Microsoft Surface tablets

Discussion in 'Mobile Devices and SoCs' started by DSC, Jun 19, 2012.

Tags:
  1. Mize

    Mize 3dfx Fan
    Moderator Legend Veteran

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2002
    Messages:
    5,073
    Likes Received:
    1,137
    Location:
    Cincinnati, Ohio USA
    IMHO a tablet around the home/office/gym needs ~10 hrs not to be annoying with recharging.

    (side note - this thing is likely too thick (with KB) for the elliptical I use every morning at the gym - my iPad2 fits but not my TouchPad)

    A laptop is fine in the 5-6 hour range as you can close it and sleep it when you're not actively working.
     
  2. wco81

    Legend

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2004
    Messages:
    6,265
    Likes Received:
    296
    Location:
    West Coast
    But how well will it run "professional" applications?

    Some people have said they want to run things like Photoshop, CAD and IDE on it. Will it have the RAM to run these applications well?

    I think you can get Sandy Bridge laptops with 8 GB of RAM for $700 now? No SSD and obviously very heavy but for "heavy" applications, more traditional laptops with the ability to expand RAM and storage may be better options.
     
  3. Andrew Lauritzen

    Moderator Veteran

    Joined:
    May 21, 2004
    Messages:
    2,526
    Likes Received:
    454
    Location:
    British Columbia, Canada
    That's nonsense. I get 6 hours of browsing and light use easily. Not sure what's up with the "reviews" or what they're running, but 3.5 isn't even in the right ballpark.

    And btw Photoshop runs beautifully on it - wacom digitizer w/ pressure sensitivity is amazing.
     
  4. Mize

    Mize 3dfx Fan
    Moderator Legend Veteran

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2002
    Messages:
    5,073
    Likes Received:
    1,137
    Location:
    Cincinnati, Ohio USA
    Engadget got 3:33 on the Slate 7 in both laptop and tablet battery tests.
     
  5. sebbbi

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2007
    Messages:
    2,924
    Likes Received:
    5,293
    Location:
    Helsinki, Finland
    It has a fast Sandy Bridge CPU (four threads, turbo clock up to 2.3 GHz), fast 128 GB SSD, four gigabytes of DDR3-1333 and because it's running on Windows, it has full support for virtual memory as well (fast on SSD). I have 64 bit Windows 7 installed on mine (it's actually a work device, not my own). It's perfect for Photoshop. It has a 1024 level pressure sensitive Wacom digitizer after all. You can't get a better portable device for painting and image editing.

    It beats my quad core desktop PC in CPU benchmarks. I have a Core 2 Quad Q6600, Intel SSD and fastest memory chips you could buy at that time. I agree that my home computer getting pretty old, but it's nice to see a tablet beating it in benchmarks :)
    Yeah, 6 hours sounds pretty much right. It seems that we are the only ones here with actual experience of the device.
    That's actually what I was referring to in my last post. It was ran using Internet Explorer (the default browser). Install a decent browser to it, and you should see better battery life. And battery stress tests are not real life usage scenarios. Macbook Air and Ultrabooks also fare pretty badly in battery stress testing because Intel's chips are able to produce very good peak performance. In real life scenarios however a faster CPU finishes the job quicker, and gets to idle much faster than a slower one. This saves a lot of power, and makes the device feel really responsive. Battery stress test result scores should always be multiplied by the amount of work done (for example pages opened). That gives you a much more realistic figure.

    Do you still consider that 3:33 result bad if the Intel based device (be it Slate, Macbook Air or an Ultrabook) opened 10 times more web pages during that period that iPad did?
     
    #85 sebbbi, Jun 21, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 21, 2012
  6. Jubei

    Regular

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2011
    Messages:
    494
    Likes Received:
    88
    Obiously what defines usage will vary depending on the person. But you can check out amazon and peoples reviews and you will find plenty of people mentioning getting 3-4 hours of usage

    In comparison here is an iPad playing 3D games for 12 hours straight

    http://youtu.be/SH3RP2gdtTY

    Obviously X86 tablets do have a market but its a very small one that caters to professionals that need a portable touchscreen with high performance. The average consumer however does not need this. Thats why tablets did not go mainstream until the iPad. Its popularity is not just because it had a touch centric OS but also because its truly portable because of its insane battery life.

    So again.. in terms of battery life.. Surface RT and iPad is not even in the same league. But they also cater to two different markets
     
  7. Mize

    Mize 3dfx Fan
    Moderator Legend Veteran

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2002
    Messages:
    5,073
    Likes Received:
    1,137
    Location:
    Cincinnati, Ohio USA
    Found a PCMag or someother review that gave it 5:37...not too shabby. They hated the on-screen keyboard though and the lack of stylus storage.
     
  8. sebbbi

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2007
    Messages:
    2,924
    Likes Received:
    5,293
    Location:
    Helsinki, Finland
    I agree, the on-screen keyboard on Windows 7 sucks. On screen keyboard and the overall touch screen usage is much better in Windows 8 Release Preview. You can install it just like you install any OS to a PC computer (it's a full PC computer after all). Of course you can alternatively install Linux or even turn it to a hackintosh if you feel experimental :)

    Slot in pen (like in Galaxy Note ja Nintendo DS) would also be high in my wish list for the Ivy Bridge version. That's true... pens are always missing, no matter what type of pen or how many, somehow our office always devours them :D

    I am interested to see how MS Surface handles the pen problem. A simple magnet on side isn't going to be enough for transportation. It's going to fall off easily.
     
  9. elroy

    Regular

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2003
    Messages:
    269
    Likes Received:
    1
    Wouldn't Surface RT and iPad be in the same league? I assume it's the higher end Surface running Win 8 Pro that will have a shorter battery life.
     
  10. Andrew Lauritzen

    Moderator Veteran

    Joined:
    May 21, 2004
    Messages:
    2,526
    Likes Received:
    454
    Location:
    British Columbia, Canada
    Yup as of the Win8 RC and a few driver updates from Samsung, I'm happily using Win8 exclusively on it now. And yes, the Win7 on-screen keyboard sucks almost to the level where it's more productive to just use handwriting :) Win8 is similar to android/IOS.

    But hey, all onscreen-keyboards suck IMHO :)

    Totally agreed. Sounds like experience with this product has put us pretty much on the same page :)
     
  11. liolio

    liolio Aquoiboniste
    Legend

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2005
    Messages:
    5,724
    Likes Received:
    194
    Location:
    Stateless
    I've watched the presentation, i'm sold.
    I can see the device.delivers.to.the.professional.especially what ipads did not.
     
  12. Davros

    Legend

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2004
    Messages:
    15,478
    Likes Received:
    2,663
    Should'nt the thread title be "Microsoft Tablets Surface" ;)
     
  13. DavidC

    Regular

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2006
    Messages:
    347
    Likes Received:
    24
    They are pretty close if you normalize it in terms of battery capacity. Of course the #1 rule in benchmarking is to make it close as possible so.

    http://www.laptopmag.com/review/tablets/samsung-series-7-slate-pc.aspx
    http://www.laptopmag.com/review/laptops/apple-macbook-air-11-inch-2011.aspx

    Slate 7: 5:49(349 minutes)
    Macbook Air 2011 11-inch: 4:46(286 minutes)

    That's 22% difference in battery life, and it corresponds exactly to the battery capacity.
     
    #93 DavidC, Jun 22, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 22, 2012
  14. ltcommander.data

    Regular

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2010
    Messages:
    614
    Likes Received:
    11
    http://www.winsupersite.com/article...et-microsoft-takes-apple-mimics-google-143481

    I just noticed this from Paul Thurrott. It's been previously reported that no one was allowed hands-on time with a working, connected smart cover keyboard so there's no way to objectively tell how good it is. But Thurrott reports that no one was even able to touch a working Surface tablet at all. Looking back at the supposed "Hand-on" previews from various sites it does appear that the working Surface tablets are either on a table and viewed from afar or in the hands of Microsoft demo staff and the ones reporters got to touch were non-functional. Thurrott calls it vaporware, and while I don't doubt Surface will be released, if they are still at the prototype stage and don't have production samples for reporters to try, I wonder how much of what they presented will turn out to be more vision than achievable in the actual shipping product? What sunk the Touchpad, Xoom, and Playbook were rushed releases with incomplete features and buggy software. Hopefully, Microsoft takes its time to have a polished release so their first tablet leaves a good first impression otherwise that may leave consumers wary not only of future Microsoft tablets, but the Windows 8 tablet ecosystem in general.
     
  15. eastmen

    Legend Subscriber

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2008
    Messages:
    10,040
    Likes Received:
    1,541
    Well A) He wasn't at the event and B) The RT has what 4-5 months till release and the PRO 8 months to release. No one has actualy used final wii u consoles and all hands on were done with prototypes but i'm sure it will launch just fine in the fall .
     
  16. Mintmaster

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2002
    Messages:
    3,897
    Likes Received:
    87
    I think Apple really missed the mark in shunning the stylus. Sure, touch-only is better than stylus-only, but touch+stylus is freaking awesome.

    I suspect that they wanted to create a new app ecosystem that they could dominate, and touch-only forced old apps to become obsolete. A stylus is the best mobile substitute for a mouse, and it allows smartphones/tablets to interact with any legacy application.

    With increasing mobile display and computing abilities, however, lack of a stylus is really going to start becoming a bottleneck. There are some solid biological reasons that we've used styli for thousands of years, and on top of that they don't block the vision of what you're touching/selecting like fingers do.

    IMO, the Galaxy Note is the most revolutionary smartphone since the original iPhone. It's not only more portable than a tablet, but is more useful thanks to the well integrated stylus. I'm just waiting for the T-Mobile version to come out so that I don't get raped for $500 extra per year from AT&T or Verizon. Between a device like that and a Win8 tablet that can truly replace a notebook (via keyboard cover and stylus), I think ARM tablets are completely obsolete. They have 1-2 years left where they'll have a meaningful price and battery-life advantage, and after that they're pretty much done.
     
  17. RudeCurve

    Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2008
    Messages:
    2,831
    Likes Received:
    0
  18. Andrew Lauritzen

    Moderator Veteran

    Joined:
    May 21, 2004
    Messages:
    2,526
    Likes Received:
    454
    Location:
    British Columbia, Canada
  19. Mintmaster

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2002
    Messages:
    3,897
    Likes Received:
    87
    "Who wants a stylus? You have to get ‘em, put ‘em away, you lose ‘em. Yech! Nobody wants a stylus. So let’s not use a stylus."
    "If you see a stylus, they blew it."


    Apple didn't want anyone to use a stylus. The input with an aftermarket stylus is imprecise, lacks usable pressure sensitivity, and doesn't have a button on it.
     
  20. dlm

    dlm
    Regular

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2006
    Messages:
    349
    Likes Received:
    1
    I assume this is the case as well. If the phone doesn't come with a stylus, it strongly disincents app authors from writing apps that don't work well with touch.

    I think for a phone, that's fairly sound reasoning. The more your phone does, the more confusing it starts to get and the worse it becomes at its core job. I've always found this to be my biggest frustration with Android. I don't want to spend hours researching what tools make the phone do what I want, I want it to work. I don't consider my phone to be a tiny PC, and I don't want it to be one. The simple, "optimized for touch" approach is great for my particular needs.

    But with a tablet... I'll just say that as an avoid OneNote user, a tablet that doesn't work well with a stylus is basically dead to me. And that's of course not even touching the potential of tablets as a replacement for standalone WACOM devices. The fact that a tablet potentially gives you a simple form factor that you can just hook up some HID's to and have all of these different possibilities (touch+keyboard, touch+stylus, keyboard+stylus, mouse+keyboard, etc) is exciting, and it's unfortunate to throw away stylus input when it's basically tailor made for the form factor.
     
Loading...

Share This Page

  • About Us

    Beyond3D has been around for over a decade and prides itself on being the best place on the web for in-depth, technically-driven discussion and analysis of 3D graphics hardware. If you love pixels and transistors, you've come to the right place!

    Beyond3D is proudly published by GPU Tools Ltd.
Loading...