nVidia's GPP program is just a legally enforced GITG from hell?

Discussion in 'Graphics and Semiconductor Industry' started by digitalwanderer, Mar 8, 2018.

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  1. ToTTenTranz

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    If they see it going that way, then when Intel launches their discrete graphics cards they probably won't use Asus/Gigabyte/MSI.
    They'll either sell the GPUs directly like they do with the CPUs and SSDs, or associate their cards with the AIBs that didn't join GPP.

    The AIBs signing on to GPP aren't only screwing over AMD. They're screwing over every IHV that attempts to enter the market in the future.

    It's not and the mods definitely didn't see it as such. The links clearly referred to another user's posts.
    Mentioning your 1000 word essay about Vega's launch price (a discussion of which I took absolutely no part in this thread, nor intend to) was a fact.
    I'll leave that fact as a reminder to how far the derailment has gone in this thread, but mods are free to edit it as they see fit.
     
  2. ToTTenTranz

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    I had two posts here that were just removed:

    1 - Mentioning the external gaming boxes from Gigabyte that had the AORUS brand scrapped from the RX580 version, together with Gigabyte's response to Computerbase when they asked about it.
    That post was built with proper links, images cloned to imgur, etc.

    2 - Mentioning MSI's statements about GPP on their official account.
    Also with proper links, images cloned to imgur, etc.



    What's going on?
     
  3. BRiT

    BRiT (╯°□°)╯
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    Previously nuked posts were moved into a bucket thread: Mining-vs-Gaming talk purged into it's own thread: https://forum.beyond3d.com/threads/mining-vs-gaming-products-or-something-spawn.60677/

    It could possibly include posts about product pricing and rebates and product strategy and whatever else that was previously off-topic.

    It's also possible that some posts which were replies to toxic posts were not moved and were taken down with the original toxic post.

    This thread was/is a real cluster and is close to being purged itself because the people involved are very passionate about their companies and everything just escalates beyond reason.
     
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  4. Grall

    Grall Invisible Member
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    These are the big three in the discrete components PC hardware market IIRC - or at least amongst the very top anyway. I think Intel would want to work with these companies in order to draw from their fanbase. Myself for example have always been an ASUS man - four of my five PC mobos I've bought have been ASUS, starting back in summer of 1997, and also own/ed a whole bunch of ASUS GPUs as well (8 total, including 2 warranty replacements.)

    Most GPUs sold are not reference model boards I would think (well, apart from certain Nvidia models; Titans specifically IIRC, where no 3rd party models exist.) Also, high-end GPU models tend to go with fancy coolers, shrouds, backplates, LED bling and so on - I don't think Intel has either the expertise or the will honestly to properly exploit that market segment. Also, why do all that R&D and reinvent the wheel one more time costing loads of money when ASUS, MSI and Gigabyte will all have ready-made cooler and board designs they could just strap onto an Intel ASIC with relatively little effort...? :p
     
  5. CSI PC

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    For some reason Gigabyte stopped using the exclusive Nvidia Xtreme series it seems midway in the Pascal launch cycle and was 1st GPUs into Aorus with many models following, while AMD was mostly been lumped into Gigabyte-AMD series since the 5xx onwards apart from the 4 models announced Apr 2017.
    They never bothered even putting Fury/FuryX or the Vegas in anything but Gigabyte-AMD series when G1 Gaming would had been available for Fury/Fury X and Aorus for Vega considering it has 4 top 5xx in it.

    Point is Gigabyte did not really understanding their own product strategy before GPP, and even less so since they signed up; a big negative to the GPP along with the associated overheads-complexity for partner it brings and other factors depending upon ones POV and feelings about it.

    Reference.
    When Nvidia GPUs switched from exlusive Xtreme series option to Aorus Jan'17: https://www.gigabyte.com/Press/News/1492
    4 RX500 AMD GPUs no indicator others planned announced as part of Aorus Apr'17: https://www.gigabyte.com/Press/News/1538 and https://www.gigabyte.com/Press/News/1540
    Bizarrely I cannot find any other official Gigabyte launch news for the 5xx GPUs they have for models below and outside of Aorus, but they do news even down to GTX1030
    Vega custom launch into Gigabyte-AMD series Dec 2017: https://www.gigabyte.com/Press/News/1585
    And again strangely only other official launch news for Vega back to initial launch with AMD back in Aug'17: https://www.gigabyte.com/Press/News/1571

    From what I can tell by their site.
     
    #165 CSI PC, Mar 23, 2018
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2018
  6. ToTTenTranz

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    Shameless copy from a post that ended up elsewhere:


    AIBs who signed up to GPP are now doing PR acrobatics around the issue, and the results are hilarious.
    https://www.computerbase.de/2018-03/gigabyte-gaming-box-rx-580/#update1

    The product called "RX 580 Gaming Box" is "not gamer focused". Get it?

    Here's the box with the RX580:

    [​IMG]

    And this is the box version with a GTX1070:

    [​IMG]





    I don't agree.
    That's not how marketing works, and marketing is the next most important factor for success after product quality/performance (some would argue foremost important, actually).
    Asus, MSI and Gigabyte own a sizeable share of the market and this new gaming sub-brand for AMD will be unknown, whereas nvidia cards will be dancing alone on the laurels of all the marketing time and money AIBs spent on making ROG/GamingX/AORUS known to the public.

    Blockbuster movies spend as much in marketing as they do on production. Same with AAA videogames from major publishers. Samsung spends billions marketing the Galaxy S line (attention here: not Samsung phones: the Galaxy S exclusively!). This means their marketing budget can actually outmatch the BoM for the sum of phones being sold.

    And when Asus sponsors major gaming events and gets youtube ads for gaming devices, they don't advertise "Asus". They advertise "ROG".
     
    #166 ToTTenTranz, Mar 27, 2018
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2018
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  7. CSI PC

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    Putting aside the stupidity of Gigabyte marketing and excuse for now how much weight can be put into the fact Gigabyte did not put the AMD 580 Gaming box into Aorus.
    As I provided earlier Gigabyte at launch explitictely mentioned 10 series Nvidia while also also explicitely mentioning 4 AMD 5xx GPUs, no mention of broad series like they did with Nvidia.
    Then there is the fact Gigabyte stopped the exclusive Nvidia Xtreme series and used the 10 series to launch 1st GPUs into Aorus.
    No other AMD GPUs has ever been added since those 4 to Aorus, while the GTX 10 series continued to be added.

    Separately and of note, the Nvidia GTX1080 Gaming Box was put into Aorus back in 2017: https://www.gigabyte.com/uk/Press/News/1576

    Where were people's criticisms when Gigabyte put both AMD's flagship Fury X and Vega into AMD-Gigabyte series rather than G1 Gaming (existed at time for Fiji and had AMD products from 4xx in it) or Aorus (Vega is more gaming flagship than 580).
    Point is Gigabyte has not been consistent with AMD nor seen it as an equal to Nvidia over last 4-5 years, reasons are many and will split opinions.

    Yes there should be criticisms about the GPP and also the excuses both Nvidia or partners come up with, but in context of product positioning and individual partners this unequal attitude for AMD goes back before GPP.
    If looking at specific products in a partner one should not ignore what partners were doing before GPP and only focus on it since Nvidia pushed the program - context being a specific partner/OEM with specific product positioning before/after GPP.
    Some partners the changes-impact could be large (thinking MSI if frzr no longer available in future on AMD products and Gaming/X removed from model names without replaced with something comparable), and others small (Gigabyte falls into this category due to their behaviour with AMD dGPU products and individual model naming still with Gaming) in context on impact for consumers.
    Please note this post is looking at a specific context/point on a subject raised with some postings rather than more broadly at the GPP.
     
  8. ToTTenTranz

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    All the weight in the world because the nvidia Aorus gaming boxes were announced back in 2017 and the RX580 gaming box was announced last week, just weeks after word on GPP came up.


    Even if you believe that, the favoritism now has an official widespread name and a known signed contract associated with it.
     
  9. CarstenS

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    CSI PC, Lightman and Malo like this.
  10. ToTTenTranz

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    Only Polaris cards, no Vega.

    Not exactly the best indicator for this being part of a new premium sub-brand.

    But hey, at least it's not just MXM cards.
     
  11. ToTTenTranz

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  12. CarstenS

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    Maybe Vega was just not available in quantities for an up-and-coming graphics cards vendor - as it has not been for much larger and established brands as well in a couple of months in the past? Just guessing of course.
     
  13. CSI PC

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    They have done a nice job tidying up the branding when compared to Fatal1ty Gaming visuals, still the silver-red but G made more sensible and stylish with the new series.
    With Fatal1ty Gaming motherboards not as cool looking (red G is kinda obscure and ridiculous size), new GPU style is nice either way and better way to incorporate the red G.
    Here is Fatal1ty: http://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/Fatal1ty X370 Gaming X/index.asp

    Going forward and once established will be interesting to see if they merge aspects of Fatal1ty Gaming (AMD products) into Phantom Gaming, would kinda make sense to me if the new series is successful.
     
    #173 CSI PC, Mar 29, 2018
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2018
  14. ToTTenTranz

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    Maybe..
     
  15. pharma

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    ASRock Phantom graphics cards seem to be Colorful products?
    http://www.guru3d.com/news-story/asrock-phantom-graphics-cards-seem-to-be-colorful-products.html
     
  16. CSI PC

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    Rumour Asus is changing brand series of AMD ROG/etc products to Arez series.
    ROG-STRIX-RXVEGA64-O8G-GAMING ------> AREZ-STRIX-RXVEGA64-O8G-GAMING
    DUAL-RX580-O8G --------> AREZ-DUAL-RX580-O8G
    etc
    https://videocardz.com/75783/nvidia-gpp-meet-asus-arez-radeon-series

    He speculates they may drop "Asus", and that would be incredibly bad but I cannot see how Asus would sell any of those GPUs without Asus on it; would be a loss finance strategy on their part.

    Putting aside the Asus name drop speculation (due to speculation and not part of the rumour leak for now), my concern was the AMD product losing STRIX GAMING which thankfully they do not, but I appreciate others concern is with regards to losing ROG while others is the whole strategy of this pushed by Nvidia generally, or the overhead/burden it puts onto partners (mentioned it as an issue before).
    Still for now biggest impact and concern beyond GPP generally on actual product IMO is from MSI where there seems to be no FRZR models for AMD and model name heavily restricted, MSI are one of the most generous in giving review models so another possible consumer perception when it comes to review/benchmarks that fall back to Armor gen2 (looks like this may had been created for AMD with the lack of FRZR model but still cannot see it being comparable to a FRZR design).
     
    #176 CSI PC, Apr 6, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2018
  17. Kaotik

    Kaotik Drunk Member
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    Now it's official. https://www.asus.com/Graphics-Cards/AREZ-Series-Products/

    AMD also released a statement:
    https://gaming.radeon.com/en/radeon-a-gamers-choice/

    And there's a "F U GPP" -video now too
     
  18. Grall

    Grall Invisible Member
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    Loved that video, honestly.

    Unusally straight-shooting and direct for being a corporate production. A keyboard that's all "N"; not a coincidence... :p
     
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  19. digitalwanderer

    digitalwanderer Dangerously Mirthful
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    Last campaign Chris Hook worked on. :)
     
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  20. Grall

    Grall Invisible Member
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    "Better to burn out than to fade away!"
     
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