VF5 - Official for 360. And Xbox Live??

[nintenho]

It's impossible to play a VF game the way it's meant to be played online. For a game like DOA where the counter-windows are much bigger it's possible. Sega actually tried to do an arcade network ring in Tokyo with fiber optic cables but stopped the project because they were still unsatisfied with latency.

You have to consider that the main appeal of sega's project was organizing tourneys without renting a convention center so obviously there was effort into it.

Would a dedicated server at all help?

 

[TheChefO]

Sega actually tried to do an arcade network ring in Tokyo with fiber optic cables but stopped the project because they were still unsatisfied with latency.

Interesting, I remember reading about this a while ago but assumed the project finished as planned. I had no idea it was scrapped.

 

[pakotlar]

It's impossible to play a VF game the way it's meant to be played online. For a game like DOA where the counter-windows are much bigger it's possible. Sega actually tried to do an arcade network ring in Tokyo with fiber optic cables but stopped the project because they were still unsatisfied with latency.

You have to consider that the main appeal of sega's project was organizing tourneys without renting a convention center so obviously there was effort into it.

Would a dedicated server at all help?

Sure, dedicated servers should help. Depends on the connection speed though. I don't see why, theoretically, we couldn't be seeing ~20-30ping servers on xbox live. My connection maxes at about 2MB/s down and 480Kb/s up, and I've seen 15 pings on my connection with dedicated servers up to around 1000 miles away (in CS:S). I don't see why the same can't hold true on XBL. 15ms would be ok for 1/60s frame accuracy.

edit: Actually, could someone do the calculation out? What is the max. latency permissable for 2 people to have a match online and still retain perfect timing? Or is it a case of diminishing returns but never perf. accuracy? I mean assuming both people had 15ms ping, that's 15ms to server and back for full update right? So that means for 2 people that 30ms in the worst case right? 3/100 s lag @ max = .03s lag , while a 1 frame move is .0166s. So I could see that in this case, some sort of lag compensation would probably have to be implemented. No matter what amount of lag, that will always be added on top of the 1 frame move right?

 

[Aerobahn]

I still think that its not just a matter of a few frames, but rather the would be unplayable.

 

[tuna]

Who is "people". Personally, I couldn't give a fluck about frame-accurate performance online. I would much rather have the option of being able to play online with slightly less-accurate timing, than pay $60 for a single-player only game. I think many people would like that. Don't make generalizations about the population as a whole tuna.

Sorry, "people" should be "AM2 fans". And if you don't care about frame accurate performance, then maybe VF is not for you?

 

[Kryton]

Sure, dedicated servers should help. Depends on the connection speed though. I don't see why, theoretically, we couldn't be seeing ~20-30ping servers on xbox live. My connection maxes at about 2MB/s down and 480Kb/s up, and I've seen 15 pings on my connection with dedicated servers up to around 1000 miles away (in CS:S). I don't see why the same can't hold true on XBL. 15ms would be ok for 1/60s frame accuracy.

edit: Actually, could someone do the calculation out? What is the max. latency permissable for 2 people to have a match online and still retain perfect timing? Or is it a case of diminishing returns but never perf. accuracy? I mean assuming both people had 15ms ping, that's 15ms to server and back for full update right? So that means for 2 people that 30ms in the worst case right? 3/100 s lag @ max = .03s lag , while a 1 frame move is .0166s. So I could see that in this case, some sort of lag compensation would probably have to be implemented. No matter what amount of lag, that will always be added on top of the 1 frame move right?

Your assumption of lag being almost constant is based off 1 or two packets. If latency is constant, you can deal with it. If latency is fluctuating (i.e. a packet switched network where packets go different ways depending on local conditions) you can't do that.

 

[Arwin]

Your assumption of lag being almost constant is based off 1 or two packets. If latency is constant, you can deal with it. If latency is fluctuating (i.e. a packet switched network where packets go different ways depending on local conditions) you can't do that.

I looked into this. I think for 60fps you need about 40ms for two players versus gaming. Gran Turismo 4 over KAI was a good test for this, as it synchronises frame-by-frame. Since I do get this with many people at least in the direct vicinity (meaning say a circle around my place with a radius of about 300-600km), they could include this option anyway.

Peer-to-peer is obviously the best way to go for a game like Virtua Fighter, as a server will only increase latency. You only have two players and you need the shortest path between them.

 

[ban25]

I would actually go so far to say that not only are most of the people demanding online play "no matter the cost" not serious VF fans, but they probably haven't played any of the online fighting games that are out there -- as it is a drastically inferior experience regardless of the game.

 

[woundingchaney]

I would actually go so far to say that not only are most of the people demanding online play "no matter the cost" not serious VF fans, but they probably haven't played any of the online fighting games that are out there -- as it is a drastically inferior experience regardless of the game.

I have played most every online fighter available and I dont consider it to be inferior experience in the least nor do I consider it to be superior but the option itself is definetely expected by todays measures. Im not a serious VF fan and I would also say that the majority of their consumer base isnt "serious" fans either (although I have been playing the series since the original arcade VF), I have been playing fighters since the release of the arcade SF2 and have been a fan of the genre ever since. I still dont see why the single player gameplay mechanics need change to incorporate online play (unless of course Sega wants some balance between the play modes).

Regardless the only "innovation" to come out of the fighter genre in the last 10 years is the concept and acceptance of online play outside of that the genre has been rehashing the same forumula for ages.