What's suitable shading language for N.Revolution ?

[V3]

360 has HLSL, PS3 has CG, what would be a good Shading Language for Rev ?

 

[Qroach]

I'd say it'd be best to wait until the hardware is annouced. At this point a shading language doesn't really matter if the hardware design isn't complete. Anyway, if it does have one it will likely be similar to openGL.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Surely it'll be whatever ATi is happiest with - HLSL (?)

 

[shaderguy]

Gamecube was a fixed-function DX7-class part, if I recall correctly. Not much point in a shading language for that.

If Rev uses a modern GPU it would be a DX 9-class part, and could use cg/HLSL or GSLang.

It would seem that technically any of the three shading languages would work, but from a business standpoint only GSLang would be possible. However, most game development is being done in cg/HLSL. If Nintendo wanted to make cross-platform game development easy they would buy or create their own cg/HLSL clone.

Hey, that's a way for a compiler writer to make a quick buck: write a cg/HLSL clone and sell it to Nintendo.

 

[Farid]

GLSL would be the obvious candidate.

But it might be a little premature to discuss this kind of stuff right now.

 

[Magnum PI]

isn't HLSL a thing microsoft created ? if it is, i don't expect MS let nintendo use it..

 

[Bobbler]

isn't HLSL a thing microsoft created ? if it is, i don't expect MS let nintendo use it..

Microsoft is in existance to make money -- it's not going to make any more money by disallowing a standard it would love to have be the standard. In addition to that, they can't really stop them -- DirectX and HLSL is not licensed -- anyone can DL the SDK.

Don't count DX/HLSL out just because Microsoft is behind it.

 

[Magnum PI]

isn't HLSL a thing microsoft created ? if it is, i don't expect MS let nintendo use it..

Microsoft is in existance to make money -- it's not going to make any more money by disallowing a standard it would love to have be the standard.

but it would equate to loss of a competitive advantage to a direct competitor, one thing which could only hurts their business..

about yes microsoft want HLSL to be the standard for game developpers... but they also want it to exist on their plateform. so their plateforms are the standard for gaming, their surely aren't going to make it available for linux or macosx..

in this case its the very purpose of having a proprietary standard instead on contributing on open ones like opengl.

In addition to that, they can't really stop them -- DirectX and HLSL is not licensed -- anyone can DL the SDK.

yes nintendo can download the SDK and develop for directx on windows platform.

which is very different than to be allowed to make its own implementation of HLSL...

Don't count DX/HLSL out just because Microsoft is behind it.

i wansn't counting out DX/HLSL out just because Microsoft is behind it, i have some serious reasonning beahind it.. i didn't care to mention it because it is seemed so evident to me, it seems i was wrong.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Dunno about that. MS were suggesting Sony and Nintendo embrace XNA as their development platform. I think they'd be happy to extend their tentacles wherever they can.

 

[Magnum PI]

this was an announce made during the GDC, what better to entice the devs to go XNA than to suggest it could become multiplateform ?
i would think it was more about generating hype than something real.

maybe in console world it could suit their interests:
they suggested to the other console manufacturer to let them take over the control of their plateform, software-wise...
as now, their are a challenger.. if XNAs happened to become the only development environment for the next gen, what would happen the generation after, when XNA NG is only available on microsoft console ?

anyway, in the computer world, where they have the dominant OS, they have no interest of making DX/HLSL available on the other OS.

 

[Teasy]

Gamecube was a fixed-function DX7-class part, if I recall correctly. Not much point in a shading language for that.

Flipper did have a programmable colour combiner so the chip wasn't entirely fixed function (the T&L unit was though).

 

[corysama]

With Microsoft owning HLSL and Nvidia owning Cg (even if it is open, it is still associated entirely with Nvidia -so ATI would never agree to use it out of corporate pride), Nintendo will probably have to use OpenGl's GlSlang. This would fit well with Nintendo's OGL-like API. It also has the bonus "feature" of making cross-platform development harder (yes, that is how they think).

 

[V3]

With Microsoft owning HLSL and Nvidia owning Cg (even if it is open, it is still associated entirely with Nvidia -so ATI would never agree to use it out of corporate pride), Nintendo will probably have to use OpenGl's GlSlang. This would fit well with Nintendo's OGL-like API. It also has the bonus "feature" of making cross-platform development harder (yes, that is how they think).

Is GlSlang really suitable though, or is it the only other option ?

 

[Farid]

Is GlSlang really suitable though, or is it the only other option ?

They can also create one from scratch.
But that would be a waiste of ressources, seeing that GLSL, or a modified version, could do the job nicely.

 

[Li Mu Bai]

Is GlSlang really suitable though, or is it the only other option?

It's definitely more than suitable, & possesses some advantages over both HLSL & CG. (despite being somewhat similar to CG in its structure)

 

[Zeross]

It's definitely more than suitable, & possesses some advantages over both HLSL & CG. (despite being somewhat similar to CG in its structure)

Like what ? On the PC side GLSL has a big advantage : the compiler is embedded inside the driver, which means it can optimise for the hardware directly without any low level intermediate representation which can destroy semantics. But on a console this advantage is lost because HLSL will compile straight to the metal for the Xenos and the same is true for Cg and RSX.