New Dark Sector trailer

london-boy said:
Well, if you go and compare MGS2 to this video, the only thing that you can see is better lighting, higher res textures and that's it. Maybe more polys, but in the enclosed spaces and with max 2 or 3 characters in this video, it's not even that much.
That's a limitation in this style of game though. Yeah, huge field of millions of fully animated characters would look impressive, but are totally out of place for this genre. There's only so much you can add to a dimly lit engine room...

If the only limiting factors are polys and textures (ignoring things like pretty rigid animations and obvious arms-going-through-people that I take to be WIP artefacts) it begs the question what is limiting the poly count and texture size? Is the game just inefficiently written, or are they working to technical restrictions of the target platforms? :?
 
Shifty Geezer said:
what is limiting the poly count and texture size? Is the game just inefficiently written, or are they working to technical restrictions of the target platforms? :?

Whatever it is, my point was that this video is certainly not "proof" of next gen hardware capabilities.

Especially the animation, my god i've seen current gen games with much better animation than this.

Particles, you can count them. Even current gen games fare much better.

Yes, it has (slightly) higher res textures and maybe more polys, but really, next gen will bring a lot more. Fairly certain.
 
The animation could be done better. Just look at the guard dropping down on the floor, really not convincing. Looks great though. :)
 
london-boy said:
Well, if you go and compare MGS2 to this video, the only thing that you can see is better lighting, higher res textures and that's it. Maybe more polys, but in the enclosed spaces and with max 2 or 3 characters in this video, it's not even that much.

Now, go see MGS on PS1 and compare it to MGS2. Now THAT is night and day. MGS2 (which is an old game on PS2, but i chose it cause the environments and atmosphere are kinda similar) and Dark Sector are NOT night and day. Obviously it looks better, but not the difference from PS1 to PS2.

Now, if this is because of diminishing returns in graphics in general or because of something else i don't know, but that's what my eyes see and my brain understands.
The lighting is everything. The polygonal detail may not be much higher than MGS2 (though it's definitely higher), but the normal mapping adds so much more detail that it looks like just as big a leap over MGS2 as MGS2 was over MGS1. I wouldn't dismiss the lighting at all, and the shadows add tremendously to the atmosphere.

PC-Engine said:
Actually they are true ingame. They're just using virtual displacment mapping to give the illusion of an order of magnitude higher polygon counts. Like I said this dark sector video looks cool because of art direction, not because the underlying technology is beyond current generation PC tech. As a matter of fact it looks like it's using a D3 level engine.
UE3 (or at least the titles Epic is working on with it) doesn't use virtual displacement mapping on models. It uses them on worlds and possibly objects, but not the people. They say they use bump mapping, but it may either be normal mapping alone, or normal mapping along with lesser forms of bump mapping.

Have you ever seen Doom 3 or any of the games that run on the engine? besides the much lower polycounts than in Dark Sector, the shadows have hard edges (no penumbra), and there's a limited range which is mostly on the dark end of the spectrum.

My biggest concern with Dark Sector's look is the animation. It's so 1990's CG, and I've seen much better in lots of games.
 
UE3 (or at least the titles Epic is working on with it) doesn't use virtual displacement mapping on models. It uses them on worlds and possibly objects, but not the people. They say they use bump mapping, but it may either be normal mapping alone, or normal mapping along with lesser forms of bump mapping.

Have you ever seen Doom 3 or any of the games that run on the engine? besides the much lower polycounts than in Dark Sector, the shadows have hard edges (no penumbra), and there's a limited range which is mostly on the dark end of the spectrum.

Ok thanks for clearing that up. I guess I assumed virtual displacement mapping was used on the character models too. Regardless my point that the models are not very high in polygons but only seem that way still stands.

I've seen Doom 3 and it looks very similar to this other than the softshadows. The low polygon count in Doom 3 is probably due to the fact it was designed to be able to run on a GF3. My point was that it looks similar to the D3 engine, not that it's using it and the fact dark Sector isn't doing anything unachievable with a PC.
 
Yep looks a lot better. Now I'm impressed. It definitely looks next gen. Anybody know what kind of computer is needed to run this higher resolution video? My PC is only PIII600MHz and it's like a slideshow. :cry:

Anyway I love what I see in this game, and can't wait to buy it when it's released. 8)
 
PC-Engine said:
Yep looks a lot better. Now I'm impressed. It definitely looks next gen. Anybody know what kind of computer is needed to run this higher resolution video? My PC is only PIII600MHz and it's like a slideshow. :cry:

my guess is you are wanting a new computer ;)

seriously, 600mhz? just build yourself a bargain basement jobby and it'll be a lot quicker than what you have now!
 
Yeah, i've only got a P4 Willamette 1.7Ghz and I had to run it through movie maker to lower the bitrate so it wouldn't choke on me. Nice once i got a playable file.
 
That does look very nice actually... and it works fine on my 1.6 GHz Centrino....... :)
 
I cannot see the pics (no registration) but the movie was lacking imo. It did not look bad... but it also did not impress me at all (outside the D3 like shadowing which looked a step up). I see no reason why a game like that A. could not run on current PC hardare and B. Why it could not be ported to current gen consoles with some reduction in quality (e.g. like the D3 port).

The shadows looked good, if not too "harsh" and firm. The edges were very smooth, but they had a very artificial feel to them. They fit the theme ala D3, but would want to see more to see if the engine forces a very restricted corridore environment. If the game only has dark space ship environments, well, I think that can be done well on current consoles to a degree. The lighting appeared Good and Bad. On the one hand it seemed to be lively, but I did not see many effects like sub surface scattering or HDR. Basically it looked like something the D3 engine could do.

There also seemed to be a lack of color and the character faces looked boring.

What really got me dissappointed was the action they showed. The animation was very poor--and when you consider that is probably not even what we will see in game it is scarier. The movie was obviously showing advantageous angles, which in real games you rarely get. If they were spotting the camera there was no real reason why the animation would not look slick unless it is not very good. Unfortunately I feel animation is often ignored :(

The short footage seemed very lifeless to me. The pros were how the suits animated to close the face shield and such, but there seemed to be very little of this nature. No railings broke, no suits dented when hit, natta.

What next gen means to me is not just prettier shadows, better lighting, and higher res textures. It means larger words, more props, better AI, physics, and INTERACTIVE worlds.

While the demo movie looked pretty, it just looked like a current gen game with slightly better graphics. My PC can do that. If that is what Sony/MS/Nintendo offer next gen I might as well stay with my PC.


As for the gameplay, it looks like a SC/Halo/MGS type game. If it plays well who cares how it looks? I think those games are very tricky to pull off well, so if the gameplay is good and uses the tech they have then Two Thumbs Up!

I may not be impressed with how it looks, but then again looks are only a means to convey a story and drive gameplay for me. As long as the graphics do not hinder the gameplay I do not care. If DE can build a game that fits well within their engine that cool. But on graphics alone I am not impressed--but then again it was not bad.
 
May 9, 2005 - One year ago, the Canadian independent development team Digital Extremes revealed the very first look at the next generation with a quick, gorgeous game called Dark Sector. One year later, a brand new video has appeared giving gamers a new taste of what the next-generation holds, and it's much prettier and impressive than before.


The two-minute trailer is not a pre-rendered movie. It's officially in-game footage. The trailer shows off in-game graphics, physics, sound, and gameplay, and it displays several key hallmarks we'd all hoped to see in next-generation games.

For example, the enemy guard shows off effective, believable facial expressions. The polygon count on each character is incredibly high, and the texture work is gorgeous. The characters move with smooth motion, and the special effects, from the particles, smoke, and fire, are all top-quality.

This morning we spoke with James Schmalz, creative director at Digital Extremes, to get the first inside look at Dark Sector. (Believe it or not, Schmalz's game has yet to be signed by a publisher.) What is the game all about? What can that cool suit do? What's the story, the game type? What can the next-generation of graphics do? Schmalz gives us specific technical details about next-generation graphics and gameplay styles. Read our interview for the first, exclusive details on Dark Sector.

IGN: What kind of game is Dark Sector? Does it break old genre stereotypes -- blending action, adventure, or RPG elements -- and if so, how?

James Schmalz: Dark Sector blends finesse and brutality into a fast-action game. It mixes first-person shooter control schemes with a third-person perspective. The perspective choice is an obvious one because of our twist on the genre: your suit can 'morph.' This morphing is central to creating the new possibilities for our combative and non-combative game mechanics.



IGN: What kind of stealth aspects can we expect in Dark Sector?

James: It's important to note that Dark Sector is going to have elements of 'fast stealth,' not slow and creeping stealth -- but action-oriented, fast-killing-from-the-shadows type stealth. We emphasize power and control over the situation, not reluctance and trepidation.

IGN: Who is the lead character? What is his backstory? And what are some of his goals in the game?

James: The main character is Hayden Tenno. We can't reveal too much about him, except to say he is very unique. He has more in common with Wolverine than Sam Fisher, if that helps.

IGN: What is going on in the video you've shown us today? The lead character lays down an explosive to blow up some evil military ship, but why?

James: The video is a 'proof of concept' from a year-old technology demo. It shows off the main character, his suit, and a few of the enemies you will encounter. It's evolved considerably in a year, but we've been silent for a long time.


IGN: He wears a remarkably powerful suit. What is his relationship to it? And what kind of things can it do?

James: What you have seen is nothing compared to what the suit can actually do. It's one of the big mysteries of the game and is our key differentiating element. As you progress, you learn more about what it can do. Separating the suit from the man is also kind of a gray area...

IGN: What are some of the artistic and thematic inspirations for the game?

James: There are definitely comic/movie inspirations such as X-Men 2, Iron Man and the original Batman. The player will be a powerful outsider, almost like a super hero. Set in a world that, at first glance, appears much like our own.

IGN: What kind of visual effects do you expect to reap from this next generation of games? What kinds of effects are you using in Dark Sector that you couldn't use in the previous generation of consoles?

James: The next generation visuals are going to be amazing. You cannot fully appreciate Dark Sector unless it's running in true high resolution. Our technology has come a long way since that video was created. We are also still a long way from finishing Dark Sector, so we still have a lot of technology to create and add to the game. So, if you like what you see now, you will love what you see when we show it off next.

As for what effects we are using now that we couldn't before... well, I like to describe it best like this: consumer computing will inevitably be multi-processor configurations. Soon enough dual cores will be the standard in new PCs. So with a single processor system we'd allocate 15-20% to AI, perhaps double that to physics. Well, imagine now that you could allocate an entire processor to one of those tasks? That is a massive increase in performance. Just think of the physics or AI or particle effects you could create with a fast dedicated CPU. That gives developers a huge amount of freedom to explore new ideas. Developers will have more flexibility than ever.


IGN: Is there a multiplayer aspect to Dark Sector? What kinds of online gaming can we expect?

James: There is a multiplayer component. We can't go in to details in this area, but we can say we are doing multiplayer and it's going to be something very new and exciting.

IGN: Since you first showed Dark Sector as a sneak peak last year, what has changed about the game, and show is different in the video?

James: What you see is just an extended version of that initial sneak peak. But a lot has changed with the game itself. But these are things we can't talk in depth on. Let's just say the game has really grown in the year since this demo was made.

IGN: Thanks for your time. We appreciate it, and good luck on the game. And oh yeah! Make sure to watch the video trailer in our media section.

Source

So this video is from an early build last year. I hope they show an updated demo on E3.

And I was joking about Demonik. I thought it was unimpressive.

- Z
 
man i cant believe some people are not impressed at all. it looks really good to me. me thinks some people expect Pixar level graphics this gen. i use this trailer as an average and thats what gets me excited because i know there will be better.
 
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