Sony has not being losing money on each PS3 sold for a few years.
PS3 cost discussion *spin-off
- Thread starter TheD
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Sony has not being losing money on each PS3 sold for a few years.
That statement just doesn't hold up, as 'a few years' is back when PS3 launched. Are you saying it was never sold at a loss?!
http://www.totalvideogames.com/PlayStation-3/news/PS3-Manufacturing-Costs-Reduced-By-70-14439.html
Few as in just under two.
Sony would have to be morons not to have got the cost to make them less than the price they sell them at by now, seeing how old tech the thing is.
And then we have the fact that where I live (in Austraila) sony wants $700 AUD/ $538 USD for one, at that price you can get a far faster gaming PC, so there is no way in hell that they are being sold for a loss (at least here).
What in the world would make the PS3 be sold at a loss at this time anyway?
I can't be the blu ray drive (even full blu ray players are very cheap now).
Cell should not cost that much to make, based on the fact that it does not have a huge amount of transistors (around 200mil) and that it is made on 65nm.
RSX also does not have a huge amount of transistors (300ish mil) and it is also made on 65nm.
The Mainboard does not seem to be costing a huge amount.
Case?
It would be if they kept the price the same. I'm thinking the average loss per unit will remain, the slim will just allow them to up volumes by lowering the pricepoint. The Slim's not going to magically and instantly reduce cost by $150 or so, which is what they'd need to do to both lower the price $100 and turn a profit.
Silent_Buddha
Legend
Sure but then you have them selling in the EU (a much larger market) for even less than the price in the US. And most consider the price in the US to be undercutting manufacturing costs.
There isn't a single credible source that believes the current PS3 is not a loss leader. Especially when Sony themselves have hinted many times that they are still selling the PS3 at a loss.
The slim should get the cost under the current MSRP, however, if Sony reduces the price of the slim (from current) then they will once again be using it as a loss leader.
Regards,
SB
That's to say we know the manufacturing cost of the slim. Sony has stated that it (manufacturing cost) has been reduced by 70% I believe. I assume they were speaking of the manufacturing costs in yen and I assume they were speaking in regards to their new manufacturing reductions aka the slim.
Simply saying "X" part does not cost that much to make without providing the actual cost it does take to make or include it is pointless.
Regarding the cost of the product in various regions, I am in the US, isn't the import of the product taxed? Therefore, Sony passes that cost to the consumer? To determine what they truly make on that product you can't us your cost to an assumed cost of the product. You will have to convert that cost to what they get before declaring if they are making money on it or not. Meaning, you need to deal with everything in Yen. If it costs $500 to make and they sell it for $400 in US and $550 elsewhere, they are not making it at a profit.
I am not a numbers person, and I don't think that ^ made any sense :smile:
Asher said:
I am not sure you can say the slim will reduce cost by $150 but we are still working off assumptions of what the true manufacturing costs of the unit is. If the Slim exists then that means Sony has sought to reduce manufacturing costs by reducing elements used by the console, shrinking/consolidating parts, and using cheaper materials. It has already been discussed that a smaller cell chip would be introduced this year and the cost savings could be passed on.
Are you saying that overall steps to shrink the size of the console and use cheaper parts will keep production costs the same therefore allowing them to continue the same loss per unit? If so, what exactly is the point of this "new" console?
The cost in store is more than just the BOM. Smaller boxers means cheaper transport and storage. Oneda in the above interview seems to be talking about reducing producing a PS3 unit by 70% (which I also take to be the Slim version not out yet) which doesn't reflect on the final cost in getting it to retail.
Without hard figures for manufacturing costs, we're all really guessing when PS3 broke/breaks even. But I'd like to present to TheD Sony's financials for the past few years. PSP is profitable hardware. PS2 is profitable hardware. So if PS3 is also profitable hardware, how the hell are they losing so much money?!
Without hard figures for manufacturing costs, we're all really guessing when PS3 broke/breaks even. But I'd like to present to TheD Sony's financials for the past few years. PSP is profitable hardware. PS2 is profitable hardware. So if PS3 is also profitable hardware, how the hell are they losing so much money?!
The cost in store is more than just the BOM. Smaller boxers means cheaper transport and storage. Oneda in the above interview seems to be talking about reducing producing a PS3 unit by 70% (which I also take to be the Slim version not out yet) which doesn't reflect on the final cost in getting it to retail.
Without hard figures for manufacturing costs, we're all really guessing when PS3 broke/breaks even. But I'd like to present to TheD Sony's financials for the past few years. PSP is profitable hardware. PS2 is profitable hardware. So if PS3 is also profitable hardware, how the hell are they losing so much money?!
Well… and we don't really known that Oneda talk with "reducing producing a PS3 unit by 70%"…
It's the global manufacturing cost: hardware (CELL, RSX, Blu-ray, etc)+ manufacturing.
Only the manufacturing?
And for the profitable PS3,if they won something actually by unit with the amont of investments they made for PS3, they're not in green with PS3…
This is totally untrue. Europe is a totally heterogenous market, there are different prices in different countries and those Australian prices are actually cheaper than what you may find in certain European countries.
The US is by far the largest homogenous market where you have been able to buy consoles cheap for years. But there maybe several reasons for this, such as more efficient marketing, cheaper distribution etc. etc. Looking at the BOM and local price points may be very missleading, just as some people are ignoring the fact that some markets include the VAT in the recommended retail price.
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Johnny_Physics
Newcomer
Deducting sales tax just to compare sticker prices, europe isn't very far from the US in cost ownership.
TheWretched
Regular
In Germany, we have 19% tax, that makes 335€ per console without tax, which is converted 471USD... this is NOT "not very far from the US". This is nearly 20% more considering only the MSRP.
Johnny_Physics
Newcomer
Average prices, average prices...
What average prices? Do you have some?
Johnny_Physics
Newcomer
Yeah they try to keep the price 39-something across the Europe which nudges the prices a bit, so some dollars here or there is pocketed or sacrificed to mandate that price.
$399 €399 3999NOK 3999SEK 3999DK and the odd one out £299.
The final price in dollars will of course jump up or down between these currencies, with results like the Swedish PS3(3999) being cheaper than the American if you discount the sales tax, while the Norwegian PS3(also 3999 locally) will come out more expensive.
$399 €399 3999NOK 3999SEK 3999DK and the odd one out £299.
The final price in dollars will of course jump up or down between these currencies, with results like the Swedish PS3(3999) being cheaper than the American if you discount the sales tax, while the Norwegian PS3(also 3999 locally) will come out more expensive.
My calculation does not match yours.
Swedish PS3 price (3999 SEK) includes the 25% VAT -> 3200 SEK without the VAT -> $440
Mind you the price of the PS3 has slowly trickled down but was about 4500 SEK from the start when the 399 Euro price was established, not to mention that the Swedish currency has taken a dive similar to the pound which also skews any comparison.
The price found on price matching sites are now on many places around 3900 SEK, but I can tell you that as late as yesterday I walked past the games department in a supermarket here and saw a PS3 bundled with Singstar for 4495 SEK and that was labled as a special offer. Media Markt may have some nice offers, but they are very irregular and the their shops are very few here in Sweden so using them as some base line would be totally irrelevant. Talk about average prices should be bundled with some salt unless there are some hard data about the volumes to support them IMO.
Johnny_Physics
Newcomer
My mistake, I did the quick and dirty "3/4 of the price equals price without sales tax" which made it 33% instead.
But to contribute something, two countries sharing a border, one is part of the EU and one is not.
PS3
3,999 Norwegian Kroner = 4,741.79 Swedish Krona OR 658.610 US Dollar
3,999 Swedish Krona = 3,372.56 Norwegian Kroner OR 555.930 US Dollar
Xbox Elite:
2,590 Norwegian Kroner = 3,071.08 Swedish Krona OR 426.557 US Dollar
2,995 Swedish Krona = 2,525.84 Norwegian Kroner OR 416.357 US Dollar
Very very close.
And the same for the basic Wii:
2,390 Norwegian Kroner = 2,833.93 Swedish Krona OR 393.618 US Dollar
2,649 Swedish Krona = 2,234.04 Norwegian Kroner OR 368.257 US Dollar
Ouch. Although I vaguely remember someone saying that Norway had an exclusive distributor of the PS3 who hiked the price, and so this isn't Sony pricing. But that needs confirmation; I may be babbling.