one, by writing “normal” and light messages with some funny things, gifs, images, and above all, ideas !

    From GAF.
     
  19. babybumb

    Regular

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2011
    Messages:
    583
    GAF still dosent seem to get what this guy is saying.

    He says components are basically 2x360 overall system performance not that the images are 2x prettier.
     
  20. bgassassin

    Regular

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2011
    Messages:
    507
    You might want to read it again for yourself then.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page

  • About Beyond3D

    Beyond3D has been around for over a decade and prides itself on being the best place on the web for in-depth, technically-driven discussion and analysis of 3D graphics hardware. If you love pixels and transistors, you've come to the right place!

    Beyond3D is proudly published by GPU Tools Ltd.
Loading...