Lol, wtf is this description. You could describe TLOU2 as a female survivalist shooting and sneaking through a post apocalyptic world and solving puzzles. That's also pretty common.
Market/business performance of Senua's Saga: Hellblade 2 *spawn
- Thread starter XboxKING
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Lol, wtf is this description. You could describe TLOU2 as a female survivalist shooting and sneaking through a post apocalyptic world and solving puzzles. That's also pretty common.
You missed the point. Of course you can. Yes it IS common as a game. My point was that "niche" themes, which TLOU2 had in abundance do not define whether a game is "niche" in itself. And you are a perfect example (assuming you played it and you know what I am talking about). And it is the same for HB2
cheapchips
Veteran
It's not just direct hours though. If passive subscribers return, play HB2 and then explore other stuff, that's success too. They'll have metrics for all the sort of thing.
The reason why this isn't lighting up the charts is because ninja theory did what they wanted, and that is an extreme focus on narrative while ignoring everything else. And I respect that. But at the same time, this is a videogame sequel, and good sequels in this medium usually improve gameplay, structure, design.
Why isn't the swordfighting more in depth and mechanically complex? It's even simpler than the first.
Why are there no gameplay bossfights? Big monsters that at least look visually cool like in the first. Now they are just setpieces.
Not improving upon those aspects, but even regressing. This is how you destroy interest.
Why isn't the swordfighting more in depth and mechanically complex? It's even simpler than the first.
Why are there no gameplay bossfights? Big monsters that at least look visually cool like in the first. Now they are just setpieces.
Not improving upon those aspects, but even regressing. This is how you destroy interest.
What’s the saying: “if my grandmother had wheels she would be a bike”.
TLOU2 and HB2 couldn’t be further apart even though both of them deal with heavier subject matter and have heroines as the MC.
HB2 has been universally described as a walking simulator. 6 hours of it. No bosses, repetitive and simplistic combat, the list goes on.
From what I've seen of skimming through HB2 streams it actually reminds me more of Dragon's Lair in terms of a 100% presentation-focused game. Looking at the length of various playthroughs on youtube they all seem to be +/- a few minutes of each other, so I can only assume there's virtually zero branching paths, exploration, sight-seeing, or decision making offered to the player. I haven't played TLOU2, but (again, from watching brief clips) I'd imagine there's enough player agency in those games to result in different gameplay being experienced from one player to the next. Like if you were watching someone else play TLOU2, you'd feel like you're missing out on something by not being the one to hold the controller, but for HB2 I really don't get that impression at all.
I'm super skeptical that there's going to be some yet-untapped audience of gamers out there that had yet to subscribe to gamepass that are now going to finally signup to give HB2 a whirl. Surely by now anyone that would care to try gamepass has tried it and chosen to remain subscribed or cancel. Even if there were some ultra-casual gameplay-free gamer demographic, it's not like gamepass is going to be able to offer them a whole bunch more games similar to HB2 to keep them engaged.
I'm super skeptical that there's going to be some yet-untapped audience of gamers out there that had yet to subscribe to gamepass that are now going to finally signup to give HB2 a whirl. Surely by now anyone that would care to try gamepass has tried it and chosen to remain subscribed or cancel. Even if there were some ultra-casual gameplay-free gamer demographic, it's not like gamepass is going to be able to offer them a whole bunch more games similar to HB2 to keep them engaged.
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You forgot about the walking.
Didn't say they are the same game. The point is outside of their themes they are just like other games.
HellBlade isn't the only game described as a walking simulator. Now your argument isn't even about the theme of "psychosis". Now you talk about size, repetition and amount of content which are generic game design fundamentals.
Just because there are other games like Hellblade, so much so that a genre exists, does not mean that it's not a niche title. Yes, there are other games that are walking simulators. And those games, while popular with a minority of gamers, often reach a level of critical acclaim. But in the medium as it exists today, walking simulators are a niche genre.
What Remains of Edith Finch is a walking sim that is fairly high rated on Metacritic - higher than HB2 in fact. WROEF was Eurogamers #2 game in 2017 (Hellblade 1 was #9 that year), was in Game Radar's top 5 games that year at #5, and won best narrative at The Game Awards. It's regarded as one of the best games in the genre. To my knowledge WROEF never charted on any top sales charts. It wasn't in the best selling games of April or May 2017 (it released in April). It certainly never entered any any year end sales lists. Yet it's considered a success in the genre, because the genre is a niche genre, full of niche games. WROEF also had a max Steam concurrent player number of 564 players, Hellblade 2 peaked at 3982, with a 24 hour peak higher than WROEF's lifetime. People are looking at HB2's steam numbers and declaring it a failure or disappointment, but it's numbers are well above on of the best games in the genre - A game that beat the original Hellblade in many best of lists the year they both released.
There are many games that got the "walking simulator" label and werent categorized as "niche". But that's a pointless discussion at this point.
As I already said, my argument was never about Hellblade 2 being a disappointment. My argument was that Hellblade 2 is great game and the business model of Gamepass may potentially be sabotaging the game's market performance and finances.
That's the thing. HB2 as a game may have enough appeal to be profitable, but (assuming Marketing isn't also a culprit but it could since I barely saw enough push from MS) giving it away for free or the option to finish it with just $16 through a monthly Gamepass subscription ( since you can finish it in one sitting), it likely hinders the financial success of the project, unless it brings exponential Gamepass growth, which I am doubtful.
cheapchips
Veteran
Yes. That's a month of subs they otherwise wouldn't have received. You're a F- grade customer, but a customer none the less.
What if the other games are… starfield and call of duty 2024?
They would have gotten 150 euro from me at least but now they get 10 times less.
Also I am telling coworkers that play single player only not to waste any money and instead ‘hire’ the game.
With Sensua, to be honest, I don’t even think the game is worth 1 month subscribing which is why I am saving up several games in order not be too bummed should i not finish the game
cheapchips
Veteran
What matters is where it falls in balance. Do more people subscribe long term than dip in for a 'rental'. We don't know the answer to that.
I think the history of the franchise, along with Microsoft's recent publishing history, make me believe that HB2 will eventually get released on Playstation, and perhaps gets a physical release. The original Hellblade launched first on Playstation 4 and PC as a digital only release, and was later ported to Xbox and Switch with physical copies made for Xbox One and PS4. Even if it doesn't make a profit in it's initial run, I believe it will eventually with a multiplatform release.
well, the game is boring. But it's a perfect game for gamepass. I am slowly completing it, but I'd never buy it if it wasn't on gamepass. I am going to complete the game that's for sure, to see the rest of the graphics and follow the story.
ZebMacahan
Newcomer
How do you know its not an SJW issue? I can only speak for myself but that was the reason I didnt buy it, and I loved the first game and was really hyped about part 2 until the leaks. I did borrow it and played thru it later, but I would be much more likely to spend money on the part 1 remake than any version of part 2.
You're comparing a proper lower budget indie game with something that has been held up by MS as a major Xbox platform release. And there were simply expectations that coming into the MS umbrella would have given Ninja Theory greater resources to bump up the ambitions of their games, not just do more of the same. People were expecting something more like a full scale AAA game, not just another 'niche, short walking sim' sort of AA game.
And expectations are primarily how we define something as a success/failure. Bragging about a major Xbox release having more concurrent players than some small indie game that was more clearly identifiable as a niche(walking sim) within a niche(indie game) is a bit like bragging that you can beat a 4 year old at chess. It would be shocking if you couldn't.
Truth is, most people were expecting more from Hellblade 2. You can complain about the injustice of this or that people weren't being reasonable but what were Xbox's expectations? Are they really happy with this game that took seven years to make having the kind of player counts/sales it is? I imagine probably not.