Security paradigm

[Tap In]

The argument is that MS can detect the hack and potentially ban the console.
They have yet to actually do this AFAIK, but the hack is certainly detectable.

maybe we spoke too soon....

Frivolous lawsuit against MS

Some reports on the Internet have speculated that Microsoft purposefully tailored the fall update to lock up Xbox 360s that had been modified to play illigitimate content not intended for use on the console. There’s no conclusive evidence that this is the case, and Kabateck said that Ray’s console was not modified.

go get those modders and pirates MS!

 

[baten]

maybe we spoke too soon....

Frivolous lawsuit against MS




go get those modders and pirates MS!

There is a very interesting point that this lawyer makes on the last two paragraphs - that modding it's not illegal by itself, and that MS should not be allowed to ban the modded consoles i.e "take the law into it's own hands". I'm not sure if I agree - though.

I think that the fact that PS1 and PS2 were so easyly piratable (you dont even need a chip to play pirated games, there is a thing called SwapMagic that you can use and you dont even open the console) has a lot of bearing in the huge installed numbers of these consoles. Of course, xbox1 was also piratable, but there were not that many popular games as for the playstations.

So - if the PS3 is not piratable and 360 (already) is - would it hurt PS3 sales in the long run? It might happen - and although it's not exactly what MS would like, they would be happy to grow their installed number even like that - whith the hope that even pirates buy a game or two from time to time.

However, a "secure" PS3 might be very appealing for publishers and developers. If PS3 stays secure for 4-5 years or longer, it's my thinking we will see publishers go for PS3 as their main platform, and sometimes not even bothering to release ports to 360, since they can be played as copies. Seen as PS3 supports mouse and keyboad (that might even come with the console in the future) - it's not unthinkable that even FPS and RTS games from the PC will move into the PS3 camp - as PC is even more piratable.

There were no "secure" gaming platform until now - and I wonder how this (if it pans out like in my assumption) will change the gaming scene.

 

[dobwal]

There is a very interesting point that this lawyer makes on the last two paragraphs - that modding it's not illegal by itself, and that MS should not be allowed to ban the modded consoles i.e "take the law into it's own hands". I'm not sure if I agree - though.

He said MS doesn't have the right to brick your modded Xbox not ban it. I agree with him, just becaused I modded it doesn't mean MS has the right to kill my console.

Unless you generate profit off the hardware, increasing marketshare by have your console more pirateable just eats a hole in your pocket. Easy to pirate popular console sold at a loss = huge money pit.

 

[baten]

Unless you generate profit off the hardware, increasing marketshare by have your console more pirateable just eats a hole in your pocket. Easy to pirate popular console sold at a loss = huge money pit.

I agree that it's not ideal for MS to sell 360 only to have them pirated - but in the end, they will get systems out to consumers (even if they are pirates), which is what they most need right now. I think they would be happier with 60 mil 360 sold partially to pirates than with 30 mil "secure" ones (I'm just making up these numbers). And let's not forget, MS seems to have reached breaking-even cost point with 360, so they dont loose that much (neither is Sony with a 129$ PS2).

The ones "loosing" money are the publishers - although it's not sure how much money - since pirates would not have bought the games anyway. Some people use piracy to screen the games to see if they like them or not, and sometimes they buy the games they like most - I think downloadeble game demos will solve this problem for a good portion of pirates.

 

[pipo]

Looking purely at the results of their efforts - roughly 4 months for someone to run a copied version of games - I would say its hard to draw any conclusions .

There has been zero progress since. And hackers even have dev kits...

I don't think the security of the platform will be a problem.

 

[crazygambit]

There has been zero progress since. And hackers even have dev kits...

I don't think the security of the platform will be a problem.

Why would there be a need for more progress? From what I understand security was already compromised i.e. people are playing backups right now and MS can't stop them (at least those playing offline). Or maybe they found a way to stop them I don't know about? Care to elaborate?

 

[pipo]

It's been said before.

The security (topic title) of the 360 platform (running unsigned code / being able to hack Live) has nothing to do with the mod that ables you to run a (controlled / signed) backup.

Watch how they will fix that with a new hardware revision by the way.

 

[crazygambit]

What will happen if PS3 security is so good that it is un-piratable? Will it be good or bad for Sony in the long run? Will it change the perception of developers/publishers as to bring games primarily/only for PS3?

From the OP it took this thread to be clearly about piracy. And like I said before what good is it for your console to be "secure" when people can play pirated copies? (Which is pretty much the most important thing your security should prevent). Also I'm not sure how they'll stop it in future hardware revisions. Usually once a hole appears it's really hard to close down. Just look at all the other consoles, specificaly the PSP. Maybe the latest hardware revisions are safe, but piracy is still rampant, and the holes found in previous firmwares make attacks much easier to execute. So even if MS find a way to fix the issue still around 10 million consoles are compromised which I'm willing to bet is not gonna be a small part of the total number sold in its lifetime.