Wii U hardware discussion and investigation *rename

Discussion in 'Console Technology' started by TheAlSpark, Jul 29, 2011.

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  1. liolio

    liolio Aquoiboniste
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    MDX I was just answering you about that post.

    Now I've to say that I can not longer even tell the point you are trying to make.
    May be you should go lighter on the quote and make the point you are trying to defend clearer.
    Honestly I might not be alone I guess, it's getting difficult to follow.
     
  2. RaolinDarksbane

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    I have a question about the e6760 if the WiiU GPU is a custom version of it. Is it possible that the reason they(Nintendo or devs) didn't list the WiiU GPU as DirectX11 level is because of Microsoft? Is it a business reason or technical reason that they can't say it has DirectX11 features? The CEO of the Unity Engine company did say that the WiiU GPU is certainly capable of DirectX11 "equivalent" features and shaders. Not really sure what he means by equivalent. Also why even bother saying that the GPU everyone is speculating is DX10.1 capable when it doesn't even use the API.
     
    #2682 RaolinDarksbane, Sep 24, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 24, 2012
  3. XpiderMX

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    From Crytek (on Crysis 3 PS360):

     
  4. Sonic

    Sonic Senior Member
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    The logical conclusion, like you said, is that the edram is for the GPU or at least partly for the GPU. It makes little sense that the edram would be a cache solely for the CPU, and if that is indeed the case then Nintendo engineers should be fired immediately for being retarded. And when I say Nintendo engineers I mean Nintendo engineers alone considering they have the final say in the hardware design. IBM and AMD are perfectly capable of joining the edram to the GPU so that is the assumption I am making.

    Now as for what is stopping Nintendo form putting in 64, 128, 256, or a gig of edram is also an obvious answer. Cost.
     
  5. Kaotik

    Kaotik Drunk Member
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    4. There's separate eDRAM pools for CPU and GPU
     
  6. MDX

    MDX
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    e re

    What article? Can you quote what they said?
     
  7. MDX

    MDX
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    Okay, assuming then Nintendo had a choice of having GDDR5 or eDRAM.
    Do you happen to know the margin of difference, maybe a ratio, between the two in terms of costs? Including design changes that would have to be made to accomodate either or.
     
  8. somata

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    I'd agree that the PPC 750 is a pretty weak out-of-order design, but it's certainly more OOO than the Cortex A8. All five of the 750's execution units are independent, each with one or two "reservation station" slots attached, not just the FPU. Besides, why would they bother with register renaming and a six-entry reorder buffer if it were an in-order design? :wink:

    On your greater point though, I agree that there is no reason to use such a simple architecture in a next-gen console.
     
  9. Shifty Geezer

    Shifty Geezer uber-Troll!
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    http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-08-30-how-powerful-is-the-wii-u-really

     
  10. Li Mu Bai

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    You were referring to this post you made on Gaf wsippel:

    http://semimd.com/blog/2012/07/31/th...e-of-the-osat/

    He did sound fairly convincing, so I looked into Tezzaron & 3D-ICS, & found one particular design compelling
    the Wafer Stacked SOC http://www.tezzaron.com/technology/FaStack.htm

    "FaStack devices have many advantages over their single-layer counterparts. They are much more dense and their short vertical interconnects allow them to operate at higher speeds with a lower power budget. In addition, FaStack allows disparate elements to be processed on separate wafers for simpler production and greater optimization.

    Unlike the separate chips in a "System-in-Package" (SiP) component, FaStack layers are fully integrated into a single IC by a dense system of through-silicon interconnects. FaStack devices match the tight integration of SoC devices while out-doing SiPs for high speed, low power budget, and tiny footprint."


    Quite interesting considering the small form factor & power output of the Wii U. One more interesting fact. Mosis, who is reponsible for the fabrication for IBM, lists 45nm as the beginning range.

    "The IBM fabrication processes available through MOSIS range from 45 nanometer to 0.25 µm in CMOS, and from 0.13 µm to 0.50 µm in SiGe BiCMOS."

    http://www.mosis.com/products/fab-processes

    Not saying Nintendo has gone this route, although this would seem to fit in with their design philosophy. I am however sure that it's undoubtedly an SOC design. Also the edram is for the GPU, I do not understand the confusion.
     
    #2690 Li Mu Bai, Sep 25, 2012
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  11. Earendil

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    How exactly does one cool a 3D IC?
     
  12. Ruskie

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    I wonder, given that Nintendo made a deal with Unity and Epic for licensing their engines, do their internal teams want to use those too? I mean, this will be huge change for Nintendo going to "HD era" of development. Assets, textures, voice acting etc. everything will sky rocket from what they have done before and licensing solid 3rd party middleware could be good thing for them.
     
  13. Megadrive1988

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    There's a rumor that Retro Studios is working on game engines. The rumor then goes into near-crazy territory, saying that Epic was so impressed that they were convinced to bring UE4 to WiiU.
     
  14. steviep

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    It wouldn't be Retro, it would be dollar signs that would convince Epic to bring UE4 to lesser platforms than the ones currently publicly targetted (i.e. just PC).
     
  15. Blazkowicz

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    I suppose you just build something that doesn't heat much.
    In this context "tiny" and "low power" may be for something under 1 watt, e.g. a powerful microcontroller for industrial or field use.
    Wii U is only low power in comparison to gaming PCs and the two HD consoles.
     
  16. XpiderMX

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    Epic "impressed" by another engine and then "convinced" to bring UE4 to Wii U? It looks weird, Epic know what kind of hardware UE4 need, they know how to make engines, they don't need Retro "show them" anything :smile:
     
  17. Li Mu Bai

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    Indeed they are: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/20...-house-and-out

    Composing a Nintendo middleware SDK thread, should be up soon.

    Such is Epic's hubris, Rein believes his engine reigns supreme. steviep is correct, moneybags are their only motivation. Besides Retro would not be showing their proprietary engine to Epic anyway. Retro "is" Nintendo.
     
    #2697 Li Mu Bai, Sep 26, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 26, 2012
  18. Megadrive1988

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    Can't wait!
     
  19. TheLump

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    Vertically?

    Seriously though, the heating solutions for these things are quite extravagant from what I've seen. Who knows what they'll come up with for this sort of application though. If it happens, it'll be the first such application of 3D IC in the consumer electronics space, right?


    Althought the rumour is quite clearly guff; to be fair I think its implying that Retro got UE4 up and running so impressively, it made Epic reconsider putting WiiU on their "officially supported" list.

    Like I said, guff. And as we know, it matters not whether its "officially supported", developers are free to get the engine running on whatever they want to try once they're licensed to use it.
     
  20. tongue_of_colicab

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    Though being officially supported probably comes with the advantages of 1. knowing the engine will run as opposed to maybe having to change whatever to get it working and 2. support from epic. Sure they will probably offer support on not supported platforms as well but I assume they are charging a nice extra for that.
     
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