Official Nintendo Q1 (April-June) 2008 Financials Thread

[Carl B]

Here's the Nintendo first quarter results quick and dirty:


Revenues: 423.38B yen in Q1 08 vs 340.44B yen in Q1 07

Net Income: 107.27B yen in Q1 08 vs 80.25B yen in Q1 07



Hardware

Nintendo DS: 6.94 million units Q1 08 vs 6.98 million Q1 07

Nintendo Wii: 5.17 million units Q1 08 vs 3.43 million Q1 07


Software

Nintendo DS: 36.59 million in Q1 08 vs 34.26 million Q1 07

Nintendo Wii: 40.41 million in Q1 08 vs 15.98 million Q1 07


http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/pdf/2008/080730e.pdf

 

[Richard]

Carl, no analysis, not even a general remark? That's almost pornographic man.

Anyway, a higher ratio of software sales versus hardware. How does that mesh with the often used argument that people only buy the Wii for Wii Play?

 

[Carl B]

What analysis is needed? It's just a post to get the info out, following the same structure of the Sony and Microsoft threads. If you want analysis though, here it is: Nintendo is making a lot of money.

Anyway, a higher ratio of software sales versus hardware. How does that mesh with the often used argument that people only buy the Wii for Wii Play?

People like to toss out whatever arguments against the Wii seemingly just because they are contemptuous of the system. But for this particular quarter, I think that both Mario Kart and Wii Fit would have been large software sales drivers above and beyond the norm... probably some Super Smash Bros Brawl in there as well. I think it's also just the collective strength of a years console accumulation on the market beginning to flex its muscle. It'd be interesting to know how many of those software unit sales are virtual console titles as well.

 

[Freak'n Big Panda]

holy shit 5 million units in one quarter... sony or ms would only dream about numbers like this. What consumers see in this console is totally beyond me, I hope eventually it dies but at this rate it probably wont. Maybe we'll actually see some half decent games now that the 1:1 motion mapping device is on the table, but it's unfortunate that it's gimped with shit hardware.

 

[fearsomepirate]

I hope eventually it dies but at this rate it probably wont.

Only two things are certain for consoles: death and shovelware.

Maybe we'll actually see some half decent games

Not as long as publishers look at genuinely serious effort like the Conduit and say that they would prefer to "crap out" something sub-par in time for Christmas (according to one of High Voltage's employees, that's what a publisher literally said to them).

 

[Zaphod]

Define "shovelware", "sub-par", or whatever kids... There seems to be only one analysis needed regarding how Nintendo and their two main products (including software and peripherals) are doing:

They print money.

FFS, Nintendo is worth twice as much as Sony these days. As for people like "us", why should they really care? Any attempt to cater exclusively to the "hardcore" crowd is doomed to fail. Yet, as far as I can tell, there are enough games around with somewhat of a "gamer appeal" to make it obvious that such products are worthwhile on both the Wii and the DS.

They'll just never be the primary focus. And that's OK because, unless there are mad advancements in motion control, the competitors are situated to cater to those niches better. If it's not for us we should move on and ignore it. Just like people did Britney Spears and countless boy bands when it came to music. But unlike those examples, the Nintendo stuff might expand the marketplace and innovate in ways that'll influence their medium for years to come.

Bottom line: They might not yet be what we'd prefer, but they're on to something and they print money.

 

[ShaidarHaran]

The Wii has no gamer appeal. Not a one of my many gamer friends has any interest in this console personally, other than for their kids.

 

[obonicus]

The Wii isn't the DS. The DS is much more proven and has a wide variety of non-Nintendo games that even the 'hardcore' appreciate. The Wii is the one people are on the fence about, and the Wii is the one Nintendo is marketing more aggressively to casuals. (Perhaps because everyone already has a DS.)

 

[Carl B]

People need to start understanding that "gamer" isn't a word that means anything in and of itself, and should it mean something, it would mean simply one that plays games.

There are plenty of 'gamers' that are drawn to the Wii. That people can't seem to accept that the Wii has appeal to a broader population that they themselves seem to pigeonhole themselves into is something I have trouble cognitizing. I don't own a Wii myself, but nor do I have any sort of malice towards it or need to separate myself from 'lesser' folk that do. It's a system that plays games, and truth be told I've had a lot of fun playing a number of those games. Why is there such resentment towards a console that if anything, has been a godsend to the image (and popularity) of game systems?

 

[zed]

FFS, Nintendo is worth twice as much as Sony these days.

u might wanna go and recheck your figures,
nintendo is no where near sony WRT assets,revenue etc
the only one theyre close to is profit, though even there, sony made ~a billion $ more than nintendo last year.
Im not disputing nintendo are raking in the cash with the DS+wii

 

[Carl B]

Zaphod is talking market capitalization, which is what 'worth' refers to.

 

[obonicus]

People need to start understanding that "gamer" isn't a word that means anything in and of itself, and should it mean something, it would mean simply one that plays games.

There are plenty of 'gamers' that are drawn to the Wii. That people can't seem to accept that the Wii has appeal to a broader population that they themselves seem to pigeonhole themselves into is something I have trouble cognitizing. I don't own a Wii myself, but nor do I have any sort of malice towards it or need to separate myself from 'lesser' folk that do. It's a system that plays games, and truth be told I've had a lot of fun playing a number of those games. Why is there such resentment towards a console that if anything, has been a godsend to the image (and popularity) of game systems?

It's not new, honestly. It's the same reason why NMA folks hate the idea of Fallout 3. Or why SNES gamers resent the playstation generation. Or why playstation gamers resent the 360 generation. They see their hobby being changed in ways they don't particularly like.

The big fear of the Wii, at least as I see it, is if Sony and Microsoft decide to 'pull a Wii' next-gen and release incremental upgrades to their existing systems. Besides the technological standpoint, which offends mostly those who moved to consoles from PC gaming, there's the targetting standpoint: what if Sony and Microsoft start to focus their efforts on trying to attract the casual market, like Nintendo is perceived as doing?

I have nothing against the Wii myself, though I'm not interested in it. I am one of those who feels the Wii's lineup of games for the traditional gamer is somewhat bleak. It looks better in Japan, of course, though not by much. In contrast, I think the DS hit a much wider audience already, but the DS' lineup is incredibly rich (even if not graphically complex), so I hope that if the future of gaming is gonna look like a Nintendo system, that it look like the DS.

 

[ShaidarHaran]

People need to start understanding that "gamer" isn't a word that means anything in and of itself, and should it mean something, it would mean simply one that plays games.

There are plenty of 'gamers' that are drawn to the Wii. That people can't seem to accept that the Wii has appeal to a broader population that they themselves seem to pigeonhole themselves into is something I have trouble cognitizing. I don't own a Wii myself, but nor do I have any sort of malice towards it or need to separate myself from 'lesser' folk that do. It's a system that plays games, and truth be told I've had a lot of fun playing a number of those games. Why is there such resentment towards a console that if anything, has been a godsend to the image (and popularity) of game systems?

Gamer = person that plays games with a competitive spirit. Usually these are youngish males, but no doubt there are people in every category that fit this description.

I don't expect everyone to agree with me, this is just my opinion. Not trying to start anything, I just don't believe the Wii is conducive to competitive gaming.

 

[Carl B]

Shaider I wasn't speaking to you directly to tell you the truth, even if it seemed like it. If anything, it's Panda's post that I find to be overtly hostile to the Wii in this thread if there is one (and no, disclaiming in your sig doesn't make it ok).

I don't see how the complexity of the game effects the competitive aspect though; lord knows I've gotten super competitive playing Wii Tennis with people.

It's not new, honestly. It's the same reason why NMA folks hate the idea of Fallout 3. Or why SNES gamers resent the playstation generation. Or why playstation gamers resent the 360 generation. They see their hobby being changed in ways they don't particularly like.

I think that's just called faboyism; people begin to associate themselves with certain products, goods, or communities, and suddenly they view the space as zero-sum. I was a Nintendo man before Playstation launched, and was against Sony's efforts until FFVII made the jump. Well, years later, Sega down, Microsoft in, I have a much more pragmatic and accepting view of it all. If I'm anti-anything these days, I'm anti-fanboyism.

The big fear of the Wii, at least as I see it, is if Sony and Microsoft decide to 'pull a Wii' next-gen and release incremental upgrades to their existing systems. Besides the technological standpoint, which offends mostly those who moved to consoles from PC gaming, there's the targetting standpoint: what if Sony and Microsoft start to focus their efforts on trying to attract the casual market, like Nintendo is perceived as doing?

Here, I think there is in fact a unique and potentially paradigm-shifting element. But personally I think it likely that Sony and Microsoft will consider it less to do with Nintendo's relative success and more to do with their own bruises incurred from losses on expensive hardware. I don't think such scaling-back extremes will come to pass though; the GTA's and Gears of War of the world are too profitable in their own right to ever drop off the map, and I think Sony and Microsoft know that it's better simply to better manage their next gen efforts in the space they currently operate in than to try and compete with Nintendo on theirs.

 

[obonicus]

I think that's just called faboyism; people begin to associate themselves with certain products, goods, or communities, and suddenly they view the space as zero-sum. I was a Nintendo man before Playstation launched, and was against Sony's efforts until FFVII made the jump. Well, years later, Sega down, Microsoft in, I have a much more pragmatic and accepting view of it all. If I'm anti-anything these days, I'm anti-fanboyism.

I'm not defending it, I'm just saying it's not new to the Wii. I wouldn't characterize it as pure fanboyism; it's slightly different. MS/Sony hate is fanboyism. This is more like fear.

Here, I think there is in fact a unique and potentially paradigm-shifting element. But personally I think it likely that Sony and Microsoft will consider it less to do with Nintendo's relative success and more to do with their own bruises incurred from losses on expensive hardware. I don't think such scaling-back extremes will come to pass though; the GTA's and Gears of War of the world are too profitable in their own right to ever drop off the map, and I think Sony and Microsoft know that it's better simply to better manage their next gen efforts in the space they currently operate in than to try and compete with Nintendo on theirs.

First, a disclaimer: I'm not sure what will happen next-gen. I'm going to play devil's advocate, though.
I don't know if Nintendo is so unapproachable. They got hurt bad last generation and even their handheld domination might've been overcome by the PSP if everything had gone right for Sony. Certainly, nothing Nintendo is doing is magic, and business likes to believe that lightning strikes twice. And I really, really doubt that Sony/Microsoft will see Nintendo owning the brunt of the gaming market and resigning themselves to a niche, even if it's the largest niche. Microsoft certainly seems interested in going after the Wii's userbase, and I don't think there's any reason to believe that it will compete with Sony next-gen, rather than with Nintendo, just as Microsoft aggressively went after Sony this-gen. I also have serious doubts that these companies will continue to accept taking massive losses on console sales to deliver superior technology, not when they don't have to.

 

[Freak'n Big Panda]

Shaider I wasn't speaking to you directly to tell you the truth, even if it seemed like it. If anything, it's Panda's post that I find to be overtly hostile to the Wii in this thread if there is one (and no, disclaiming in your sig doesn't make it ok).

Well I'm stating my bias in my signature so anybody can just take my comments into perspective. And in that sense I think it does make it OK. But I suppose your the boss so I will refrain from making such comments from now on.

As unreasonable as it is I just feel like Nintendo's marketing really mislead people. Before the launch everyone thought it was going to revolutionize gaming, and that nintendo had it right with designing a new controller and that it was different, unique and bound to host countless original titles etc. What people didn't realize is that A. That the motion control (at least in wii form) doesn't automatically open up endless new approaches gameplay and B. the lack of powerful hardware will turn lots of dev studios away from making Wii games at all. It separated the market such that devs either had to pick between PC/360/PS3 or Wii.

Anyways I just feel that newbs would be far far better served playing ICO instead of Wii Sports and it's simply a shame that such shallow and uninteresting games caught the attention of the mainstream.

 

[Skrying]

That's the problem with bias though. You can't even think reasonably when you have it. You just simply state that everyone else has inferior taste and so what they like doesn't matter because it's bad. Where does that get you? It gets you nowhere at all. As a hardcore gamer (I can likely claim it more than you, or do you have a single game with over 4500 hours played as well?) I can find the joy in playing on a Wii and my favorite gaming device in the world has been my Nintendo DS since I got it last winter. I feel they offer something unique. As for the Xbox 360 and PS3... well I sold my Xbox 360 after about a month of owner ship, it was boring to say the least, I've been playing the same games for years now.

Then to bad hardware... I don't think hardware matters at all when it comes down to it. I had just as much fun with my NES, my SNES, my Saturn, my N64, my Gamecube, my DS, my PC as before. Though I must I don't think this generation has been as good but that's because very few games have been truly inspired pieces of art. But that's not the platform preventing such things but instead the developers themselves. The last game to make me go "wow" was Portal and that same game could have been created several years ago. Great talent and work make the console, the console does not make great work (though it can lift limits, we must simply hope they are taken advantage of).

 

[Freak'n Big Panda]

As a hardcore gamer (I can likely claim it more than you, or do you have a single game with over 4500 hours played as well?)

Fair enough! you do have me beat fair and square. Your opinions now officially matter.

I had just as much fun with my NES, my SNES, my Saturn, my N64, my Gamecube, my DS, my PC as before.

No playstation? N64 kid eh? Fuck them and their super mario shit. FF7 all the way baby! lmao

Though I must I don't think this generation has been as good but that's because very few games have been truly inspired pieces of art.

Yes I completely agree with this. I didn't know if it was just me (as my general interest in videogames has waned over the years) but it really does seem like devs are shying away from really pushing the envelope in this regard. I blame it on the ever increasing development costs.

Great talent and work make the console, the console does not make great work (though it can lift limits, we must simply hope they are taken advantage of).

Yep of course.

Well I have made an effort to erode my bias but it takes time and it's difficult given that I automatically filter out information that doesn't support it. But I suppose the fact that I have acknowledged it is a virtual death sentence given enough time.

 

[Carl B]

I'm not defending it, I'm just saying it's not new to the Wii. I wouldn't characterize it as pure fanboyism; it's slightly different. MS/Sony hate is fanboyism. This is more like fear.

Fanboyism is fanboyism no matter the motivator though - if the Wii was trailing the 360 and PS3 rather than the contrary, I would definitely expect to hear plenty of the same ridicule that is piled on the system right now. GameCube comes to mind quite readily in this instance.

It's simply that the context at present is one of bafflement and resentment rather than of superiority and mockery. If you want to explore the fear route that's alright with me, but personally I think it might pre-suppose more thought given to the matter than I think many 'haters' have put into it. Either way I've got to lump it under the larger 'fanboyism' umbrella, because with "fanboyism" what we're emphasizing is never so much an irrational attachment to a given thing so much as the negative reactions it causes one to have to everything that is somehow in opposition of that.

First, a disclaimer: I'm not sure what will happen next-gen. I'm going to play devil's advocate, though.
I don't know if Nintendo is so unapproachable. They got hurt bad last generation and even their handheld domination might've been overcome by the PSP if everything had gone right for Sony. Certainly, nothing Nintendo is doing is magic, and business likes to believe that lightning strikes twice. And I really, really doubt that Sony/Microsoft will see Nintendo owning the brunt of the gaming market and resigning themselves to a niche, even if it's the largest niche. Microsoft certainly seems interested in going after the Wii's userbase, and I don't think there's any reason to believe that it will compete with Sony next-gen, rather than with Nintendo, just as Microsoft aggressively went after Sony this-gen. I also have serious doubts that these companies will continue to accept taking massive losses on console sales to deliver superior technology, not when they don't have to.

My argument for why I think Microsoft and Sony will both pursue hardware that is at least a modicum more powerful than Nintendo's is the following: because if all three console makers release equivalent systems in the aftermath of this generation, I simply don't see how Nintendo doesn't make even greater strides. Remember that I'm not saying Microsoft and Sony are looking to abandon the casual gamer - on the contrary - I just think they wouldn't want to put themselves on a playing field where hardware ceases to be a differentiator whatsoever, and suddenly it's just up to marketing, first-party title appeal, and console relative install base. The console 'wars' are littered with dramatic reversals gen-to-gen, but given equal weighting across all categories, truly I think next gen more than most Nintendo would go in with a very strong advantage.

I believe that Sony and Microsoft will take much less expense-related risks in the next-gen as well (as posts of mine in the Next Gen Technology threads illustrate), but I do think that they will try to stay ahead of Nintendo, and to the extent they can, dance the tech-lead dance with each other as well.

 

[ninzel]

http://www.forbes.com/technology/20...l-cx_cm_0729consoles.html?feed=rss_technology

Speculation by Forbes on next gen consoles,with some input from devs.