Is the game as shit as I expect it to be? Too soon?
The Order: 1886
- Thread starter Bagel seed
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- tig:theorder1886
Hi, today is the 20th, I'm sending this from the future to warn you all. The game is not shit, but reviewers hated it, causing a rift in the gaming world.
Terrible things will happen on the 18th when reviews come out, save the order, save the world.
Your forgot the "Black Bars cause the game to only render at a pixel resolution of 800p!" Or some such weirdness.
So I took the time to watch that 1-hour video...
This is a really good looking game, there's no doubt about it. But the whole thing feels actually weaker than the first hour of practically any AA third person shooting based game from the last generation, whether it's Uncharted or Gears of War or even Mass Effect. Sure, Galahad can knock pieces of furniture around when he hits them, but the number of closed doors is still as high as it was 5-10 years ago, and the number of enemies isn't any greater either. It's also frustrating even to watch that the game's more dangerous enemies are only more scary because of the limitations of the 3rd prerson camera controls - I've had more than enough of that, thank you.
I guess it's not going to be a revolutionary game, if there's any truly amazing gameplay then it's already hidden far too deep to make people care. The visuals may sell a lot of copies, but to be honest I wouldn't expect to get anything more than that. Like the intro, seriously, that's the best they could come up with?
This is a really good looking game, there's no doubt about it. But the whole thing feels actually weaker than the first hour of practically any AA third person shooting based game from the last generation, whether it's Uncharted or Gears of War or even Mass Effect. Sure, Galahad can knock pieces of furniture around when he hits them, but the number of closed doors is still as high as it was 5-10 years ago, and the number of enemies isn't any greater either. It's also frustrating even to watch that the game's more dangerous enemies are only more scary because of the limitations of the 3rd prerson camera controls - I've had more than enough of that, thank you.
I guess it's not going to be a revolutionary game, if there's any truly amazing gameplay then it's already hidden far too deep to make people care. The visuals may sell a lot of copies, but to be honest I wouldn't expect to get anything more than that. Like the intro, seriously, that's the best they could come up with?
I've already PS+zoned this
That isn't even a valid complaint of any game. I can't recall any game that revolutionized anything, maybe Wii sports? Games genres evolve slowly, one building and blending on predecessors. Maybe we should judge games on what they are rather than lofty expectations. Also judge them on playing them, not watching them.
L. Scofield
Veteran
So I took the time to watch that 1-hour video...
This is a really good looking game, there's no doubt about it. But the whole thing feels actually weaker than the first hour of practically any AA third person shooting based game from the last generation, whether it's Uncharted or Gears of War or even Mass Effect. Sure, Galahad can knock pieces of furniture around when he hits them, but the number of closed doors is still as high as it was 5-10 years ago, and the number of enemies isn't any greater either. It's also frustrating even to watch that the game's more dangerous enemies are only more scary because of the limitations of the 3rd prerson camera controls - I've had more than enough of that, thank you.
I guess it's not going to be a revolutionary game, if there's any truly amazing gameplay then it's already hidden far too deep to make people care. The visuals may sell a lot of copies, but to be honest I wouldn't expect to get anything more than that. Like the intro, seriously, that's the best they could come up with?
I think if you're going to have fast enemies there should be a way to turn faster. RE4 did it with the instant 180° turn.
Honestly speaking...I kind of agree. Eventhough I have this game pre ordered and I'll enjoy it for what it will be.
No one wants a revolutionary game in the absolute sense, and it's pretty much impossible to achieve in a genre such as TPS. But it's not hard to figure out that every great game no matter how much it imitates others has atleast that little something, that twist...which makes it special and has people identify it with. Every TPS today has a cover system, but Gears will always feel different in how it implements the cover system with sliding and movement along with mini mechanics exclusive to Gears such as active reloads and mechanics that define Gears such as its power weapon gameplay in multiplayer.
Without such things the games become stale, the mission structure is already quite saturated in that you see the same escort missions, the same kind of rescue missions or the same kind of wave based missions in games now. The only way to keep things interesting is by having that little something in the side...which the Order seems to lack completely. And another thing developers need to understand imo, is that if you want to imitate set pieces like Uncharted then you better make it on a similar scale or with that level of commitment (the ship or the train in UC games) and provide the player with the option to play around in that set piece (which UC lets players do because of its traversal system, one moment you are walking on the floor and the next you are walking on what used to be the wall etc etc). If you don't do these things and just play it safe then it just becomes too formulaic.
No one wants a revolutionary game in the absolute sense, and it's pretty much impossible to achieve in a genre such as TPS. But it's not hard to figure out that every great game no matter how much it imitates others has atleast that little something, that twist...which makes it special and has people identify it with. Every TPS today has a cover system, but Gears will always feel different in how it implements the cover system with sliding and movement along with mini mechanics exclusive to Gears such as active reloads and mechanics that define Gears such as its power weapon gameplay in multiplayer.
Without such things the games become stale, the mission structure is already quite saturated in that you see the same escort missions, the same kind of rescue missions or the same kind of wave based missions in games now. The only way to keep things interesting is by having that little something in the side...which the Order seems to lack completely. And another thing developers need to understand imo, is that if you want to imitate set pieces like Uncharted then you better make it on a similar scale or with that level of commitment (the ship or the train in UC games) and provide the player with the option to play around in that set piece (which UC lets players do because of its traversal system, one moment you are walking on the floor and the next you are walking on what used to be the wall etc etc). If you don't do these things and just play it safe then it just becomes too formulaic.
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VFX_Veteran
Regular
You can't know that unless you know that they are rendering the final back buffer at a full 1080p and just making those 25% pixel colors black. I would be inclined to believe they aren't rendering full 1080p swap buffers.
No it's definitely hiding things. For example, you have a blur on the face of the character as he picks up objects and examines them. Why? Because his hair isn't real and they don't want to gamer to know it's using geometry instead of curves.
Baked "direct" lighting is old news. For a game of this caliber it should be using dynamic shadows. There are parts that are baked and others that aren't. They mixed it up a bit to fool the gamer?
LOL! This game is far far from CGI-like visuals. There are so many things that it doesn't do even compared to other games that I would hardly call it that.
I'm not sure that you read that correctly; nobody is arguing that they're rendering a full 1920x1080 and then cropping it.
Prophecy2K was referring to realtime GI.
The Order 1886 is hardly baking just direct lighting. No modern games that use pre-baked lightmaps are, that would be extremely bizarre.
VFX_Veteran
Regular
So why the assumption the black bars were for design reasons instead of performance reasons.
But it is using lightmaps in some areas.
EDIT: Sorry, we are misunderstanding each other. It's baking both direct and indirect lighting. 100% baked indirect.. partially baked direct lighting.
The argument is that design was the "big" reason to do it, and performance gains were a happy secondary effect.
Yes. You said "direct", though, so I thought that you were claiming that said lightmaps didn't have environmental bounced lighting baked into them.
I guess I'm not really sure what you meant. Were you just commenting on the apparent lack of dynamic shadows (i.e. no dynamic occlusion of direct component of baked lighting)?
VFX_Veteran
Regular
Yea, right.
Yea, some of the objects in the scenes are static and therefore shadows are not dynamic.
They did imply that they could hit full 1080P if they were to do away with 4*MSAA. And it's obvious that full 1080P no MSAA would take less bandwidth than what they have right now.
And I disagree this game isn't "far far from CGI- like visuals" it's pretty much the best example of CGI-like today (stress on the word "like" instead of jut CGI visuals)
And I disagree this game isn't "far far from CGI- like visuals" it's pretty much the best example of CGI-like today (stress on the word "like" instead of jut CGI visuals)
I agree, it's the best and only, at least for me, example!
Sigfried1977
Legend
No, but it sure looks like crap. Last time I used that term it was hyperbolic. This time I actually mean it.
VFX_Veteran
Regular
The only things that's 'like' CGI visuals is the GGX model they use for their specular BRDF, their sheen shader for fabrics and the desaturated colors (which AC:Unity mimics very well too). Everything else is not even close.
1) No real hair curves
2) No physically plausible diffuse shader (they use Lambertian model)
3) No physically plausible hair shader (Kajiya is a rough approximation long abandoned)
4) No soft shadows from real area lights (need a path tracer to do this)
5) No real ambient occlusion (SSAO doesn't even cut it)
6) No real reflections
7) No real SSS
etc..
etc..
I could go on and on and on. Even Naughty Dog know their in-game model of Drake during the E3 trailer isn't close to CGI when people commented it looked like it -- and that model destroys any of The Order models. Just saying..
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