Why would nintendo release an underpowered console a year after the release of 360?

[Sonic]

Do not turn this into an Xbox vs. Gamecube thread. That topic hasbeen covered many times in the past. No need for this thread to go that way.

 

[one]

Do not turn this into an Xbox vs. Gamecube thread. That topic hasbeen covered many times in the past. No need for this thread to go that way.

Though I concur, it's also fascinating to think how they differ in the next-gen as IBM-ATI chipset brothers.

 

[LunchBox]

I don't know which Mac Mini you have, but:
Gamecube and Xbox both debuted in late 2001. If GC was as powerful as XBox, you might have a case there, but....

Didn't want to nitpick but the Xbox was also 100 dollars more than the gamecube...

 

[Shogmaster]

Didn't want to nitpick but the Xbox was also 100 dollars more than the gamecube...

EXACTLY! HENCE MY SIG!

 

[LunchBox]

EXACTLY! HENCE MY SIG!

lmao

sorry for being slow

i just got it after re-reading

lol

 

[Nappe1]

EXACTLY! HENCE MY SIG!

Austin/Morris (a.k.a. MINI) Cooper S was all about all three when presented to the press in early 60's.

In nowadays scale 1075 ccm engine with 80bhp does not sound much, but Hopkirk (and later on Flying Finns) did beat 4.7 litre Falcons with it in Monte.


okay okay, I'll go back to non-console area before I get smacked in the face.

 

[Powderkeg]

Gamecube has 43MB of RAM (24MB main RAM, 16MB aux, 3MB framebuffer/texmem), Xbox has 64MB to split between main RAM and graphics, and I think it's been said here that GC can use S3TC textures directly, but Xbox has to decompress them before they go into the GPU cache. So much for 40MB more...

I said SYSTEM RAM. Auxilery RAM makes no difference when it's transfer rate is less than a SATA hard drive. You can't process time essential game data from the Auxilery RAM. At best, you could use it to stream data like the Xbox uses a hard drive to stream data, but if we are going to count that for the GCN, then let's add an additional 8GB to the Xbox, shall we?

8GB + 64MB vs. 40MB....

And I'll be nice about the 3MB of Embedded RAM, even though 1MB of that will be duplicated in the System RAM. You are still looking at 27MB vs 64MB. You are still 37MB short of what the Xbox can hold and process.

And S3TC textures aren't going to make up that difference. Not even close.

 

[Readykilowatt]

To Powderkeg

Xbox's GPU also requires 16MB of the 64MB DDR just to cull a Z-buffer (which is embedded on the GCN GPU at no cost to system memory), and also GCN's internal GPU bandwidth is more than twice that of Xbox's (25GB/sec compared to 10GB/sec).

Is the above information true or false?

 

[ninzel]

A few reputable Nintendo fansites are now reporting the Rev unveiling in full at TGS as official.

 

[StefanS]

A few reputable Nintendo fansites are now reporting the Rev unveiling in full at TGS as official.

Nintendo is not present at TGS, AFAIK. Only Iwata is to deliver a keynote speech. There's no Nintendo booth. How'd they unveil a new console without a booth?
Revolution will not be unveiled a TGS, a few more details maybe but that's it.

 

[darkblu]

I said SYSTEM RAM. Auxilery RAM makes no difference when it's transfer rate is less than a SATA hard drive. You can't process time essential game data from the Auxilery RAM. At best, you could use it to stream data like the Xbox uses a hard drive to stream data, but if we are going to count that for the GCN, then let's add an additional 8GB to the Xbox, shall we?

8GB + 64MB vs. 40MB....

And I'll be nice about the 3MB of Embedded RAM, even though 1MB of that will be duplicated in the System RAM. You are still looking at 27MB vs 64MB. You are still 37MB short of what the Xbox can hold and process.

And S3TC textures aren't going to make up that difference. Not even close.

sheez, this thread started bad and is turning for the worse.

ok, what are you exactly trying to argue here, powderkeg? - that the more ram on a platform the better? - yes, all other things being equal. as they are not, though, first you have to show that the differences do not actually turn your 'more memory is da king' into shambles. and no, statements like the one above ('8GB + 64MB vs. 40MB...') do not add a single bit of weight to your claims. on the contrary, they make those discussing with you wonder if they're not wasting their time.

 

[Reznor007]

I said SYSTEM RAM. Auxilery RAM makes no difference when it's transfer rate is less than a SATA hard drive. You can't process time essential game data from the Auxilery RAM. At best, you could use it to stream data like the Xbox uses a hard drive to stream data, but if we are going to count that for the GCN, then let's add an additional 8GB to the Xbox, shall we?

8GB + 64MB vs. 40MB....

And I'll be nice about the 3MB of Embedded RAM, even though 1MB of that will be duplicated in the System RAM. You are still looking at 27MB vs 64MB. You are still 37MB short of what the Xbox can hold and process.

And S3TC textures aren't going to make up that difference. Not even close.

OK so the ARAM is just there to take up space on the motherboard

It's used as a buffer and as RAM for the audio system, which means that that RAM won't be used from main RAM. I believe Rogue Squadron 2 uses it for the level(it's mentioned on the commentary).

 

[Sonic]

This is a warning to all those currently participating in Gamecube vs. Xbox talk in this thread. If anyone else makes a post arguing this then you will be banned for one week. Keep it on topic. If you want to discuss the differences between Xbox and Gamecube then create a new thread.

 

[Teasy]

I would say that if visuals are all you judge power by, you don't understand what you are playing.

Clearly within the context of my discussion with Shogmaster we were, at that time, talking about graphics. Though to be honest switching the argument to AI doesn't change much. There aren't any games on any current console with AI that stands out as something that couldn't be done on GC.

 

[Powderkeg]

OK so the ARAM is just there to take up space on the motherboard

It's used as a buffer and as RAM for the audio system, which means that that RAM won't be used from main RAM. I believe Rogue Squadron 2 uses it for the level(it's mentioned on the commentary).

Like I said, it gets the same usage as a hard drive would. It has a higher transfer rate than the Xbox HDD, but slower than most new PC HDD's. With only an 81MB/Second transfer rate, it's not suitable for anything but a non-time essential data buffer.

The 16MB of ARAM does the same job as the 8GB hard drive in the Xbox.
The 24MB of System RAM is all that the GCN has to compare with the Xbox's 64MB of System RAM.

 

[Powderkeg]

Clearly within the context of my discussion with Shogmaster we were, at that time, talking about graphics. Though to be honest switching the argument to AI doesn't change much. There aren't any games on any current console with AI that stands out as something that couldn't be done on GC.

How about not switching, but adding in.

Add in the physics, AI, graphics, sound, and all other aspects of a game together. There is a reason Nintendo's GCN games are very arcady in nature, the system doesn't have the resources to handle highly complex games such as sims.

Never in a million years could the GCN pull of a Steel Battalion with no sacrifices in any aspect of the game.

 

[YeuEmMaiMai]

How about not switching, but adding in.

Add in the physics, AI, graphics, sound, and all other aspects of a game together. There is a reason Nintendo's GCN games are very arcady in nature, the system doesn't have the resources to handle highly complex games such as sims.

Never in a million years could the GCN pull of a Steel Battalion with no sacrifices in any aspect of the game.

what a load of crap....

 

[YeuEmMaiMai]

Like I said, it gets the same usage as a hard drive would. It has a higher transfer rate than the Xbox HDD, but slower than most new PC HDD's. With only an 81MB/Second transfer rate, it's not suitable for anything but a non-time essential data buffer.

The 16MB of ARAM does the same job as the 8GB hard drive in the Xbox.
The 24MB of System RAM is all that the GCN has to compare with the Xbox's 64MB of System RAM.

64MB used by the entire system

Win 2K OS
Sound storage
Video Ram

I know you don't like the GC but that 64MB isn't the nirvana you make it out to be. That 16MB of ram on th GC is used for other thing and not for HDD storage like you claim such as sound data, menu screen storage, etc. The memory cards take the same fuction as the x box HDD.

Having access to an Xbox and a Game cube, I really cannot tell much if any difference on the graphics side although I did notice that MK deception had a lot of load time on the x-box compared to GC graphics wise, I could not tell them apart

I have all 3 consoles and while GC is my favorite, There are some games that I like on PS2 such as ratchet and clank series and jax and dexter. On the xbox I like halo series. On GC I like any of the Mario games and Zelda.

Trying to prove the superiority of xbox hardware is a mute point since it is the Quality of the games that will draw me to the system.

 

[Qroach]

I tmight be a bette ridea to just lock this topic. I honestly can't beleive the arguments going on here. it's liek people either have short memories or they just choose not to see the data in front of them.

 

[Sonic]

Powderkeg and YeuEmMaiMai, for not following the warning I gave the rest of the people in this thread about stopping the Xbox vs. Gamecube talk you are both being banned for one week. I had said to create a new thread if you wished to continue it and you did not. If you have any questions or responses to this please feel free to pm me.