The Technology of GTA IV/RDR *Rage Engine*

[NRP]

I'd guess 720p @ 60 Hz is impossible given the visual bar set this gen.

But I agree in principle. 60 Hz is very nice for general feel and playability.

 

[assurdum]

I liked your post and I can understand this. I don't have a PS3, personally, but the port might be a good one if the differences are due to memory limitations of the operating system and both games look so close.

The slight added blurriness of the PS3 iteration of the game might be caused by the inherent use of Quincunx AA, not a limiting factor of the hardware.

However I would go with a different approach when porting the game. In my opinion they better go with 720p+AAx4+60 fps on the PS3, no matter the sacrifices!!!!

If they managed to keep the draw distance with no popping then it would be perfect, and also reducing the level of detail in some areas it could be a great version.

720p+AAx4+60 fps should be mandatory for a lot of games, in my opinion. Neither Sony or Microsof encourage this, sadly.

I'm a sucker for 60 fps games and it's really sad this generation most games run at 30 fps. One of the good things about the PS2 is that it had a lot of games running at 60 fps.

The difference is night and day, as I am pretty sensitive to frames per second.

Sorry to use your post to explain this long rant. Oooh, cheers!

I think it not exist a single game with these specs on the ps3 and it is impossible technically talking.

 

[Billy Idol]

I think it not exist a single game with these specs on the ps3 and it is impossible technically talking.

Hm, if I am right...GT5 Prologue is 720p+4AA+60Hz, when 1080p mode is deactivated??

 

[nightshade]

Hm, if I am right...GT5 Prologue is 720p+4AA+60Hz, when 1080p mode is deactivated??

Yes, but the game is more simplified than other (racing) games when it comes to rendering tech, as it is obvious by looking at the environment. (though it indeed has a highly impressive HDR even by the standard of 30FPS racing games & has highly detailed cars). But I understand where you're coming to, even with all the simplified tech....it sure as hell looks & feels like its a lot more advanced.

 

[assurdum]

Hm, if I am right...GT5 Prologue is 720p+4AA+60Hz, when 1080p mode is deactivated??

In a racer game is more easy to hide some lack in the graphic. And however we talking of polyphony, a developer who work for years in its project.

 

[Billy Idol]

Yes, but the game is more simplified than other (racing) games when it comes to rendering tech, as it is obvious by looking at the environment. (though it indeed has a highly impressive HDR even by the standard of 30FPS racing games & has highly detailed cars). But I understand where you're coming to, even with all the simplified tech....it sure as hell looks & feels like its a lot more advanced.

In a racer game is more easy to hide some lack in the graphic. And however we talking of polyphony, a developer who work for years in its project.

Hey guys. Just to clarify (in before I get slaughtered):
I did not imply anything with the GT5 example. I just answered your question assurdum

I think it not exist a single game with these specs on the ps3

:smile:

 

[Laa-Yosh]

You can easily get 60fps, 4x AA and even 1080p - as long as you're content with the graphics complexity of the previous generation. It's a trade-off, as the hardware has limited resources to spend.

 

[TrungGap]

IIRC, the camera turns around in that scene showing windows... I can't say if it was that window letting in the light, but there definitely are several windows in that room, and it's not just that lighting visible on PS3, but several, that are missing on 360.

Hmmm, how come the guys in the foreground isn't lite the same way the girl in the background. The guys in the foreground is lite with a softer light diffused light, whereas the girl is hitted with a harsher light. Also, notice strange shadow under the guy's hat on the right?

 

[TheWretched]

I don't know.

Somebody also pointed out missing self shadowing on the PC.

 

[RobertR1]

The DF article is up: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-red-dead-redemption-face-off

Nothing new really. The 360 version is the way to go. However, what's going on here?

http://images.eurogamer.net/assets/articles//a/1/1/0/1/8/9/5/InconsistentLighting360_000.jpg.jpg
http://images.eurogamer.net/assets/articles//a/1/1/0/1/8/9/5/InconsistentLightingPS3_000.jpg.jpg

 

[AlNom]

Weird. Assuming the timing is correct (doesn`t seem to be an issue in other shots), it looks like the world light value got... clipped.

 

[nightshade]

Could it be the clouds ?

 

[Malo]

Yeah despite the fact that the TOD will be the same, possibly the cloud cover could have some randomness to it.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Could it be the clouds ?

Cloud formations are identical in the background.

 

[Scott_Arm]

I went back to that bar in Armadillo and it seems like light will shine in through the top floor windows, but not the ground floor. Not sure I understand that.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Perhaps it's a shadowing bug. The PS3 has less shadows overall, so this might be case of XB360 lights being occluded where the PS3's aren't, only they aren't supposed to be being occluded in these instances? It evidentally isn't a technical limit preventing XB360 drawing them is it has them in some cases.

 

[Scott_Arm]

Perhaps it's a shadowing bug. The PS3 has less shadows overall, so this might be case of XB360 lights being occluded where the PS3's aren't, only they aren't supposed to be being occluded in these instances? It evidentally isn't a technical limit preventing XB360 drawing them is it has them in some cases.

Basically what I did was walk into that bar/tavern, and faced the camera position in those shots. The sun was bright and setting outside. If I looked at the upper windows, I could see bright yellow light shining through. If I looked through the lower windows, they looked like there wasn't any light shining through at all. I'll play around with it more when I get home.

 

[dobwal]

Hmmm, how come the guys in the foreground isn't lite the same way the girl in the background. The guys in the foreground is lite with a softer light diffused light, whereas the girl is hitted with a harsher light. Also, notice strange shadow under the guy's hat on the right?

Probably because the light shining into the room is from a upstairs window.

 

[Krabardaf]

Cloud formations are identical in the background.

No link between this and the fake shadow used to simulate a cloud passing over a scene.
Skboxes and even volumetric clouds generally never cast any shadow.

 

[Cyan]

Probably because the light shining into the room is from a upstairs window.

Or it could be simply due to the different lighting conditions of both games as they pointed out in the DF article, with differing light conditions at the beginning of the game.

You can easily get 60fps, 4x AA and even 1080p - as long as you're content with the graphics complexity of the previous generation. It's a trade-off, as the hardware has limited resources to spend.

Nintendo machines are the only consoles that are still good with some of it's best games. Currently every god game designer is all about HD -which I agree with- and realistic graphics. They spend so much time improving the picture quality and they forget about the purpose of the game. No one had a problem with graphics in the 90s. Why is it now such a concern?

If they could port the game to the PS3 at 60 fps and 720p, plus AAx4 regardless the sacrifices without hampering the draw distance, then we wouldn't be scrutinizing the two versions of the game so much.

And now with 3D we will be stuck with 30 fps for years.... If next generation machines could run games at 120fps, 720p AAx4 then I'd be happy.