Technical Game Engine Comparisons: non-subjective *OffTopic Cleanup Spawn*

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Recop said:
http://www.gamersyde.com/hqstream_ratchet_clank_ps4_pro_gameplay_1_1080p-38591_en.html : here's why people consider Ratchet and Clank as one the best looking game on the market.

Dice games on PC at max settings are the only games that can compete graphically with Sony exclusives in my opinion.

Not to mention the far lower model rendering in Battlefront :


Also, in more traditional games such as Mirror Edge, Dice work is less convincing.

We already talked about Wildlands : amazing draw distance, very detailed, but it fails on the most important thing = asset quality. Overall, the game looks good but far from exceptionnal (even on PC at max settings).

As long as developers will not specifically aim high end PC, they will fail to match the most impressive Sony exclusives.

All 3P games are held back by the lowest common denominator that are the Xbox One and weak PC. Some higher quality shadows and better AF on PC won't change this fundamental fact.
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Reminds my of this despite the fact that this area is much much bigger bigger, one can fly in it and it has very high quality assets, they can generate full interiors and ist even not finished.


Assets are not that bad but lets say Ratched and Clank with its angular assets is the game with the best graphics instead
https://flic.kr/s/aHskTrYGDj

Game from 2015 with 40 players, alot of desctruction and physics on Endor and UHD/60fps.
https://flic.kr/s/aHskBAans7

I dont care about Mirrors Edge even Battlefield 1 and BATTLEFRONT II have some major issues (negative texture LOD) compared to BATTLEFRONT 2015. Battlefield 1 also has an annoying sharpening filter.

PlayStation games are also hold back by a tablet level CPU and 5GB RAM. The PC version of Wildlands has little in common with the Xbox One version. This looks like a generation gap.

BATTLEFRONT has ok characters since there are a lot of them on the screen and one hardly sees them from the near in the fight anyway. Just look after Uncharted 4s multiplayer models for a comparison.

ultragpu said:
Not only characters, buildings both exterior and interior, vehicles, general items are all of low quality. The price to pay for a big open world one must say.
julien-debono-hacienda01.jpg

https://guides4gamers.com/sites/4/screenshots/2017/03/1920/search-el-emisarios-body.jpg
http://cdn.escapistmagazine.com/media/global/images/library/deriv/1378/1378184.jpg
Now the typical GoW asset quality for measure.
1920x-11khr33.jpg
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I am not that often in interiors in Wildands but I can look for a real gameplay picture instead. Of course these will not look greatly filled but they have an unimportant role anyway.

Some of those GoW textures look low res and it reminds me of AC: Origins. The Division is much better.

Star Citizen is the biggest game and it has by far the assets with the highest quality.
https://flic.kr/s/aHsmec5ogC
https://flic.kr/p/23uRE1o

Huge game and low asset quality does not necessarily correlate. I doubt that objects can be found in that size that look better.

chris1515 said:
The most impressive things I have seen if it is really realtime cutscene is The Last of us 2 PGW trailer... But if it is realtime I hope the same gap in gameplay will be find between UC4 cutscene and TLOU2 PGW trailer... From what told an animator working for Naughty Dog the gap between Uncharted 4 and TLOU 2 is huge...

https://twitter.com/x/status/927597070709436416
Click to expand...

Technically it looks better than Uncharted 4. Let's see when it comes. Some think that it is close to Death Stranding but I think TLoU will appear much earlier.
 
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Jupiter said:
Reminds my of this despite the fact that this area is much much bigger bigger, one can fly in it and it has very high quality assets, they can generate full interiors and ist even not finished.

Game from 2015 with 40 players, alot of desctruction and physics and UHD/60fps
https://flic.kr/s/aHskBAans7

I dont care about Mirrors Edge even Battlefield 1 and BATTLEFRONT II have some major issues compared to BATTLEFRONT 2015.

PlayStation games are hold back by a tablet level CPU and 5GB RAM.



I am not that often in interiors in Wildands but I can look for a real gameplay picture instead.

Some of those GoW textures look low res and it reminds me of AC: Origins. The Division is much better.
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I don't care if it's a PC or console game, no matter how beautiful a game might be... there will always be some ugly or low resolution texture(s) present somewhere in the game. And if gamers are honest with themselves, no matter which screenshots are taken, usually the most gorgeous ones are uploaded, not the mediocre or unflattering ones. Games like Far Cry 5, Assassin's Creed Origins, Division, God of War, Horizon Zero Dawn, Uncharted and even Starship Citizen, will have their unflattering graphic moments or issues. It's the overall package that counts. And for now, IMHO, God of War is wearing the crown for overall graphic presentation - not for perfection.
 
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What makes GoW new in terms of graphics? A new pioneer must have some graphic effects etc. to stand out from the crowd.
 
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Jupiter said:
Reminds my of this despite the fact that this area is much much bigger bigger, one can fly in it and it has very high quality assets, they can generate full interiors and ist even not finished.


Assets are not that bad but lets hype Ratched and Clank with ist angular assets instead
https://flic.kr/s/aHskTrYGDj

Game from 2015 with 40 players, alot of desctruction and physics and UHD/60fps
https://flic.kr/s/aHskBAans7

I dont care about Mirrors Edge even Battlefield 1 and BATTLEFRONT II have some major issues (negative texture LOD) compared to BATTLEFRONT 2015.

PlayStation games are hold back by a tablet level CPU and 5GB RAM.

BATTLEFRONT has ok characters since there are a lot on the screen and one hardly sees them from the near in the fight anyway. Just look after Uncharted 4s multiplayer models for a comparison.



I am not that often in interiors in Wildands but I can look for a real gameplay picture instead.

Some of those GoW textures look low res and it reminds me of AC: Origins. The Division is much better.


Star Citizen is the biggest game and it has by far the assets with the highest quality.
https://flic.kr/s/aHsmec5ogC
https://flic.kr/p/23uRE1o

This does not necessarily correlate.
Click to expand...
So you're basically condensing Battlefront, Wildlands, AC Origin, The Division and now Star Citizen into one mega game to pit against one single GoW while totally ignoring their weaknesses? Wonderful:). I think this only proves how much ahead Gow is than each single one of them if compared separately. I wonder what you gonna add in next, Watch Dogs 2?
You do realize Digitalfoundry along with 99% of reviewers didn't commend Gow for raising the bar on real time graphics out of thin air right?
 
Jupiter said:
What makes GoW new in Terms of graphics? A new pioneer must have some graphic effects etc. to stand out from the crowd.
Click to expand...

Graphic wise, it really doesn't need anything new or innovative on making it a splash amongest gamers and gaming media critics. It's the overall presentation and delivery of the game that makes it innovative within itself. Graphically GOW is super impressive... not just because of one or two graphical points/features, but more so, how everything blends together (gorgeously) within the world being conveyed.

That being said, the 'offline graphics look' of Kratos and cast, are quite gorgeous... but for me, it's the overall presentation that matters the most.
 
Jupiter said:
What makes GoW new in Terms of graphics? A new pioneer must have some graphic effects etc. to stand out from the crowd.
Click to expand...
Look at it this way, you give real time raytracing or whatever to Quake 2, will not make it the best looking game by a long shot. Of course adding new techniques is always a plus but look at what you sacrifice in return? Gow for the record does use a lot of cutting edge and expensive techniques such as Voxel grid based volumetric lighting, fog, realtime GI, gpu particle, tessellation, SSR, SSS, I can't think of a single other game that's released uses all that at once. What's more is those are just the icing on the cake, the real meat is the tremendous amount of high quality art work, both techniquely and artistically that's populated all over the world. Something that can only be afforded by great talent, budget and perhaps focusing on one platform. It's the usage of everything that's combined that elevates it to the top. Such a simple logic to see man, come on.
 
Jupiter said:
Reminds my of this despite the fact that this area is much much bigger bigger, one can fly in it and it has very high quality assets, they can generate full interiors and ist even not finished.


Assets are not that bad but lets say Ratched and Clank with its angular assets is the game with the best graphics instead
https://flic.kr/s/aHskTrYGDj

Game from 2015 with 40 players, alot of desctruction and physics on Endor and UHD/60fps.
https://flic.kr/s/aHskBAans7

I dont care about Mirrors Edge even Battlefield 1 and BATTLEFRONT II have some major issues (negative texture LOD) compared to BATTLEFRONT 2015. Battlefield 1 also has an annoying sharpening filter.

PlayStation games are also hold back by a tablet level CPU and 5GB RAM. The PC version of Wildlands has little in common with the Xbox One version. This looks like a generation gap.

BATTLEFRONT has ok characters since there are a lot of them on the screen and one hardly sees them from the near in the fight anyway. Just look after Uncharted 4s multiplayer models for a comparison.



I am not that often in interiors in Wildands but I can look for a real gameplay picture instead. Of course these will not look greatly filled but they have an unimportant role anyway.

Some of those GoW textures look low res and it reminds me of AC: Origins. The Division is much better.

Star Citizen is the biggest game and it has by far the assets with the highest quality.
https://flic.kr/s/aHsmec5ogC
https://flic.kr/p/23uRE1o

Huge game and low asset quality does not necessarily correlate. I doubt that objects can be found in that size that look better.



Technically it looks better than Uncharted 4. Let's see when it comes. Some think that it is close to Death Stranding but I think TLoU will appear much earlier.
Click to expand...

For Star Citizen we will probably compare it to PS5 game if they not release next year...
 
ultragpu said:
Look at it this way, you give real time raytracing or whatever to Quake 2, will not make it the best looking game by a long shot. Of course adding new techniques is always a plus but look at what you sacrifice in return? Gow for the record does use a lot of cutting edge and expensive techniques such as Voxel grid based volumetric lighting, fog, realtime GI, gpu particle, tessellation, SSR, SSS, I can't think of a single other game that's released uses all that at once. What's more is those are just the icing on the cake, the real meat is the tremendous amount of high quality art work, both techniquely and artistically that's populated all over the world. Something that can only be afforded by great talent, budget and perhaps focusing on one platform. It's the usage of everything that's combined that elevates it to the top. Such a simple logic to see man, come on.
Click to expand...

It's a good looking game for sure. Are you sure it uses realtime GI? Never seen anything mentioning it does. Could you post a link for this? Also the reflections aren't really strong the game mostly uses pre baked cube maps. There's only a few rare instances using ssr. Games like Division, ROTTR, battlefront uses many techniques like you mention in their engine
 
Jupiter said:
Assets are not that bad but lets say Ratched and Clank with its angular assets is the game with the best graphics instead
Click to expand...

Ratchet and Clank has much better assets than Wildlands... :

33185317051_f9f4637213_o.png


3neTs85.png


Honestly, why do you try to argue against obvious things ? For instance, nobody here tries to say that HZD has a better draw distance than Wildlands... everything is coherent with the art style in Ratchet & Clank. They aimed for realism in Wildlands, but the game still looks gamey as hell.

What makes GoW new in Terms of graphics? A new pioneer must have some graphic effects etc. to stand out from the crowd.
Click to expand...

This argument is pure fallacy... :

1) You judge a game on the overall result and not on some fancy techs. Also, this is factually false. For instance, there is not a single loading time in God of War and not a single camera cut. This is something never seen in any other game.

2) You basically mean that there are no differences between these 2 pictures just because both used the same tech = painting :

12_jbhc7.jpg


Peinture3.jpg
 
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The assets are by no means better in Ratched and Clank. In Wildlands the barrels are rounded while in Ratched and Clank the barrels are squared due to polygon poverty. And this is not an art style because then the surface would have been adapted to make the properties appear relatively realistic. Wildlands definitely has higher resolution textures and more polygons per object. I have not said that Wildlands has the best assets but the textures are good in comparison to most other open world games with non urban environment.

assets-jpg.2542


Shortbread said:
Graphic wise, it really doesn't need anything new or innovative on making it a splash amongest gamers and gaming media critics. It's the overall presentation and delivery of the game that makes it innovative within itself. Graphically GOW is super impressive... not just because of one or two graphical points/features, but more so, how everything blends together (gorgeously) within the world being conveyed.

That being said, the 'offline graphics look' of Kratos and cast, are quite gorgeous... but for me, it's the overall presentation that matters the most.
Click to expand...

There are already graphically consistent video games like BATTLEFRONT 2015, The Division and Horizon Zero Dawn (Unfortunately, reflections and water don't look good here) with modern effects. To stand out from such titles God of War would have to do something new. For example while The Division is the only dense open world urban space where every "squaremeter" is hand crafted and filled with objects (in addition, it has hybrid raytracing shadows) and BATTLEFRONT as the first AAA multiplayer game had extremely dense forest, a lot of destruction and film-like battles, hyper realistic materials, a lot of particle shadows etc. with a very good performance I see nothing that new in GoW so far. The other games are more than two to two and a half years older. Of course GoW looks very good but what makes it really new. There are also compromises in performance, reflections, shadows, LODs, AO etc. By the way, Alien is Isolation from 2014 and also has some very good graphical features but here the low resolution textures annoy me the most.

ultragpu said:
So you're basically condensing Battlefront, Wildlands, AC Origin, The Division and now Star Citizen into one mega game to pit against one single GoW while totally ignoring their weaknesses? Wonderful:). I think this only proves how much ahead Gow is than each single one of them if compared separately. I wonder what you gonna add in next, Watch Dogs 2?
You do realize Digitalfoundry along with 99% of reviewers didn't commend Gow for raising the bar on real time graphics out of thin air right?
Click to expand...

I don't need AC: Origin. That looks good but the textures are too bad for me and it could use more tessellation. If I would highlight published PC games it would be BATTLEFRONT 2015, The Division and Wildlands. From all of these The Division has the least technical weaknesses and the most advanced engine. In addition, I think it is the costliest video game so far when every corner must be filled by hand and everything looks unique. Let's see what the successor will look like and they are also developing an Avater game.

Did DF really say that and why should it be the best looking game according to all these people?
 
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Jupiter said:
The assets are by no means better in Ratched and Clank. In Wildlands the barrels are rounded while in Ratched and Clank the barrels are squared due to polygon poverty.
Click to expand...

Ratchet & Clank looks like a Pixar movie while Wildlands looks like another standard video game. Even in your selective picture, i see better textures, shaders and lighting than in Wildlands.

I have not said that Wildlands has the best assets but the textures are good in comparison to most other open world games with non urban environment.
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It's false. You don't know what are good assets :

dan-doherty-shadowofthecolossus-07.jpg


HZD and SOTC have the best possible assets in an open world. The division comes after these 2 games.

To stand out from such titles God of War would have to do something new.
Click to expand...

This doesn't make any sense... by your reasoning, if God of War didn't make anything new compared to Tetris, then it would be as impressive as Tetris. It doesn't matter if it can output a serpent as big as a moutain, has the best in-game model ever created, etc.

VLsJj5s.png
 
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The Division does have some really nice environment detail and nice lighting engine but it pretty much stops there. Character models look utterly horrendous and some of the textures are very inconsistent.
2995358-7233747987-the-d.jpg

maxresdefault.jpg

Ubi really needs to step up their character rendering, it's a huge part of the visual presentation in conjunction with the story and player experience.
There is absolutely nothing as impressive as this from The Division, period.
god-of-war-review-251aptd.png
 
"GoW looks worse than BATTLEFRONT from 2015, period." ;) You won't get far with such simple phrases. Where are the unique effects, assets etc. that would make it stand out? It also has many pop ups, low res SSR and shadow problems The Division doesn't have.

The Division (1) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr
The Division (2) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr
The Division (10) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

Even at such a distance on the other floor small bottles etc. on these descs are still rendered and I could shoot them away.
Tom Clancy's The Division™2016-5-5-14-58-17 by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

I dont see a huge problem with characters for such a multiplayer game and unlike GoW it has thousands of clothes which can be combined in different ways.
Clothing.jpg


Recop said:
Ratchet & Clank looks like a Pixar movie while Wildlands looks like another standard video game. Even in your selective picture, i see better textures, shaders and lighting than in Wildlands.



It's false. You don't know what are good assets :

dan-doherty-shadowofthecolossus-07.jpg


HZD and SOTC have the best possible assets in an open world. The division comes after these 2 games.

This doesn't make any sense... by your reasoning, if God of War didn't make anything new compared to Tetris, then it would be as impressive as Tetris. It doesn't matter if it can output a serpent as big as a moutain, has the best in-game model ever created, etc.
Click to expand...

This small room has more unique assets than the whole landscape from your Shadow of the Colossus screenshot. The Contact Shadows also have a very good quality were every object seems grounded even though I could shoot them away..
The Division (6) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr
 
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Jupiter said:
Where are the unique effects, assets etc. that would make it stand out?
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You continue with this sentence, but it doesn't make any sense. My english level is rather low so i'm not certain that people always understand what i'm saying.

Basically, you mean that if 2 games use the same engine, then one can't be more impressive than the other. Moreover, you contradict yourself with Battlefront 1 vs Battlefront 2... same engine, exactly the same tech, yet you keep saying that Battlefront 1 is the most impressive game.

Also, there are no fancy words for very detailed textures, very high poly models, gigantic scale, etc.

Yet, without an excellent tech, you can't obtain this kind of result.

This small room has more unique assets than the whole landscape from your Shadow of the Colossus screenshot.
Click to expand...

Ultragpu is right on character modeling though : it doesn't look impressive in The Division.

But i agree, it's a very good looking game with very good asset quality. And yes, SOTC has low asset variety, but the quality is really high and very consistent :

1518077671-shadow-of-the-colossus-tm-20180208082620.png


40257944011_c95f950b67_o.png


We are very far from that lol : https://www.gamersyde.com/hqstream_tom_clancy_s_ghost_recon_wildlands_pc_mission_coop-39333_fr.html
 
I never said the characters were first class. The ones from The Division are fine for such a title.

The rocks look better in Shadow of the Colossus but the trees don't necessarily.

Ghost Recon Wildlands (4) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr
Ghost Recon Wildlands (5) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr
Ghost Recon Wildands a by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr
Ghost Recon Wildlands (12) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

Moreover, even at a distance trees still have a relatively fine silhouette at ultra settings although there is no open world AAA game that can display nearly as many trees.
Trees.jpg


Not perfect either
Trees_2.jpg
 
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Speaking of Division's Snowdrop engine, loading up Mario Rabbid on the Switch the other day, I noticed it's using the Snowdrop engine. Going from Division, was certainly a big difference in the engine use lol. Not hating on anything, was just amusing seeing the contrast.
 
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